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Mortusbard
Sergeant
427 Posts
    
North Carolina
 | | 02/26/2006 2:37 PM |
| Well after a couple of looks at this fig. I hope I have at least one in the pre-release.
Combine him with any healer type piece and a beater and watch out.
Imagine Warforged Bodygaurd Base from behind by Cleric of Dol Arah/Coautl and in front or beside you beater say Marut That several less hit the Marut takes and the Cleric/Couatl can heal the bodygaurd which doesn't flee because of fearless.
Add in the New Dwarven CLeric and when he dies you can ressurect back to 5 hp anyway. | |
Unto Death We Strive,
From Birth unto the Dust, | |
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warty_nosed_goblin
Underboss
1384 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 4:00 PM |
| Can warforged be healed since they are constructs of a sort?
I'm pretty sure that this has been answered somewhere, but I'm not sure... | |
Call me: W.N. Gobo!
originally posted by grim:
While he is clearly insane, he does have a point. | |
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Thespian
Sergeant
442 Posts
Lethbridge, Alberta
| | 02/26/2006 4:24 PM |
| | Yes, they can be healed. they only have the immunities listed on the card. | |
A wand of silence means never having to say you're sorry.
CHAMPION OF THE ANNIS HAG!!! | |
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elder_basilisk
Sergeant
410 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 4:41 PM |
| It's just a thought right now (seeing as I don't have an Iron Golem--if only I'd beaten Derry in our epic tournament yesterday instead of getting schooled....), but CoDA+Iron Golem+Warforged Bodyguard. The bodyguard can take damage for the golem and the bodyguard can be healed. If your opponent goes after the CoDA, he can take damage for the CoDA too.
Another use for the bodyguard: epic play. A lot of otherwise good epic commanders are very squishy (cleric of order, etc) and some who aren't at all squishy in 200 point (CoDA, etc) are squishy in epic where 55 damage breath weapons show up. Being able to protect a key commander (or tech piece) from assassination could well be worth 32 points in epic.
One other thought: he might be good with some of the legion of LG hitters that usually suffer from low hit points. A gold champion, for instance, could last a lot longer with a warforged bodyguard. The mounted paladin might also be more effective if paired with a bodyguard.
It's too bad the bodyguard doesn't have 65+ hp, 15 damage, or a better attack bonus. Any of those might be good enough to make him a real contender in LG warbands. As it is, he's a tech piece that might be good in the right situation if you set it up well enough. | |
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Tried
Sergeant
501 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 6:36 PM |
| He would also seem to work well as a "sub" in any multi-JA build.
While weaker than the JAs (nominally)he might help them stay alive, and could act as a blocker for ranged attacks and paralysis (meh- maybe not vs gauth, though). | |
Let it be. | |
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azuretide
Sergeant
407 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 7:04 PM |
| | I really like this piece he can take some damage away from your spell casters which is awsome one of the weaknesses in the current meta of the marut band is the assascination of the coutl just set him next to the coutl and they have to go through him to get to it might be tough for the figures to go through both before they sustain heavy casualties | |
Completed trades: bonelock, noilo x2, greylord78, Altayr, Shadow Lord x3, qillan_dvra, symbiotesx2, devasque, smetzger, dulsin, Sir Bozak The Damned, Ironfist Boulderbender x3, tallcar24, Tactician x2, Okay McKay, skwave, dariustad,Eprosen,hung4treason,dog of the underworld,FeranEldritchKnight,Jerry_Damage01,vtloon | |
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elder_basilisk
Sergeant
410 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 7:44 PM |
| I can't see many situations where he'd be better than another justice archon myself. He's got the same level, the same attacks, and the same damage. But he doesn't get justice strike, he doesn't fly, and he has ten fewer hit points. It seems like he wouldn't do much to make the favorable matchups for justice archons (hill giant barbarian, ogre ravager, frenzied beserkers, blood ghost beserkers, orc champions, eye of gruumsch, etc) any more favorable, and wouldn't do much to make the unfavorable matchups (gith monks, duergar champions, etc) more favorable. The problem is that the unfavorability largely comes from the JA's problem hitting and the relatively lower effect of justice strike against 15 damage or 15+elemental damage creatures rather than any hitpoint defiency. The bodyguard would help with the hit point deficiency and might mitigate some save based effects, but the problem would be even lower damage output than they already get against things like Duergar champs.
