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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
    
 | | 12/07/2005 12:00 PM |
| Druid build N° 171
Format: 200 point Constructed
Faction: CG
Fun/Tournament: Tournament
Rating: 4.0 from 5 votes
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
28pts -- Griffon
24pts -- Winter Wolf
05pts -- Timber Wolf
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199 pts - 7 activations
What do you think of this warband (for an 8 miniature max size).
I know that large bases might be a problem to many, but four of them have flight. The winter wolf is a tech piece. Everyone gets a 19-20 crit and has magic damage. Regeneration would go towards the two Pegasi, making them nasty critters to take down. Lots of hitpoints and altough some might say the damage output is low you must consider both griffons and the druid pouncing away. I belive this band might have a good edge in the fact that it has many pieces that can become real trheats for their high mobility (all have fly8+) and the ability of the griffons and the druid to make full attacks on charges.
Of course, that's a lot of rares to begin with!
Your toughts are welcome. | |
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jos1-1
Sergeant
829 Posts
| | 12/07/2005 12:12 PM |
| | oh some maps the big bases wont matter, but on ones with lots of walls its going to get a little messy, looks like a neat band tho, did you try and play testing with it? | |
Poor student looking for minis =D | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/07/2005 2:37 PM |
| I have tested it a couple times, but not as much as needed. I have yet to loose with this band (tough I don't have a beholder, or an archmage to test it against).
I am very pleased with the dual pegasus and the dual griffons. Usually, they end up being multiple threats, so my enemy cannot keep me from getting where I need.
I'm very happy with the results so far. The Druid makes for a formidable commander, and dependig on the opposition it is really easy to get the griffons fearless.
You can trhow the cone of cold from the WW right over the pegasus with no real damage dealt to you. | |
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Feathers
Underboss
1140 Posts
| | 12/07/2005 5:55 PM |
| Do you find yourself having problems manuevering the 4 large bases?
And are you able to deal well with high AC foes, like the currently popular Gith Monks, or even such pieces as the Marut, Helmed Horror, and others with AC 22+? | |
Champion of Neogi
Completed Trades/Transactions: sttmxn, Krush, jgsugden, Ayrychx2, Venport, Tysac
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
United States
| | 12/07/2005 6:04 PM |
| Have you tested it against the currently-popular Gith Monk bands? I'd also be curious to see how it holds up against a triple Frenzied Berserker band.
I wonder if maybe the Griffons could be replaced with something more effective.
I like the theme though.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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arhurt
Sneak
173 Posts
| | 12/08/2005 1:26 PM |
| I always like Druid warbands, and I love the griffon, so I love your warband!
I might drop one pegasus and add a Pyromancer tough. Nice warband!
It has got a theme and can be somewhat competitive! | |
Arhurt
 - Brazilian Forum - www.d20minis.com | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/09/2005 10:15 AM |
| I don't have many problems with the large bases. The four main hitters are very fast flyers. With 2 or more bears you would get in trouble when they could not pound at the same target becouse it was in a narrow corridor, but with pegasi and griffons I always have the option of flying above them and flanking.
I tested it versus a couple different bands, and the only problems came when facing High AC folks, but not as bad as I expected. You got 8 attack rolls each round with a crit chance of 19-20, and the two extra swings from the druid. Plus, the druid has 20 auto damage to force morale saves.
It is really easy to get the griffons fearless, and that makes them very useful.
The possible multiple threats makes this warband shine, they move so much that you can position your pouncing griffons for a first activation charge on the enemy commander. | |
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Aramus
Warrior
181 Posts
| | 12/19/2005 9:57 AM |
| | I like the look of the band and the theme. | |
Play and have fun, this hobby is an escape from the harsh realities of life | |
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nedleeds
Warrior
240 Posts
| | 12/19/2005 2:10 PM |
| | How about nixing a Griffon for a Wizard Tact. and then swapping out a Wolf for Devis. 2 Wolves is somewhat redundant, Devis and his CS can help vs. Monks and Couatl. I think perfect target Slapping Hands would be great with 3 large bases blocking escape paths. | |
Champion of Zarak - Evil Half-Orc Assassin | |
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TroglodyteWizard89
Warrior
346 Posts
USA
| | 12/19/2005 6:49 PM |
| The druid is one of my favorite themes, but i usually try to get in at least one bear. The high attack bonuses can nail those high ACs, with the +1 and magic damage to boot from the LMF
The bears large base is somewhat of a drawback, but its remarkably fast (spd 8) and has a lot of hp to regenerate if you plan to take out a Pegasus | |
Champion of Troglodytes!
