Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6844 Posts
    
West Valley City, Utah
 | | 10/31/2006 10:23 AM |
| Posted By MerricB on 10/30/2006 3:46 PM Shoe posted on scaling issues last week. See the entry for Wed Oct 25. http://www.blackguard.ca/merric/cdp/"Scale is something we definitely consider as we go through the process of making miniatures - but it is surprisingly a fairly inexact science. The actual size of a mini changes at a couple stages between the initial sculpt and the final product, because of the nature of the molding and production process. While we can estimate the amount of reduction, it is sometimes more and sometimes less. So there will always be some variance, despite our best efforts to get the measurements right." - Shoe So, it's a limitation on the production side that causes variance in scale. Of course people want the figures in scale. What are you prepared to give up, however? Would you be happy for boosters to double in price if the scale was made more accurate? Cheers!
Wow, there are two times in the production process where the scale is changed in ways that can only be estimated. That would sure be a difficult thing to work with in order to get scaling more accurate. I didn't realize that it was that complex. It sounds like even if the sculptor were to get the scaling dead on, the two other mystery steps can mess up the scaling of the miniature. That's too bad. I understand that those two mystery steps are necessary steps in the process. I don't know how much more accurate they can get with this problem. I would think that significant differences could be diminished, though. Like send the Snig back and ask for a small goblin and not a medium goblin. Or send the fireforge fire giant guy back so that he's not overflowing the base. But getting the scaling on everything correct to the nearest 2 feet of relative height sounds extremely difficult with those two mystery steps which result in random scaling changes. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Soup13
Sneak
51 Posts
NL Canada
| | 10/31/2006 10:32 AM |
| you said it, it may or may not, and as scale is not
clearly related to complexity there is no apriori reason to think that prices
should increase, or that WotC are making their maximun effort (they dont have competition
in DDM). Maybe is just something like a thing that someone said: The people who
make the models are not given enough specifications.
You're
right scale is not clearly linked to complexity, but I’m hoping that you would
be willing to concede that it could/can be under certain circumstances.
And yes your other arguments may be true as well, the
modelers need more info, and that lack of compotation has made WoTC inefficient
in the DDM mini department, but there is no reason to deny that situations
could not arise where my argument holds as well.
In these cases (heck it could have lottery odds of
occurring, but given enough chances to occur unlikely events can and must
occur) my point is that trade offs should be made to make the best set possible,
and that scaling should not be given priority over all other factors, and that
reasonable trade offs should be made.
If it can be fixed at no cost sure, I’m all for it.
However if not, I’d rather have good looking mini's than ones that size right.
Cheers | |
Champion of Mirt the Money Lender
Please make an Epic Obould | |
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raymo13
Warrior
276 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 10:40 AM |
| | I'll sign. It is one of the reasons I left DDM. | |
References = http://www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6805
H/W list = http://www.maxminis.com/hwlist.asp?user=raymo13
Completed trades: (34) Tuplin, Drift, Gaddszooks, Litorian, Pan, Foundry of Decay, Demagogue, Bigwave, Vidman, Darkfather X4, Astroliar, Dark Knightmare, Ankh-Morpork Guard, Fishy, Kreatobergas, Zenako, smetzger, Cotguy130, Cha0tic G0od, Kithmaker, Myth Master Jr, simage, aron1, koraldon, agcooper1, ferris1971, ManoVega, Nurvel, amnuxoll, kritter, tomas.
Trades Pending: (0)
Bad Trades: (1) Countzero42. | |
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Skyscraper
Sergeant
659 Posts
Montreal
| | 10/31/2006 11:09 AM |
| Posted By Star on 10/31/2006 10:23 AM
As far as I know (and I could be totally wrong here) there aren't that many mini's that the scale is significantly off on - like maybe 10 or 20?
There have been 692 mini's made. If there are 20 that aren't to scale then that means that 672 are to scale. That means that over 97% of the time they're doing a good job on scaling.
I understand the importance of scaling, I just don't think that it's as big a problem as we're making it out to be.
I'll add my voice to this opinion. Most minis are fine. A few are slightly out of scale, a few are not very nice, but overall most minis are of the proper scale and are of a nice presentation. Less than 5% problematic minis is quite acceptable. I'd like to know who among the posters on this forum, can boast a 95% success rate at his job/school. And for the 5% "unacceptable" portion, we're not talking about put-it-in-the-trash unacceptable, we're talking about "he looks like a linebacker" out-of-scale kind of problem.