If I were looking for a warforged to add to a justice archon build, I think the warforged hero has a lot more going for it.
quote:
Originally posted by Tried
He would also seem to work well as a "sub" in any multi-JA build.
While weaker than the JAs (nominally)he might help them stay alive, and could act as a blocker for ranged attacks and paralysis (meh- maybe not vs gauth, though).
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LeClaire
Warrior
225 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 10:39 PM |
| | He's just too pricey to include if your only plan is to have him literally suck off some damage for you. Combined with Marut or IG is a possibility, but those titans suffer from more than just HP deaths, they’re also prone to save or die (OK, be destroyed) effects. It just sounds like too much tech to keep a titan alive. Even if he makes it through the entire match, there’s a good chance that you’ll lose on points, since your entire warband is focused into having him do 30 or 60 damage a round. This is a number easily beaten by any melee heavy band. Just killing off your support units and some tile points should put them over the top. | |
It is I, LeClaire!
So we have to champion something? Alright, I pick the mighty Flumph! | |
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pakcell
Sneak
163 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 11:21 PM |
| How about using him with Sword Archon?
With bold in effect, he would get CE from SA to deal 15 magic damage, which would be not that bad. And of course, he would make SA to live much longer. SA can attack with melee reach 2 behind the bodyguards, while bodyguards charge up front.
Sword Archon
Couatl
Warforged Bodyguard
Justice Archon (or another WB)
and 12-13 pts of fillers. | |
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juice
Warrior
175 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 11:45 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by pakcell
How about using him with Sword Archon?
With bold in effect, he would get CE from SA to deal 15 magic damage, which would be not that bad. And of course, he would make SA to live much longer. SA can attack with melee reach 2 behind the bodyguards, while bodyguards charge up front.
Sword Archon
Couatl
Warforged Bodyguard
Justice Archon (or another WB)
and 12-13 pts of fillers.
Interesting idea! [:)] | |
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Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 11:55 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by pakcell
How about using him with Sword Archon?
I think the problem is that it would be hard for the bodyguard to keep up with the Sword Archon, and if you limit the mobility of the archon you are shooting yourself in the foot to begin with.
It is an interesting idea though. | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
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azuretide
Sergeant
407 Posts
| | 02/26/2006 11:56 PM |
| | The purpose of the bodyguard in a marut band isnt to protect the marut its to protect the other figures the marut is not an easy thing to take down however i have seen in tournies the way to beat the band is to take out the couatl(s) then go for the marut so that he isnt getting the snake swifts that they provide the body guard lets them live longer. | |
Completed trades: bonelock, noilo x2, greylord78, Altayr, Shadow Lord x3, qillan_dvra, symbiotesx2, devasque, smetzger, dulsin, Sir Bozak The Damned, Ironfist Boulderbender x3, tallcar24, Tactician x2, Okay McKay, skwave, dariustad,Eprosen,hung4treason,dog of the underworld,FeranEldritchKnight,Jerry_Damage01,vtloon | |
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
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elder_basilisk
Sergeant
410 Posts
| | 02/27/2006 12:25 AM |
| I could almost see running multiple bodyguards with the combat medic. You use bodyguard to spread all the damage your bodyguards take between them and use a very carefully placed combat medic to heal them all at once. Your damage and attack bonus are rather low though, so you'd need to either pray for only matchups against inspiring frenzy and CE Quad (which still might not be so good since you're only doing 10 damage per hit) or include some tech to make your pieces hit better. But 3 bodyguards and the combat medic are already 124 points, and if you include the half-orc paladin to help them hit harder, and the mercenary sergeant to help them hit at all (and they still don't hit reliably, even with the cfx), you've only got five points left and you're already at six activations. And everyone in your warband is slow, nobody has flight, and your highest commander rating is three.