Guy Who Cant Get Anything Exact
(called uncommon displacer beast for Unhallowed
Squire of Runic Guardian, gets shield Guardian) | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 8:11 AM |
| Thanks for the comments, I like the Idea of Devis and the bear, but might go a little more..
Druid build N° 175
Format: 200 point Constructed
Faction: CG
Fun/Tournament: Tournament
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
44pts -- Dire Bear
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
29pts -- Voice of Battle
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 7 activations
My damage output went down by taking one Griffon out, but taking away ComFX and letting the enemy out of command is a great deal, plus, I can be lucky with the suggestion spell on a low save hitter, and the Curse of Impending Blades can help hit high AC folks. With 35hp the VoB is a good piece.
I can swap the VoB for a Warchanter for the nice ComFX, but I don't velive in his puny 25hp anymore.
The Graycloak can help me get activation control by taking away fodder, and can boost the attack of the Griffon or Celestial Pegasus if I had no time to cast Legion's Magic fang.
With Devis I could try something like:
Druid build N° 256
Format: 200 point Constructed
Faction: CG
Fun/Tournament: Tournament
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
44pts -- Dire Bear
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
28pts -- Griffon
09pts -- Celestial Dire Badger
06pts -- Devis, Half-Elf Bard
05pts -- Timber Wolf
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200 pts - 8 activations
My activations go up by one point, I get the Countersong and a good spell blocker (Celestial Dire Badger). With 35hp and plenty of resistances and SR, it can keep even the most damaging spells from hitting my other pieces for a round or two.
What do you guys think? Personally, I'd go for the build 175 with the Voice of Battle, Suggestion and Improved Countersong can prove to be really nasty. | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
United States
| | 12/20/2005 9:33 AM |
| I prefer the 256 build to the 175 build. I think that Devis' cost is low enough that it's harder for your opponent to justify going after him than it is to justify going after the Voice of Battle. As a result, you might end up with the countersong lasting a little longer and doing you more good.
Just a thought.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 10:33 AM |
| Druid build N° 369
Format: 200 point Constructed
Faction: CG
Fun/Tournament: Tournament
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
29pts -- Voice of Battle
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
13pts -- Aramil, Adventurer
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 8 activations
Max activations. I don't think that the pegasi will have a hard time hitting high AC folks after MF and Curse of Impending Blades and the easy to set up flank.
Aramil helps keep enemy beaters on their toes with ray of enfeeblement. Druid enters the fray as soon as he has cast both Regens and the LMF by round 4. Suggestion can be a gamebreaking spell if you get it on, say, a low save balor or OC. | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 10:44 AM |
| I am still trying to tune these up to use on a local tourny, my considerations are being:
Build N°171
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
28pts -- Griffon
24pts -- Winter Wolf
05pts -- Timber Wolf
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199 pts - 7 activations
- Pro: Strong mobile fighters, multiple trheats, low damage cone.
- Con: One commander, low attack bonus.
Build N°175
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
44pts -- Dire Bear
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
29pts -- Voice of Battle
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 7 activations
- Pro: Strong fighters, multiple threats, Improved Countersong can make opponent commit mistakes, Dire Bear lasts forever, ranged threat (GC).
- Con: Dire bear might get in trouble with large bases (non-flyer), VoB is fragile for her cost, damage output low.
Build N°256
Format: 200 point Constructed
Faction: CG
Fun/Tournament: Tournament
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
44pts -- Dire Bear
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
28pts -- Griffon
09pts -- Celestial Dire Badger
06pts -- Devis, Half-Elf Bard
05pts -- Timber Wolf
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200 pts - 8 activations
- Pro: Strong fighters, multiple threats, Countersong can ease some bad match-ups, Dire Bear lasts forever, good spell screen (badger)
- Con: Dire bear might get in trouble with large bases (non-flyer), damage output low.