One WOTC member asked for a list of out-of-scale minis. Those that have a gripe towards the scaling should address that question. I haven't seen a response to that question: do you wish the problem solved, or do you only want to complain? Hehe 
As for the comment about not playing with math and physics majors that jump on slight scaling problems (or something to that effect), what can i say: obsession comes in different forms If i had someone pass a comment to this effect in my RPG sessions, i'd be quick to let them know to concentrate on the game instead of looking for the dust in the corners.
(By the way, i play with players of a plethora of different backgrounds, including a couple of PhDs - one of them scientific - as it happens. They're not being anal about mini scaling however.)
Sky | |
The wise man doubts often. The ignorant, sometimes. The fool, never. | |
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bossman
Sneak
85 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 11:22 AM |
| Hey, after I've done a job 672 times I should be able to get it right every time. Scaling issues should have been resolved after the first few sets.
I personally find scaling issues less a problem in large munchies but the ones that annoy me the most are the inconsistancies in hobgoblins and bugbears plus the consistantly oversized ogres. | |
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Skyscraper
Sergeant
659 Posts
Montreal
| | 10/31/2006 11:25 AM |
| Posted By bossman on 10/31/2006 11:22 AM
Hey, after I've done a job 672 times I should be able to get it right every time. Scaling Really? Than you shall be the first human being to boast perfection. Looking forward to seeing you change the world 
Sky
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The wise man doubts often. The ignorant, sometimes. The fool, never. | |
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Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7737 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 11:57 AM |
| I'll give it a shot (newest to oldest). I will add other complaints I have heard to this list, rather than just my own. This is basically a list of those figures that their scales just don't make them look right;
BLOOD WAR
Elf Warmage
Thunder Tusk Cavalry (Rider)
Githyanki Dragon Knight (Rider)
Lillend
Maug
Fire Giant Forgepriest
Green Slaad
Howler
Owl Bear Rager?
WAR OF THE DRAGON QUEEN
Goliath Cleric of Kavaki
WARDRUMS
Snig Worg Rider (Rider)
Hill Giant Barbarian
Hill Giant Chieftain
Ogre Warhulk
UNDERDARK
Half-Ogre Barbarian
Monitor Lizard (although this could just be sculpt overhang)
Hunched Giant
Mounted Drow Patrol (Rider)
ANGELFIRE
Feral Minotaur
DEATHKNELL
Spellstitched Hobgoblin Zombie
ABERRATIONS
Adventuring Wizard
Flesh Golem
GIANTS OF LEGEND
Fire Giant
Snurre
Lidda, Adventurer
ARCHFIENDS
Human Dragonslayer
Mialee
Vrock
DRAGONEYE
Dwarf Barbarian
Brass Dragon
Bugbear
HARBINGER
Human Commoner
Centaur
Ghoul
Human Bandit
Ogre
| |
Greyhaze's DDM Spoilers
Champion of a Medium Dog & then a Darkenbeast , Raistlin Majere, Nightmare WDQ25/60, Warduke WD60/60,
Anti-Champion of Guns, "Knight of Bugbears", and Joke Champion of Venger.
Called Shots: Frost Giant in Dangerous Delves. | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6844 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 10/31/2006 12:18 PM |
| Nice list, greyhaze
Add GoL Lidda, Adventurer
I would add also:
Hunched Giant
Feral Minotaur
Brass Dragon
Owlbear Rager ?
I would also say that Maug is certainly too large. If they had to remove the weapon to fit it in the booster, it was made too large. It overflows the base too much. It looks like a huge figure on a large base.
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"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Ack
Underboss
1476 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 1:49 PM |
| | yes | |
Minis... Serious Business
Completed Trades (18 ) | Pending Trades (0)
Ebay seller to Avoid –Fantasy_Quest_Dist
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jooquase
Warrior
272 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 1:51 PM |
| No :
It's to late now, if they build a new mini, it canot be to scale compared to all the other minis out there as they are not to scale with each other. The only way to correct this would be to start from scratch and I don't think anyone would want to do that ... | |
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Stevensocrazy
Skirmisher
43 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 4:51 PM |
| yes
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I hope you can see this because im doing it as hard as I can - Ignignokt | |
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delguidance
Sergeant
394 Posts
| | 10/31/2006 5:12 PM |
| | No, there's other stuff that's more important to me. If they can pull off a cool sculpt at the cost of going out of scale, I'm for it. | |
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Bert the Troll
Commander
3964 Posts
Adelaide
| | 10/31/2006 7:00 PM |
| Posted By Arandae on 10/31/2006 6:16 AM
When someone says "I want a G-Cube", ... Will you be prepared to be set on fire and have your bowels removed for it?".
