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griffrat
Commander
3507 Posts
    
 | | 08/04/2006 2:40 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
....I'm leaving open the chance that 4E could be so much better than 3.5 that it makes sense to switch yet again. I can still see huge problem areas in the game that could be reworked to significantly improve things.
However, I can also see a big chance that they'll fail to fix the things I want to see fixed. Recently, in D&D and DDM, I've seen some pretty big failures with regards to the understanding of the math and statistics that power the game. In a sense, I've seen a return to the 1E approach of tossing out numbers that feel right. If 4E follows this trend, and fails to provide statistically improved models for combat, spellcasting, character generation/advancement, etc..., it could be a disaster.
...But, I want to see something about 4E before I let these fears overrun me.
Granted, these are the main points that I will think about holding my breath on. But the thing is are the things that need fixing enough to warrant an entire edition? To me that is the crux of the problem.
The things that need fixing are minor at best. Maybe not the polymorph jazz. But overall it is a pretty good wheel for my ride...no need, at this point in time, to re-invent the wheel...IMHO
But I will take a look at the things to come when they come.... | |
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zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 08/04/2006 2:46 PM |
| As long as the minis keep coming to satiate my addiction hobby needs, I'm cool. Just because they produce it, doesn't mean I'm obliged to buy it [:D] | |
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Rakhamon
Warrior
319 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 2:49 PM |
| WotC has had it's ups and downs while they've had the D&D license. A lot of products have been (in my opinion) substandard, and not worth my while. Of the ten or so D&D 3.X products I -have- bought, I wish I hadn't gotten some of them at all.
Hasbro seem to be running the D&D brand with the same kind of zeal they run a toy brand, or Magic. They want to make -lots- of money, and keep the rpg'ers buying new stuff all the time. This is a logical fallacy, since RPG's are all about doing stuff with your imagination. Thus, you really only need a PHB, a DMG and a MM to rp. All the rest is fluff. Hasbro don't seem to understand this, so I can understand them wanting to sell the rpg side of it off.
Ironically, during the latest years I've purchased a lot more 1st and 2nd edition material, which I enjoy a lot more. Some writing is just timeless, and beyond editions. So even when the new edition comes I'll still enjoy and use my 3.X books. :)
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Tasmanian_tiger
Warrior
300 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 3:06 PM |
| Oh..no.. gah.
Well, first of all, like some said before, roleplaying is and still remains the biggest part of my D&D rp group. In fact moving from one mini battle to another would sorely bore them. (I know from experience.) While I like a battle now and then, I must admit I also play D&D for the roleplaying, not the minis. Assuming the 4e game would orient more to D&D mini battles.
Secondly, the biggest problem I have with new editions, is when I get new players. They ask me which book to buy and often, here (Belgium) you can only find the latest edition. Right now, I'm still working with 3.0. myself, though my group mostly has 3.5. If I get new players after the 4e release, the same thing will happen as when I was still playing the 2.0 and 3.0 was (only this edition) in the stores. Confusion.. problably ending in me and the oldies switching to a newer edition. Grrr.. no..
Plus, I just took a dungeon subscription (this year). I would hate it if it changed to 4.0 edition the coming years. (Again, I had the same thing happening when I was still playing the 2.0 and my new players could only buy 3.0. I tried converting my books/adventures.. but in the end I just switched too.)
I wonder if I should buy 3.5 while it's still in stores here. Some minor differences are getting annoying.. | |
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ehren37
Sergeant
642 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 3:35 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by kyrin
quote:
Originally posted by ehren37
quote:
Originally posted by yack
Harneloot is correct... alot of us are old time players or players that are new that heard about the classics Why don't they convert theses too 3.5 too make money. I would be sold right a way!
3.5 Undermountain I'm there!
Because those adventures honestly werent that good.
An adventure is only as good as the DM that runs it, and the players that play in it. If the old adventures are treated for what they are -- raw material to stimulate the DM's imagination and challenge the players -- then they are excellent. If a DM just runs them exactly as they were written, well, lazy DMs rarely produce anything of quality.
Hint: Even the uber-l33t "modern" adventures follow this rule as well.
I say update the old adventures to 3.5. For my part, it'll save me the bother of converting stats. Naturally they will sell by the 20% Rule (only 1 in 5 will buy it, i.e. the DM) but they will likely sell well under those parameters. So update and upgrade... and then I'll buy it and do whatever I darn well please with it.