Build N°369
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
29pts -- Voice of Battle
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
13pts -- Aramil, Adventurer
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 8 activations
- Pro: Strong mobile fighters, multiple trheats, Improved Countersong can make opponent commit mistakes, ranged threat (GC) and Aramil as a hitter counter.
- Con: High AC can be dealt with, but not as sure as with bears, VoB is fragile for her cost.
What do you guys think, might I tweak a little more? I am expecting to face a couple GAS bands, and old school CE hitters, as well as some kind of strong LE (Chraals or Beholder). | |
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robbdaman
Underboss
2380 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 10:55 AM |
| Personally I can never bring myself to not play a couple Greycloaks for the free Timber Wolves but how well they pan out is hard to say. I've also been known to play a Basilisk for the hell of it so I might be a little nuts when it comes to GFD warbands. More recently I've thrown in a few of the new Underdark critters that the GFD can pull. The Natural Soul is a nice thing for such small figures. The Voice of Battle tends to be fairly expensive what with being somewhat squishy. I'm far more inclined to put in Devis or even a Satyr. I'm hoping the Chimera will be a nice addition to the horde as well and still hope that we'll get a large magical beast that is very playable that has melee reach for a change.
R~ | |
Champion of the Titan
******************************************************************************************************************************************************
Successful trades with: Tickparasite, Iyceman, Faragdar The Wise's friend, avrivah, Drakkengi, brucemc, Krush, maniacal_mini_monger, hung4treason, Gandy, NarlethDrider, Kunimatyu, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah..... | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 12:19 PM |
| I had my hopes high for the Gray Render....
but then, the horror, oh the horror!
Anyway, Basilisk? I never though of that, but he seems too weak for the pointcost. I might consider a satyr, fits the theme better than the VoB.
Build N°479
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
28pts -- Griffon
15pts -- Satyr
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
13pts -- Aramil, Adventurer
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 10 activations
- Pro: Strong mobile fighters, multiple trheats, Countersong can make bad match-ups easier, ranged threat (GCs) and Aramil as a hitter counter, activation control is easy to keep with strong fodder, pipes can be used on a favorable round to Pounce with Druid and/or Griffon after posittioning.
- Con: High AC can be dealt with, but not as sure as with bears.
I like the looks of this, very much.
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TruNutral88
Sergeant
522 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 2:49 PM |
| | This psot is to the original build. I think you should replace the timber wolf and the winter wolf for x2 graycloaks. You increase in activations by 2 and go over the limit by one. Activation control is important to a game if played right. | |
Champion of Bruenor Battlehammer | |
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Gloom_
Sergeant
583 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 2:53 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by dwarven king
Anyway, Basilisk? I never though of that, but he seems too weak for the pointcost. I might consider a satyr, fits the theme better than the VoB.
Eh, try it out, I think you might be pleasently suprised. The DC is low, but then it's not like it's a stun effect, or a damage save or anything. Excellent for Orc Champs, Goliaths, and similar low-save pieces. 27 pts isn't too expensive either, really. | |
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robbdaman
Underboss
2380 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 3:44 PM |
| Plus just one bad roll can end a figure's game. I did it once to a Ogre Mage and POOF! Big @$$ statue! That's where he's best really, vs. low to moderate level creatures including some of the squishy commanders out there. I do wish we had a Greater Basilisk to throw out there with a higher save. Someday I'm sure. That could be a ton of fun with the Greenfang. There's of course a huge list of magical beasts I still want but I won't go on and on about them.
R~ | |
Champion of the Titan
******************************************************************************************************************************************************
Successful trades with: Tickparasite, Iyceman, Faragdar The Wise's friend, avrivah, Drakkengi, brucemc, Krush, maniacal_mini_monger, hung4treason, Gandy, NarlethDrider, Kunimatyu, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah..... | |
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unknownman
Skirmisher
8 Posts
| | 12/20/2005 6:29 PM |
| I like the new monitor lizard for Druid fodder.
cost 6 for
AC 15
HP 20
melee: +6 (10 magic)
(with druid magic fang spell)
and of course the crit on 19 or 20 like other animals under druid.