Yes.
Oops, sorry thought that was a new poll question :|
| |
"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
Semi-Secret sig business: "In the age of the internet attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy." - Benjamin Franklin
Champion of Epic Lolth, Orcus, & Demogorgon and bring us Asmodeus! | |
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Skyscraper
Sergeant
659 Posts
Montreal
| | 11/01/2006 7:28 AM |
| Ahhhhrrrh, the lissst, it burns ussss, it burnssss usss!!!
I can't say i agree with all the minis listed there, but that's just a question of opinion, i can respect that some would feel that way about the minis.
One thing however: i see a rather long list of Blood War minis, posted three days before its official release. I assume that some of you own a FLGS and had early access to the minis, and I can only hope that everyone who provides the name of one of those minis has actually held the mini in his hands before stating that it is out of scale. Stating that minis are out of scale before seeing the actual minis is not very professional (and we're all *professional* gamers here, aren't we ). It's a bit like saying "my friend told me that..., and consequently that is my opinion."
Sky
| |
The wise man doubts often. The ignorant, sometimes. The fool, never. | |
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yack
Commander
3321 Posts
Gatineau Canada
| | 11/01/2006 7:50 AM |
| most people got the mini from last weekends pre-release. so thay have actually had them in their hands...which is now on their shelf.  | |
Champion of the Peryton
Vindicated Champion : Pit Fiend, Devourer
DW: Duergar Priest
RPG Only!!!! The Drumming Drunkn' DM | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6844 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 11/01/2006 9:38 AM |
| Posted By jooquase on 10/31/2006 1:51 PM
No :
It's to late now, if they build a new mini, it canot be to scale compared to all the other minis out there as they are not to scale with each other. The only way to correct this would be to start from scratch and I don't think anyone would want to do that ...
The intent of the list and this thread is not to have previous figures corrected. The intent is just so that there are fewer minis out of scale down the road, if possible.
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"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6844 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 11/01/2006 9:40 AM |
| Posted By Skyscraper on 11/01/2006 7:28 AM One thing however: i see a rather long list of Blood War minis, posted three days before its official release. I assume that some of you own a FLGS and had early access to the minis, and I can only hope that everyone who provides the name of one of those minis has actually held the mini in his hands before stating that it is out of scale. Stating that minis are out of scale before seeing the actual minis is not very professional (and we're all *professional* gamers here, aren't we ). It's a bit like saying "my friend told me that..., and consequently that is my opinion."
I saw most of the set and held miniatures in my hands at the prerelease. Though I did not get several of the ones on the list in my own two boosters, I was able to look around and examine samples of those miniatures that other people opened. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7737 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 10:25 AM |
| Posted By Skyscraper on 11/01/2006 7:28 AM
I assume that some of you own a FLGS and had early access to the minis, and I can only hope that everyone who provides the name of one of those minis has actually held the mini in his hands...
Yep, held in hand from the prerelease. However, as stated just before the list, I am adding other "reasonable" suggestions to list that are second hand. | |
Greyhaze's DDM Spoilers
Champion of a Medium Dog & then a Darkenbeast , Raistlin Majere, Nightmare WDQ25/60, Warduke WD60/60,
Anti-Champion of Guns, "Knight of Bugbears", and Joke Champion of Venger.
Called Shots: Frost Giant in Dangerous Delves. | |
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Ridureyu
Underboss
1622 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 10:42 AM |
| | I think the DDM community needs to stop obsessing about small things. Obsess, obsess, obsess. It's annoying. All we do is obsess. We obsess about everything. If we get the figures we want, we find something else to obsess over. Obsessing is bad. We need to stop obsessing. I can't stop telling you how much we need to stop obsessing. All we do is obsess, obsess, obsess. We shouldn't be obsessive over minor things. We need to stop obsessing. I can't say enough about how we need to stop obsessing over everything. Stop obsessing, everyone. All you do is obsess. Why do you obsess? I can't figure it out. I'm tired of seeing people obsess. All they do is obsess, and it had better stop. Obsess, obsess, obsess. Stop obsessing! obsessing is bad, so please stop doing it. Why do people obsess so much? It makes no sense. Stop obsessing! You're all obsessing. I'm not obsessing. Who said I'm obsessing? the DDm community needs to stop obsessing. it's getting pretty annoying to see everyone obsess. Obsess, obsess, obsess. Stop obsessing! Obsess, obsess, obsess, that's all you do. All you do is obsess over little things. Tiny things, not worth obsessing over. Miniscule things. Obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess! | |
Owner of The Original Rust Monsters!