JIM
aka kyrin
Its not lazy DM'ing, its lazy writing. The absence of substance is not substance. And that still doesnt address the piss poor layout of quite a few of the old maps (ie, slavers), where if you think about it, the creatures could rarely coexist in a sensible fashion. Feel free to write the old crap a free pass because its old though.
If all they did was go through and update the stats, the adventures would still suck as written, without considerable work on the DM's part. If the DM is pouring that much effort into a sinknig ship, why not do the minor work of opening the MM to the correct page. For the effort to be worthy, they'd need to go through and change up some things. Which is what they appear to be doing. Expedition to Castle Ravenloft will surely be more than a 3.5 version of Ravenloft, theres a new demonweb pits, etc. But just updating the stats is like putting lipstick on a pig. And since we've played through many of these adventures, whats the point? That makes it a pig you've made out with already... | |
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Thenameless
Warlord
12474 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/04/2006 3:53 PM |
| | I wonder if a switch to 4e would orphan the 3.5e minis (skirmish and/or RPG), or if they will find a way to keep them viable. I suppose skirmish should not be a problem unless there is a total change in attack/spell/HP/save mechanics. I guess for the RPG side of things, the DM can just use the new books for monster stats. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
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Beware of Kobold
Sneak
89 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 3:55 PM |
| Oh my god... when i read the words "smaller bundles" i just had a horrific vision of the future of DnD. If my prophetic powers are real, DnD is going to become...
A COLLECTIBLE CARD GAME.
imagine this. In order to make your character you will randomized need cards purchased in packs. You will ask your friend if he will trade his "Alignment: Chaotic Neutral" for your "Feat: Diehard". Your Character will be 10 cards that you keep in your hand each with the rules for that particular aspect of your character printed on it. You will need to own cards for any magic items you want your character to have. There will be expansions based on fighting classes, arcane classes, divine classes, etc.
The horror... the horror | |
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Gene
Skirmisher
9 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 3:59 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Beware of Kobold
Oh my god... when i read the words "smaller bundles" i just had a horrific vision of the future of DnD. If my prophetic powers are real, DnD is going to become...
A COLLECTIBLE CARD GAME.
imagine this. In order to make your character you will need cards purchased in packs. You will ask your friend if he will trade his "Alignment: Chaotic Neutral" for your "Feat: Diehard". Your Character will be 10 cards that you keep in your hand each with the rules for that particular aspect of your character printed on it. You will need to own cards for any magic items you want your character to have.
The horror... the horror
If that happens I will pray to the gods every night that WoTC goes under. That would be the single stupidest thing they could do.
As for 4th edition. It took me a good 5 years to convert over to 3.5 and I doubt I'll switch over to 4th unless WoTC starts selling books for $10 a pop.
-Gene | |
Chaotic Good - Governments should be afraid of their people.
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PaSquall
Underboss
1399 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 4:04 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thailfi
I still play 1e/2e so the impending doom of 4e hardly means anything to me.
He he, I was going to say exactly the same thing. The flamewar is going to be especially fun to watch this time, as a 100% spectator...
A new generation of oldschoolers is on the way... | |
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Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 08/04/2006 4:09 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thenameless
I wonder if a switch to 4e would orphan the 3.5e minis (skirmish and/or RPG), or if they will find a way to keep them viable. I suppose skirmish should not be a problem unless there is a total change in attack/spell/HP/save mechanics. I guess for the RPG side of things, the DM can just use the new books for monster stats.
If I had to guess. I would say the one thing that will NOT change when 3rd editon swiches to 4th editon..it would be the size catagories and the facing of the miniatures (Large are 2x2, Huge is 3x3 ect).
If they tell us that not only are our books outdated...but so are our MINIS....I shutter to think how many pitchforks and torches would march on WotC headquarters [:)] | |
Champion of the Skulk
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griffrat
Commander
3507 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 4:13 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Count Dooku
If they tell us that not only are our books outdated...but so are our MINIS....I shutter to think how many pitchforks and torches would march on WotC headquarters [:)]
I'll bring a lighter...and some marshallows...[0] Just kidding...[:D] unless you want hot dogs
no seriously. The minis are always going to have an intrinsic value for what you use them for now; a 3d marker. So the minis other than skirmish stats and use (dunno not a skirmish guy) minis will always be minis.... | |
Ambassador of FUN!!! | |
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SYB
Warrior
328 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 4:25 PM |
| Ironically, I have seen every one of these concerns and comments before. The last time I saw people saying these things was just before 2nd edition was phased out and 3.0 was introduced.