So, what if you tried another route to mitigate the weaknesses: sword archon, 2x warforged bodyguard, combat medic. Now, you've got 26 points left for four activations. With the sword archon, you've got at least one figure that will hit reliably and one figure with fly 8, but you don't have any snake's swiftness for the sword archon.
You could lighten up on the spreading/healing damage synergy and go down to a healer (letting you fill out the paladin+merc serg+3 bodyguards band and get a third bodyguard+2 pieces for a total of ten points or a coatl in the sword archon version). However, I don't see it being a real contender either way.
quote:
Originally posted by ChristopherGroves
How about other bodyguards?
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LeClaire
Warrior
225 Posts
| | 02/27/2006 1:12 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ChristopherGroves
How about other bodyguards?
What are you, the Devils Advocate?
All right, I'll bite. I'm a sucker fer a good hypothetical. Here's something off the top of my head using mainly new minis.
42 Couatl
96 Warforged Bodyguard *3
28 Combat Medic
26 Axe Soldier *2
08 Warforged Scout
200 @ 8 activations
The thing that bothers me most is that this sort of thing will do OK against some bands, but will be a non-starter against too many competitive ones. Let me try and fit that titan in, after all...
49 Warpriest of Moradin
42 Couatl
61 Iron Golem
34 WFBodyguard *2
08 WFScout
06 MaA *2 | |
It is I, LeClaire!
So we have to champion something? Alright, I pick the mighty Flumph! | |
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Thespian
Sergeant
442 Posts
Lethbridge, Alberta
| | 02/27/2006 1:23 AM |
| | I think the healer is much better than the combat medic in the event you use only one bodyguard. This is a combo that would be great because then your opponent would have to divert some muscle to tackle the problem. In a timed event, this might be worth every bit of the 42 points....hmmm....same a couatl.....coincidence? | |
A wand of silence means never having to say you're sorry.
CHAMPION OF THE ANNIS HAG!!! | |
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Tried
Sergeant
501 Posts
| | 02/27/2006 9:35 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by elder_basilisk
I can't see many situations where he'd be better than another justice archon myself. He's got the same level, the same attacks, and the same damage. But he doesn't get justice strike, he doesn't fly, and he has ten fewer hit points.
He takes 5 less damage per hit. Assuming two hits to kill, you break even. He is immune paralysis and poison. He is faster in the straightaway.
He actually brings a hell of a lot of flexibility to the JA build, including healing chains, etc (ie, he takes the damage, then is healed in turn because he is not "reachable" to kill.
Think on this a bit, and I think you'll reach the same conclusions. Not gamebreaking by any stretch, but worth exploring. Duergar are only hitting him for 10, BTW, so he is a 6 hit kill rather than a 5 hit kill like the JAs.... | |
Let it be. | |
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
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LeClaire
Warrior
225 Posts
| | 02/27/2006 10:21 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ChristopherGroves
... Warforged Bodyguards are, in fact, guards...
Whoa. Now that one did indeed slip past me. Eeeeegaaads. That may just be enough to tip the scales. | |
It is I, LeClaire!
So we have to champion something? Alright, I pick the mighty Flumph! | |
| Hero of Skirmish
doubtofbuddha
Commander
3371 Posts
| | 02/27/2006 10:28 AM |
| Ooooh, you are right Chris. Thats pretty decent. Too bad he doesn't boost damage too, otherwise the Warforged Bodyguard might actually be decent to run...
Mebbe something like
Village Priest
Half-Orc Paladin
2 Warforged Bodyguards
2 Justice Archons
Human Commoner
Probably not good enough, but worth trying out..
Especially since with the Village Priest's bless you are getting a new +5 to hit. | |
I am not gone. | |
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