DDM: Harbinger: 76/80 Dragoneye: 60/60 Archfiends: 56/60 GoL: 72/72 Aberrations: 60/60 Deathknell: 60/60 Angelfire: 60/60 Underdark: 60/60 War Drums: 60/60 War of the Dragon Queen: 60/60 Blood War: 60/60, Unhallowed: 60/60 Night Below: 60/60 Desert of Desolation: 60/60 Dungeons of Dread: 60/60 Against the Giants: 60/60
Dreamblade: All | |
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Soup13
Sneak
51 Posts
NL Canada
| | 11/01/2006 11:01 AM |
| Obsessive Obsessing, this is awesome.
One of the funnist things i've read in while.
And yes Ridureyn sometimes we all need to step back and put things in prespcctive.
Major tip of the hat to you for that one.
Cheers
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Champion of Mirt the Money Lender
Please make an Epic Obould | |
|
The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13113 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 11/01/2006 11:30 AM |
| Posted By Ridureyu on 11/01/2006 10:42 AM
I think the DDM community needs to stop obsessing about small things. Obsess, obsess, obsess. It's annoying. All we do is obsess. We obsess about everything. If we get the figures we want, we find something else to obsess over. Obsessing is bad. We need to stop obsessing. I can't stop telling you how much we need to stop obsessing. All we do is obsess, obsess, obsess. We shouldn't be obsessive over minor things. We need to stop obsessing. I can't say enough about how we need to stop obsessing over everything. Stop obsessing, everyone. All you do is obsess. Why do you obsess? I can't figure it out. I'm tired of seeing people obsess. All they do is obsess, and it had better stop. Obsess, obsess, obsess. Stop obsessing! obsessing is bad, so please stop doing it. Why do people obsess so much? It makes no sense. Stop obsessing! You're all obsessing. I'm not obsessing. Who said I'm obsessing? the DDm community needs to stop obsessing. it's getting pretty annoying to see everyone obsess. Obsess, obsess, obsess. Stop obsessing! Obsess, obsess, obsess, that's all you do. All you do is obsess over little things. Tiny things, not worth obsessing over. Miniscule things. Obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess, obsess!
What's your point? | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM
I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13113 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 11/01/2006 11:35 AM |
| Posted By Soup13 on 11/01/2006 11:01 AM
And yes Ridureyn sometimes we all need to step back and put things in prespcctive.
Isn't scaling a matter of perspective? Or am I being obsessive. 
| |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM
I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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Ridureyu
Underboss
1622 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 11:49 AM |
| | huh? What? Sorry, I was busy clipping my nails to the quick. | |
Owner of The Original Rust Monsters!
DDM: Harbinger: 76/80 Dragoneye: 60/60 Archfiends: 56/60 GoL: 72/72 Aberrations: 60/60 Deathknell: 60/60 Angelfire: 60/60 Underdark: 60/60 War Drums: 60/60 War of the Dragon Queen: 60/60 Blood War: 60/60, Unhallowed: 60/60 Night Below: 60/60 Desert of Desolation: 60/60 Dungeons of Dread: 60/60 Against the Giants: 60/60
Dreamblade: All | |
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Faragdar the Wise
Commander
3547 Posts
Albuquerque, NM, USA
| | 11/01/2006 11:51 AM |
| | I'll say "maybe". How many figures are really made out of scale, especially when you consider that the MM sizes that are listed are just average and a certain amount of variation should be expected for every race? Consider humans, who in the real world vary quite commonly from a bit under 5 feet to a bit over 7 feet. How many minis are more than that far out of scale from the average height/build suggested in the MM? | |
"Before God we are all equally wise - and equally foolish." - Albert Einstein
Champion of Myopic Half-Orcs
Winner, WBC X | |
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Faragdar the Wise
Commander
3547 Posts
Albuquerque, NM, USA
| | 11/01/2006 11:58 AM |
| It's to late now, if they build a new mini, it canot be to scale compared to all the other minis out there as they are not to scale with each other.
