Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
    
United States
 | | 03/21/2006 8:08 AM |
| Finally, after all those rounds of devastating battles, two bands have emerged as the top contenders for the title of champion. The winner earns the right to produce and conduct WBC VI.
Kiddoc and Janos M. have shown they can build bands that have what it takes, and now they face off to see which of these two has all the right stuff. Do the Fomorians smash the Maruts? Do the Maruts outlast the onslaught?
Cast your votes in this thread--I'll make my final tally on Wednesday night at 8pm (EST).
Final Match: Kiddoc v. Janos M.
Kiddoc
1x Drow Cleric of Lolth
3x Fomorian
2x Drider Sorcerer
2x Orc Wardrummer
Teleport Temple
Um... Blur, Transpose, Smash from 3 spaces away... repeat.
Oh yeah, Fomorians now save at +19 on Morale, bad guys save at -4.
Toss in a little cleave from 15' away, DR5, and magic weapon for good luck. Beautiful.
With the pair of Driders, you swap one in, swap the other out. Or better yet, go for the old-school super-fling of doom. Doesn't get any uglier than 2 Driders and a trio of 40 damage hitters.
If you're majorly worried about ranged bands, hit up the smoke terrain hard. Teleporters can be a nightmare for other bands against this one too. With a Drider and teleporters, along with speed 8 reach 3 figures, you can wreck some serious shop. You can actually take a 40 damage attack against a beholder, move back through a teleporter, and then be transposed out of line of sight without fear of retribution. With the other drider in play elsewhere, you can fling the fomorian back onto the teleporter so he's ready to insta-port in, and finish the beholder off the next round. For other bands I might be REALLY tempted to fling the Fomorians all the way forward on round 1, and go for the quick kill against other sorts of ranged bands. Round 1 basing sucks for archers and spellcasters.
In fact, as I'm looking at my teleporter map now, it appears to be possible for a drider to fling a fomorian onto a teleporter during round 1, meaning it can activate, swift action through the teleporter and move almost DIRECTLY into the opposing start area (and certainly within reach 3!!!). Not a bad way to go with your first activation if you want to get a party started quickly. Not a bad way to END your first round if you want to get things really hot and heavy on round 2.
At the very least, in the span of 4 activations you could entire choke an opposing warband into EITHER start area with a size-huge creature. Could be quite sick.
Janos M.
4x Marut 292
Sword Archon 82
2x Couatl 84
Sword of Heironeous 29
Map Hellspike
With the constructs and don't have to fear Beholders. The Sword Archon gives the Marut +5 Damage and hide behind them so it don't count for my enemy at the nearest target. The Sword of Heironeous is only for Map initiative there (ok his Command SA isn't that bad)
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/21/2006 8:10 AM |
| I'm the first Voter...
...wait I'm not allowed, damn.
I wish you good luck Kiddoc! (allthough I'll need it more) | |
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Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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ShadowLord XT
Commander
2632 Posts
Plane of Shadow
| | 03/21/2006 8:31 AM |
| Final Game: Kiddoc
It's so close, it's hard to vote. | |
Disipline is the only way to overcome chaos.
Champion of Half-Golems
Knight of Golems
"This world is made for love and peace" - Trigun
"anyway..shadow..you've figured women out. KUDOS." - raye_kino16 | |
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Ack
Underboss
1476 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 8:48 AM |
| The players sit down and do their reveal.. theyve seen each other play thru the tourney and now its down to them.. they shake hands and reach for their dice.
Janos wins map init and pulls out his hellspike.. then wins setup init and chooses to setup on the "right" side. Because of the restrictive setup, Kiddoc cant even come close to fittin his models in the setup area.. he has a drider stuck down at the bottom of the map and a giant fully outside the "top" area..
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/21/2006 8:55 AM |
| As Ack said Kiddoc got lucky with his 14 rolled on ini and I feared to loose it but my 12 gives me the advantage.
Phew the first step is taken. We both set up our Troops. I go first placing the Couatls and Sword Archon behind my Marut (aka Center) Defensiveline. Now Kiddoc has to place his units... | |
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Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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ShadowLord XT
Commander
2632 Posts
Plane of Shadow
| | 03/21/2006 9:04 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Janos M.
As Ack said Kiddoc got lucky with his 14 rolled on ini and I feared to loose it but my 12 gives me the advantage.
Phew the first step is taken. We both set up our Troops. I go first placing the Couatls and Sword Archon behind my Marut (aka Center) Defensiveline. Now Kiddoc has to place his units...