I remember countless people saying that they had a library of 2nd edition products, that they were invested in 2nd edition, that 2nd edition was a good game and was "good enough", and that they would never buy a 3rd edition product. Almost every last one of those people currently plays 3.0/3.5 (most the latter).
Short version: If they sell it, most of us will buy it.
-SYB | |
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| Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7695 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 4:48 PM |
| | I only switched over the 3.5 recently. I resisted for quite a long time as well. So, 4.0 will be a long wait again before I switch over. If I do. | |
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Rakhamon
Warrior
319 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 4:58 PM |
| I never even got the 3.5 books outside the Monster Manual...
Oh, I didn't consider the mini question. Stat cards will most likely be rendered unusuable after the change. In a perfect world WotC would make new stat cards you could get for the old minis, but look at the Chainmail equivalent cards... So possibly they'll start re-doing it from the start. | |
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kyrin
Commander
3171 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 5:18 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ehren37
But just updating the stats is like putting lipstick on a pig. And since we've played through many of these adventures, whats the point? That makes it a pig you've made out with already...
What a ludicrous statement. With the incredible variety of possibilities in D&D, you could play for... oh, lemme just pick a number out of a hat totally at random... twenty-five years, incorporating the same adventures into various campaigns, and it would be completely different every time.That's the nature of the game. Gee, if someday I run my guys through Against the Giants now (it'll be awhile, since that's an Epic campaign in 3.5) it would be exactly the same as when I ran my buds in high school through it back in '81. Yeah, right. No point in doing it, then.
How can people be as experienced at this game as they claim to be and have totally missed out on this essential aspect of it? Reminds me of the scene from a Fish Called Wanda:
"I'm a ape? Do apes read Nietzche?"
"Yes they do, Otto, they just don't understand it."
Then again, I guess if you don't understand how those original modules worked way back when, you need a lot of things explained.
In a vain attempt to get back on topic, my current feeling is to avoid 4th Ed when it comes out. With all the stuff I have for 3.5, I've got enough stuff to last me a lifetime. Then again, I'm honest enough with myself to acknowledge the possibility that I'll get sucked in by something new and shiny. [:D] We'll see.
JIM
aka kyrin | |
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lantern314
Sergeant
684 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 5:21 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Beware of Kobold
Oh my god... when i read the words "smaller bundles" i just had a horrific vision of the future of DnD. If my prophetic powers are real, DnD is going to become...
A COLLECTIBLE CARD GAME.
Let me introduce you to my friends the SAGA system, and Everway. I love card based mechanics, esp. the Marvel SAGA system. There already is a CCG based RPG. I think its called Dragonstorm. I'm signed up for an event at GenCon. | |
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Korhal_IV
Sergeant
852 Posts
| | 08/04/2006 5:22 PM |
| Okay, guys, how many of you run a business? Seriously?
If D&D is not making money, there are steps they can take BEFORE 4e or before selling off the RPG division:
1) Fire people. If a team of 30 developers is not turning a profit, maybe a team of 20 can.
2) Downgrade quality. If hardcovers aren't turning a profit, softcovers can. If a 300-page book isn't turning a profit, a 150-page book can. If a color book isn't turning a profit, a black-and-white one can. Remember 3e's splatbooks? Softcover, 100-pages, black and white. They can go back to that business model if they need to.
3) Raise prices. If a $30 book isn't turning a profit, a $35 one will.
We're seeing (according to some reports) dimished page counts in recent WotC books, but I'd like to see that verified. Tome of Battle is 180 pages, but Tome of Magic, which preceded it, is 224. I'm not sure that's a consistent trend.
I can't believe that the game developers wouldn't start urging a return to 3e book formats instead of a 4e, or that WotC's accountants wouldn't advocate a small price increase instead of red-lining sales on all previous products (Would any of us really notice or care if our $30 sourcebooks went to $32? With 3 million D&D gamers in the USA alone, even if only one in 100 buys it, that's $600,000 on top of what they're already making!).