No, scale is quite simple in DDM and should not be relative to previous minis. In D&D, 1 inch = 5 feet. Therefore, a 5 foot creature should be made into a 1 inch tall miniature. | |
"Before God we are all equally wise - and equally foolish." - Albert Einstein
Champion of Myopic Half-Orcs
Winner, WBC X | |
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calvar
Warrior
226 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:01 PM |
| And yes Ridureyn sometimes we all need to step back and put things in prespcctive.
Don't forget to take into account the thousands of dollars people spend on this things in your perspective . | |
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Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:09 PM |
| I'll sign as a "yes."
This quick pic I snapped shows an egregious creep in scale. Just because the bases are bigger doesn't mean the mini should be.
 | |
My H/W list is not current...
Trade Reference List
OLD Trade references (191) | |
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Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 11/01/2006 12:14 PM |
| Thanks for the pic Kithmaker.
Good Greif...The Fire Giant is way to big,.....But it pales in comparison to that centaur!!!
Its gigantic!!!...........Wrackspawn?
And the Owlbear is like the big momma owlbear compared to the Harbinger ones. An owlbear should not be bigger than a Giant...It should be the size of...I dunno...maybe a Bear???
(Brown Bear or Grizzy Bear that is...not a Black Bear) | |
Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
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Daniel_Tick
Warrior
220 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:17 PM |
| This is really scary...
Thanks for the pic, Kithmaker! | |
- Vindicated Night Below Called Shot: Darkmantle
- Desert of Desolation Called Shot: Merchant
- Champion of the Nymph | |
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zoroaster100
Sergeant
873 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:18 PM |
| | Kithmaker, I too thank you for posting that picture. That picture says it all. The reason I think this petition is important is that I honestly can't believe right now that WOTC accidentally made those minis so much bigger because of a failure of quality control. Instead, I think WOTC is purposefully making the minis bigger because of the increase in base size for the large bases. I have no proof, only my own opinion to back that up. But the problem seems too consistent since the onset of the larger bases. I was not too happy about the larger bases to begin with, but my annoyance was relatively minor until I realized it seems to be impacting the size of the minis. That is why I think it is so important to send a clear message to WOTC that regardless of the change in base size, we want all the minis to be at least reasonably in scale, and not to grow to a different scale with the advent of larger bases. | |
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oyvind
Warrior
238 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:22 PM |
| To Faragdar:
Hear, hear! Although I don't agree with your preceding post. Grownups of the same sex with a difference of more than two feet in height is very uncommon, especially if they are supposed to be from the same general area (e.a. the same continent).
How often do you see adult humans under five feet tall in movies if they're not there primarily to show how short they are? Or over seven feet tall if not to illustrate how big they are? All I'm saying is that including several humans with this size diffence seems strange in a miniature product line including just over 100 sculpts.
But you are 100% right in that 1 inch in the game=5 feet in the real game! Shouldn't be too difficult to get most pieces more or less right...
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Champion of the Tarrasque
Knight of Kraken | |
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Lab Monkey
Commander
4136 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:42 PM |
| Posted By greyhaze on 10/31/2006 11:57 AM
I'll give it a shot (newest to oldest). I will add other complaints I have heard to this list, rather than just my own. This is basically a list of those figures that their scales just don't make them look right;
BLOOD WAR
Elf Warmage
Thunder Tusk Cavalry (Rider)
Githyanki Dragon Knight (Rider)
Lillend
Maug
Fire Giant Forgepriest
Green Slaad
Howler
Owl Bear Rager?
WAR OF THE DRAGON QUEEN
Goliath Cleric of Kavaki
WARDRUMS
Snig Worg Rider (Rider)
Hill Giant Barbarian
Hill Giant Chieftain
Ogre Warhulk
UNDERDARK
Half-Ogre Barbarian
Monitor Lizard (although this could just be sculpt overhang)
Hunched Giant
Mounted Drow Patrol (Rider)
ANGELFIRE
Feral Minotaur
DEATHKNELL
Spellstitched Hobgoblin Zombie
ABERRATIONS
Flesh Golem
GIANTS OF LEGEND
Fire Giant
Snurre
Lidda, Adventurer
ARCHFIENDS
Human Dragonslayer
Mialee
Vrock
DRAGONEYE
Dwarf Barbarian
Brass Dragon
Bugbear
HARBINGER
Human Commoner
Centaur
Ghoul
Human Bandit
Ogre
You're forgetting the grand-daddy of them all: the Adventuring Wizard. Put him next to the purple dragon knight sometime.