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/21/2005 11:08 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by unknownman
I like the new monitor lizard for Druid fodder.
cost 6 for
AC 15
HP 20
melee: +6 (10 magic)
(with druid magic fang spell)
and of course the crit on 19 or 20 like other animals under druid.
Monitor Lizard vs Timber Wolf
6 pts vs 5 pts
Levels are both 3
Speed 6 vs Speed 10
AC 15 vs AC 14
20 hp both
+5 (10) vs +4 (5)
Wolf has stunning attack
I think that the Timber Wolf is superior in a number of ways.
Fodder is not supposed to cause damage, but to give activations, screen units, score assault points and set up flank.
The small damage and AC boost can be balanced with the one-shot Stunning Attack.
Indeed one bad roll and the Basilisk could be paying off for his cost, but I don't think that it will be all that competitive. To include one, I'd need to take out one griffon/pegasus or take away fodder/support and lower my activations total.
For now, the basilisk is, IMHO, a fun piece to play, lots of fun. But I want this band to be competitive, if not Tier 1, at least Tier 2, in my oppinion, build M°479 (Satyr) is the most competitive of them. I am still thinking of ways to overcome the damage output being so low, for an instance, against good bands (no Smite Evil), or high AC bands (Griffon wont rend as much).
Let's see, based on Building a warband from the ground up from ChristopherGroves, regarding build N°479.
Concept: Use the Druid ant it's ComFX.
No single squishy commander: Druid is the only commander, but is far from being squishy. Save 10 (14 MS), 21 AC, Spd 8 and 70 HP with a possible Regen is nice to have.
Not too much tech : Only tech is Satyr and Aramil, and they are hell worth it.
Everyone fights : Satyr, but will be up front preventing enemy from getting their own ComFX, thus, he HAS something to do every round. Aramil will shoot easy picks with MM and in late game use his Ray of Enfeeblement. After he has depleted spells he is still a viable ranged attacker that can take out low AC fodder.
Some non-melee component : Graycloaks, Aramil and the Druid can act as long range threats. I have a possible 15 auto damage for 2 rounds (MM + Prod. Flame).
At least a +13 morale check on primary hitters : Pegasi have a +12 MC, not optimal, but very close. Druid has a +14 MC, Griffon is MC +11 (secondary hitter), but can be made fearless taking out one tile grabber or fodder piece, or finishing off after the pegasi.
Activations : 10 activations on an 8 figure enviroment is more than enough.
Distributed Threats : 3 hitters that can go anywhere you want, one commander that can go anywhere you want, fodder that can go anywhere you want.
Contingencies
How do I handle high AC?
Flanking or charging grants the pegasi (after LMF), +14/+14, and the griffon +14/+11. Druid with flank/charge hits for +12/+7. Not optimal, but close.
Do I have some sort of auto-damage or a can-opener?
Yes, 20 auto-damage from the druid, but not against fire imunes.
Maybe I just have so many attacks I'm bound to get through eventually?
Quite true, on rounds where all my hitters and my commander are engaged, I have 8 attacks, 6 of them with a possible chance of 19-20 criticals. Not to mention Graycloacks.
How do I handle low AC barbarian ginsu blenders? (Eyes, FBs, etc.)
Against these guys, Graycloacks and wolves add up for the damage output. Griffon is more likely to use rend. Also, Aramil can lower their | |
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Aramus
Warrior
181 Posts
| | 12/21/2005 2:49 PM |
| | That and with the mobilty from flight you can go over chraals and chew on commander they are attached too and possibly get a 2 for 1 special | |
Play and have fun, this hobby is an escape from the harsh realities of life | |
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Gloom_
Sergeant
583 Posts
| | 12/21/2005 3:23 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman
Plus just one bad roll can end a figure's game. I did it once to a Ogre Mage and POOF! Big @$$ statue! That's where he's best really, vs. low to moderate level creatures including some of the squishy commanders out there. I do wish we had a Greater Basilisk to throw out there with a higher save. Someday I'm sure. That could be a ton of fun with the Greenfang. There's of course a huge list of magical beasts I still want but I won't go on and on about them.