4E's going to show up eventually, sure. But if we get it in 2008, I wouldn't bitch too hard. And if it's showing up in 2008, then sure, we'll hear rumors. But that'll mean that from 2003 to 2008, 3.5 had a 5-year run. That's not too bad. | |
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Hejas
Sergeant
435 Posts
Poland
| | 08/04/2006 5:50 PM |
| Well, I didn't switch to 3,5 yet... [:p]
I just hope the 4th edition will work with those thousands of miniatures I'll gather until it's release. | |
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Mortusbard
Sergeant
427 Posts
North Carolina
| | 08/04/2006 10:59 PM |
| Having not even finshed the first page let me say this.
I love D&D and D&D Minis.
I am getting to long in the tooth though to switch my rules yet again. I remeber Basic/Advanced 2nd edition 3rd edition 3.5. All of these have their memories but I will not be spending more money on yet another edition of roleplaying. I also feel that the roleplaying aspect of the game has diminished over the time as well.
I will still buy and play mini's butr as stated before I have plenty of manuals for 3.5 and all my imagination left. | |
Unto Death We Strive,
From Birth unto the Dust, | |
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Can of the Cave Beer
Commander
2838 Posts
| | 08/05/2006 12:12 AM |
| If there is going to be a 4.0 in short order I'll not complain much. That will make the 3.X books I'm after that much cheaper!
I just need to grab the splat books, and hopefully one for lycanthropes will be released soon, then I'll be good for a very long time. | |
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Corim Danex
Warlord
6841 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 08/05/2006 2:23 AM |
| | They won't make any money with 4th edition from me. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
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Low Key
Underboss
1231 Posts
| | 08/05/2006 6:16 AM |
| | Imo, a bit too early for a new edition, but you have to admit WotCs 3rd ed stuff is going downhill. But since pretty much all the books I own are 90% fluff, I can live with this. I dont use that much money in DnD anyways. | |
Champion of the Sarrukh | |
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 08/05/2006 9:33 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Low Key
Imo, a bit too early for a new edition, but you have to admit WotCs 3rd ed stuff is going downhill. But since pretty much all the books I own are 90% fluff, I can live with this. I dont use that much money in DnD anyways.
I wonder thouh if it is really too early to start working on a new ediion. If it does come out in 208, 3rd ed ( counting both 3. and 3.5) will have been around for 8 years. 2nd ed was around for about 11 and first for 15 or 16, right? Maybe they are right in not waiting for a system to get moribund before updating it. It all depends on whether they do a good job on the update.
As for the new stuff coming out, I wouldn't say it is going downhill. I'm lucky enough to have a sweet deal that allows me to get my hands on these books without spending a lot of money and I have to say that they are still sparking more character ideas. Now, I'll admit they are not for everyone because they do not fit in every campaign, but downhill, no. | |
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warchanter
Sergeant
394 Posts
Italy
| | 08/05/2006 9:37 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Sirohk
Wow! [:0]
More miniatures based can be a good thing. [:p]
No, that's horrible news. RPG can (and should) be played without minis at all. My two cents. | |
Nexxstalker on WoTC Boards | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10492 Posts
United States
| | 08/05/2006 9:51 AM |
| There's been an interesting change of tone on ENWorld--Eric Noah didn't post a retraction, but he did say that he's gotten some other news. And then other posters who seem to have inside information have posted too.
It's not that 4e isn't in the works (the admission is that it's been in the works since the day 3e was released), but that the current rumors are off-track.
Hmm.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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thin lizzy
Skirmisher
11 Posts
| | 08/05/2006 10:00 AM |
| I'm hardy concerned. Of course there will be a 4th edition, and maybe it will be more mini oriented. But I don't see how that can really hurt the game. Times are changing, and games are as well. D&D has become much more of a visual game in the past few years, but I think it had to. Online gaming is so huge these days, D&D needs to be as visually pleasing as possible to keep people playing.
As for Wizards selling off the RPG license, I'll believe that one when I see it. And if it did, my money is on Paizo grabbing it. So we're still ok.
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you gotta lose to know how to win | |
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Nobody Important
Sergeant
718 Posts
| | 08/05/2006 3:34 PM |
| I'd add a voice to those against a whole new 4th edition. I would however support tweaks to the current edition that don't void all the 3.5 materail available.