Many of the Dwarves are way out of scale relative to one another. Compare Tordek, Epic Adventurer to the Phalynx Soldier sometime. I don't know which you want to pick as the correct size and which as the incorrect size, but they are way off.
And for the record, "yes" I'll sign this petition (even though I don't collect anymore).
LM
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Have: Cat; Want: Storm Giant
Champion of Anything Dragonlance
Before trading, please check the Disputed Trades Thread | |
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Lab Monkey
Commander
4136 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:43 PM |
| Posted By Kithmaker on 11/01/2006 12:09 PM I'll sign as a "yes." This quick pic I snapped shows an egregious creep in scale. Just because the bases are bigger doesn't mean the mini should be.
| |
Have: Cat; Want: Storm Giant
Champion of Anything Dragonlance
Before trading, please check the Disputed Trades Thread | |
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calvar
Warrior
226 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:44 PM |
| Thanks for the pic Kithmaker, it is true that an image says more than 1000 words. Now I think the owlbear and centaur will join the list of the BW rares I dont want along with the forgepriest (doesnt mean I am going to give them for free if I get them :p)
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Harneloot
Sergeant
575 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 12:50 PM |
| | I too agree that the "manufacturing process" is not to blame for this size creep. There is something more intentional going on here and it would be nice to hear WoTC fess up to it. | |
"What is to give light must endure burning" -Viktor Frankl
Champion of the Large Myconid
Deacon of the ANY aligned Raistlin. | |
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Daniel_Tick
Warrior
220 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 1:09 PM |
| Add the Valenar Commander to that list.
He looks like a halfling. | |
- Vindicated Night Below Called Shot: Darkmantle
- Desert of Desolation Called Shot: Merchant
- Champion of the Nymph | |
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heirodule
Sneak
95 Posts
Philly
| | 11/01/2006 1:57 PM |
| the one "accurate" thing about the new Centaur is that it shows him wielding a "large" weapon in D&D terms. Of course, it's stupid that centaurs use Large swords, axes, etc, because their torsons are "supposed" to be man-sized even if the horse body makes them Large creatures overall.
D&D needs a "tauric morphology" trait, meaning use medium weapons with Large creatures.
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Have/Want list
Champion of the DREAM SERPENT | |
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Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 11/01/2006 2:55 PM |
| Posted By heirodule on 11/01/2006 1:57 PM
the one "accurate" thing about the new Centaur is that it shows him wielding a "large" weapon in D&D terms. Of course, it's stupid that centaurs use Large swords, axes, etc, because their torsons are "supposed" to be man-sized even if the horse body makes them Large creatures overall.
D&D needs a "tauric morphology" trait, meaning use medium weapons with Large creatures.
The "Human" half of large monsters such as the centaur should be roughly human size.
Lillend, Marilith and Centaurs are good examples of the mini being to big.
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Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
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Bert the Troll
Commander
3964 Posts
Adelaide
| | 11/01/2006 3:06 PM |
| | Wow that picture does show up the big difference. | |
"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
Semi-Secret sig business: "In the age of the internet attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy." - Benjamin Franklin
Champion of Epic Lolth, Orcus, & Demogorgon and bring us Asmodeus! | |
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Anaxagoras
Warrior
318 Posts
| | 11/01/2006 3:33 PM |
| Posted By Count Dooku on 11/01/2006 12:14 PM
Thanks for the pic Kithmaker.
Good Greif...The Fire Giant is way to big,.....But it pales in comparison to that centaur!!!
Its gigantic!!!...........Wrackspawn?
And the Owlbear is like the big momma owlbear compared to the Harbinger ones. An owlbear should not be bigger than a Giant...It should be the size of...I dunno...maybe a Bear???
(Brown Bear or Grizzy Bear that is...not a Black Bear) I don't want to seem like a Troll...But Owlbears do get to Huge size rather swiftly-after only four HD advancement...
I can see the giant and centaur issues-they advance by Character class...but some of the animals can and should come in varying sizes
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