R~
Yeah, I once played a Goblinoid/Ogre fun band vs 2x Basilisks and some other things. 2 Skullcrusher Ogres, 2 Bugbear Footpads, Blue and a Ogre Mage all became statues. The Basilisks actually had trouble getting to what was left of my warband through all the statues.. however unless you rely too heavilly on luck, I'd never run more than one Basilisk, because you're just asking for a horrible matchup..
Yeah a Greater Basilisk would be awesome. The Basilisk is good, but didn't turn out to be quite the minature I hoped. | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/22/2005 9:13 AM |
| After checking this thread I came up with an idea that gives the Druid builds I suggested tactical advantage with more ranged firepower:
Druid Hunting Party
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
43pts -- Half-Elf bow initiate
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
13pts -- Aramil
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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200 pts - 10 activations
With the pegasi to block and harass your enemies and the druid to provide support for them, with wolves grabbing tile points or providing flank, the Graycloacks and HEBI have plenty of room to pick targets and shoot. Aramil can be a secondary sniper after depletion of Rays of Enfeeblement.
I might choose the Queen Peregrine map. But can't rely on it with the +4 from the druid. | |
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arhurt
Sneak
173 Posts
| | 12/22/2005 1:34 PM |
| I like your last band but I would take away Aramil and place a Worg and a Longstrider Ranger. You would keep the number of large bases to protect your archers, but you get one good medium sized hitter with blinding speed.
Or take away Aramil and replace with a Dire Bat and swap one of the Pegasus for Guenhwyvar. That way you have more beef and less tech, one hitter with high attacks, and keep the number of medium bases to protect your warband. Guenhwyvar hitting for +17/+12 (10 magic/5 magic) and a chance of 19-20 crits is very desirable.
So, you could go for:
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
43pts -- Half-Elf bow initiate
34pts -- Longstrider Ranger
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
11pts -- Worg
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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200 pts - 9 activations
or, my personal favorite:
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
43pts -- Half-Elf bow initiate
33pts -- Guenhwyvar
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
12pts -- Dire Bat
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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200 pts - 9 activations
In the ladder, that Dire bat will be hitting for +6 (10 magic) with F6. For a mere blocker/screener it's very good. AC 20 is not bad as well.
Just my 2cp | |
Arhurt
- Brazilian Forum - www.d20minis.com | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 12/23/2005 7:53 AM |
| umm nice idea, I like the last one using Guenhwyvar, with regen she can be a tough nut to crack, but the pegasus have just too nice resists to ignore, SR and DR are the ones that come to mind as being particularly very strong, especialy against LE.
I might go for this:
Druid Hunting Party
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
43pts -- Half-Elf bow initiate
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
12pts -- Dire Bat
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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199 pts - 9 activations
I can afford Aramil if I am using a griffon as a third Beater, but with HEBI, I better have a backfield blocker.
I will use the Magma Keep map, as that will get me very good places to put the HEBI and he would have LOS to enemy VA. | |
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slayer1
Sergeant
597 Posts
| | 12/23/2005 10:49 AM |
| If you play on maps, you could use either epic map with the following build since those maps are also legal for 200 points.
Greenfang Druid 50
Dire Bear x3 132
Greycloak 15
Timber wolf 0
Xeph Warrior
200 points, 7 activations | |
Har 25/80 De 35/60 Ar 43/60 GoL 61/72 Ab 42/60 Dk 43/60 Af 51/60 Ud 49/60 WD 50/60 | |
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dwarven king
Sneak
61 Posts
| | 01/03/2006 12:08 PM |
| I don't know if I would run 3 bears. 2 are already hard to manevour in tight spaces, having 3 is asking for trouble.
With griffons and Pegasi, I can fly over enemy pieces and have speeds 8-10...
But the amount of HP and good damage with very high attack bonuses are nice I must admit ;)
I am thinking of running this to see what happens:
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
43pts -- Half-Elf bow initiate
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
06pts -- Devis, half-elf bard
05pts -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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198 pts - 10 activations
Or, a more solid melee aproach:
50pts -- Greenfang Druid
44pts -- Dire Bear
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
32pts -- Celestial Pegasus
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
15pts -- Graycloack Ranger
06pts -- Devis, half-elf bard
05pts -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
Free! -- Timber Wolf
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199 pts - 10 activations
Shoul I go for the HEBI or Bear? | |
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