I have a bit of 3.5 and 2ed material and a handful of the early stuff and 3.0. As I see it the game evolved from the Basic DnD up to 2ed with its Player's Options series. Yes, things changed during that time but I didn't find using 2ed rules with a 1st ed module too difficult. With 3rd edition DnD experienced a mutation instead of an evolvement. The Fluff was still there but almost all the crunch changed completely. My 3.0 collection consists of the three core books and only two splat books (plus what my subscription to Dungeon since 97 has contributed) and that was enough. I liked the 3.5 revisions and see that Wizards has finally figured out many of the kinks so I haven't felt bad about the Complete Series and some of the other supplements. If a 3.6* Core came out I don't see the world ending but I know I won't stay with the game through another mutation.
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Bert the Troll
Commander
3964 Posts
Adelaide
| | 08/06/2006 8:31 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by warchanter
quote:
Originally posted by Sirohk
Wow! [:0]
More miniatures based can be a good thing. [:p]
No, that's horrible news. RPG can (and should) be played without minis at all. My two cents.
I agree with the Can, not the Should.
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"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
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Teach
Sneak
140 Posts
| | 08/06/2006 10:58 PM |
| My feeling is that a lot of what will be happening with D&D and DDM will hinge on what happens with the release of Dreamblade. If it is true that miniatures and magic are the only things making money over at WotC, then dreamblade might be the WotC's attempt to test the waters for a collectable miniatures game unaffiliated with any prior IP. If it succeeds, it might be able to replace DDM as a money maker for WotC and WotC will be able to sell off their RPG wing and with it support for DDM. If i was WotC, i would have a lot of options for how to maintain and grow my business. We'll see. Of course, Gencon might just turn everything on its head.
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Most Edumacated
zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 08/07/2006 2:55 AM |
| If Chainmail Equivs get updated in the near future (Shoe has definitely alluded to that), I'd expect that the DDM line is a keeper for WotC [:D]
From a marketing perspective, I can't imagine selling off D&D if DDM makes money. Reasoning...for every new person that buys into D&D you have roughly a 50/50 chance that they'll also buy into the minis line. Add to that all of the people who already want minis for RPG, the collectors, and the skirmishers. DDM seems like it's a keeper (very unlikely to be replaced by Dreamblade).
IF (and that's a big if) D&D isn't making money, I'd strongly recommend dropping the volume of splatbooks produced. There are a lot more products coming out each year than my budget/needs/taste can keep up with. Lower volume + higher quality = more sales (in theory).
Granted, I'd assume WotC has someone who they pay quite well to analyze the data. I'd also guess that person has said "make more adventures" since there are a LOT of adventures on the docket for the next two quarters (particularly compared to the past 6 quarters).
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Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
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Have/Want List
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orcdoubleax
Sergeant
694 Posts
| | 08/07/2006 5:32 AM |
| I am fine with 4th eition showing up [:0]
I like the count have a ton of books, I will continue to buy 3.5 as long as wizard makes it. I will then fill in the gaps and pick up some 3rd party stuff that I missed. Then I will simply stop buying books.
I have tens of thousands of things left to try in 3.5. Any only another 40-50 years to squeeze them all in.
So all a new edition does for me is save me money. | |
Yes I am Gelatinous.
www.gelatinousdudes.com
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bonelock
Underboss
1272 Posts
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Thailfi
Sergeant
956 Posts
| | 08/07/2006 9:43 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by SYB
Ironically, I have seen every one of these concerns and comments before. The last time I saw people saying these things was just before 2nd edition was phased out and 3.0 was introduced.
I remember countless people saying that they had a library of 2nd edition products, that they were invested in 2nd edition, that 2nd edition was a good game and was "good enough", and that they would never buy a 3rd edition product. Almost every last one of those people currently plays 3.0/3.5 (most the latter).
Short version: If they sell it, most of us will buy it.
-SYB
LOL. Your experience is vastly different from mine. I haven't bought a D&D publication since 3e was released (my sister gave me the 3.5e core book collection for my birthday one year) and I have gamed with only one person that has even played 3e. The only WotC product I have bought since 3e was released is DDM.
We still have a strong library of 1e/2e products to enjoy. We have held out for 6 years and we will hold out for several more before switching to 4e or 5e.
I do think the game needs to evolve to compete with CCGs and MMORPGs that the current generation is growing up with. They need to keep their identity while staying accessable to today's youth. Its a tough balancing act. | |
Thailfi's Have/Want List
Thailfi's References | |
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Hejas
Sergeant
435 Posts
Poland
| | 08/07/2006 12:35 PM |
| | Do you see how much D&D stuff is being released each month? It wouldn't, if it wasn't making money, right? I mean... that was a strange theory. ;) | |
~Polish~DDM~Elite~ ;-)
Champion of the Psion Killer.
Knight of the "Baldur's Gate" Characters.
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Bert the Troll
Commander
3964 Posts
Adelaide
| | 08/07/2006 7:22 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thailfi
LOL. Your experience is vastly different from mine. I haven't bought a D&D publication since 3e was released (my sister gave me the 3.5e core book collection for my birthday one year) and I have gamed with only one person that has even played 3e. The only WotC product I have bought since 3e was released is DDM.
We still have a strong library of 1e/2e products to enjoy. We have held out for 6 years and we will hold out for several more before switching to 4e or 5e.
I do think the game needs to evolve to compete with CCGs and MMORPGs that the current generation is growing up with. They need to keep their identity while staying accessable to today's youth. Its a tough balancing act.
DDM & fantastic locations have been the only D&D products I`ve brought since 1st edition. | |
"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
Semi-Secret sig business: "In the age of the internet attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy." - Benjamin Franklin
Champion of Epic Lolth, Orcus, & Demogorgon and bring us Asmodeus! | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 08/07/2006 7:38 PM |
| If 4E comes out, I will probably buy it. No sense in pretending otherwise for me. [:p]
I may not use it until current campaigns are finished, just to avoid conversion hassles, though.
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Anson on WotC boards | |
| Man of Renown
Wraithborne
Warlord
5278 Posts
The Red Light District
| | 08/07/2006 7:43 PM |
| I have pretty much everything from 3.0. The only reason we have all of the 3.5 core rules to use is my brother found the DMG at Goodwill for $1 and another guy in our group got the PHB and MM for Christmas a couple of years ago. I have a couple of the 3.5 splatbooks, but not really as many as I want. They come out way too fast for me to be able to get even 1/2 of the ones I want and $30-$35 a piece is a bit much for my small budget to swallow.
The only good thing 4e will bring for me is scoring all the 3.5 books I want on Ebay cheap-style. When 3e came out, it was much needed. Most people were playing with so many house rules that any particular game could've been called 2.5. Contradictory rules abounded from product to product and the game could easily get bogged down in complexity. It was a breath of fresh air that the game really needed at the time.
4e before somewhere near 2012 would seem to me like another 3.5 style cash grab. I still have a sour taste in my mouth from that one and I still don't understand why(other than a cash grab scheme)that the updates couldn't have been released in a pdf or something for those who had already spent the cash to get the books.
All you 3.5 are belong to us. | |
Eye dun no why youse guys think im not relly a person im jimgang from canada but im moving to cali as soon as i get a master card
-Jimgang
So, you stand at your grave, Has your soul yet been taken away?
So you can't read what's engraved, Is this Heaven or merely Decay?
Was there a light, enchantingly bright, A Question, just how did it end?
Just let me sift through your calm remains, And tear you away from your skin.
-Sumerias Fain. | |
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Dordledum
Commander
3463 Posts
Netherlands
| | 08/08/2006 3:40 AM |
| My friends and I hesitated going from 2nd edition to 3.5 (skipping 3.0 completely) because we all didn't want to buy another PHB, which we thought to be a waste of cash. At that time the five of us only had 7 books (5xPHB, 1xMM, 1xDMG). We were hesitant then about switching, now the five of us have about 10-20 books each (core and fluff) worth of 3.5 stuff. I'm with the Count: I will probably stop buying after the 3.5 sale has sold out! I don't even know if I will like my miniatures, once the RPG-side of my stat cards is incompatible with the game I play, I come close to having enough for most RPG-situations as it is.
D. | |
Member of the Bearded Devils
Champion of the Huge Spider (WotDQ 46/60), A New Umber Hulk (DoDe 57/60), and the Orog Fighter! | |
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