Then Gandalf the Grey and Gandalf the White and
"Monty Python and the Holy Grail"'s Black Knight and
Benito Mussolini and The Blue Meanie and
Cowboy Curtis and Jambi the Genie
Robocop, the Terminator, Captain Kirk, and Darth Vader
Lo Pan, Superman, every single Power Ranger
Bill S. Preston and Theodore Logan,
Spock, The Rock, Doc Ock, and Hulk Hogan
All came out of no where lightning fast
and they kicked Janos M. in his cowboy ass
It was the bloodiest battle the world ever saw
With civilians looking on total awe
I'm sorry, nothing personal. I couldn't resist. [:p] | |
Disipline is the only way to overcome chaos.
Champion of Half-Golems
Knight of Golems
"This world is made for love and peace" - Trigun
"anyway..shadow..you've figured women out. KUDOS." - raye_kino16 | |
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Sacred Lye
Warrior
184 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 9:04 AM |
| IS hellspike an EPIC legal map?
Kiddoc Wins
2 attcks at 40 a pop per formain will rule the day.
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My Trade/Reference List is Here | |
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jacksonm
Warlord
5560 Posts
River City
| | 03/21/2006 9:12 AM |
| | It's a good tough fight but Kiddoc prevails in the end. | | | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
United States
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bshugg
Underboss
1832 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 9:34 AM |
| | Kiddoc's band will show exactly why the drider is banned. Fomorians will be able to smash the maruts, and warp back to safety when ever they start getting low on HP. Heck if he ever feels at risk, he can even warp the cleric of lolth into base forcing the maruts to target her if needed. [:D] He can also transpose a fomorian with one of Janos's support troops or commanders, just so he can get a fomorian into a better position to start mauling things. I don't think kiddoc would even lose a single fomorian in this match up. | |
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Low Key
Underboss
1231 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 9:45 AM |
| The mobility granted by the Drider is just too much for hte Marut's, and since it only takes 2 hits from a Fomorian to take a Marut down to 5hp...
Kiddoc wins! | |
Champion of the Sarrukh | |
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Sean-Khan
Commander
2720 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 9:55 AM |
| Let's see. Kiddoc can only MW one of the giants, which means that if MW'd one won't hit (1/3 will miss), two hits from fomorians won't kill a Marut. 6 almost sure-hit 30dmg hits will cause some serious damage, and what I almost ignored in the beginning is that Sword archon is a capable fighter. Maruts are immune to negative energy damage and probably ignore lightning bolts totally. Sword archon can cause problems for Kiddoc's support operation.
There's maybe 1 or 2 maruts down after the first turn, but Fomorians have taken some considerable damage.
I'll say Kiddoc, although he needs some good luck for it. | |
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andytum
Sergeant
400 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 10:11 AM |
| That Fomorians have just too much hp and save of 14 with wardrummer...
Kiddoc wins | |
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/21/2006 10:11 AM |
| @ Shadowlord XT
Man Gandalf will kick my is? So I better give up before the fight starts... | |
My Haves and wants:
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Champion of Elan Psions
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Richard II
Commander
3663 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 10:23 AM |
| | Two of the fomorians can be mwed, so a hit from one of them, plus a hit from the other or the unmagicweaponed one kills a marut, and opens up cleavage. Given that he only needs two hits to kill anything and he's got cleave I think kiddoc wins this one easily. | |
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2004 D&D Miniatures Champion
Kiddoc
Underboss
1797 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 10:34 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Sean-Khan
Let's see. Kiddoc can only MW one of the giants, which means that if MW'd one won't hit (1/3 will miss), two hits from fomorians won't kill a Marut. 6 almost sure-hit 30dmg hits will cause some serious damage, and what I almost ignored in the beginning is that Sword archon is a capable fighter. Maruts are immune to negative energy damage and probably ignore lightning bolts totally. Sword archon can cause problems for Kiddoc's support operation.
There's maybe 1 or 2 maruts down after the first turn, but Fomorians have taken some considerable damage.
I'll say Kiddoc, although he needs some good luck for it.
Mpphh! Kiddoc can indeed MW 2 (two!) of the Giants, which is huge. 2 MW giants may just equal dropping 3 Maruts in one round (let's not forget about the fun that is cleave at reach 3). Even if I don't get 3, I'm almost certain to get 1.5 with those +18/+13 (40M), +18/+13 (40M) attacks. At that point, I'm still looking to cleave into something juicy.
As Brad mentions, transposing in the DCoL in an emergency is the ace up my sleeve. If I have a Fomorian at less than 40HP left, and he has an activation to go, I can take advantage of single-mindedness, and force his hand a bit. It's a dirty trick.
Another thing that's interesting, is that the Maruts are not naturally energy resistant. If I make spell resistance (6 bolts to burn, and blur doesn't do a whole lot for me), even taking 5 damage when they're all bunched together can be huge (especially for my giant without MW).
I have another useless wardrummer in this match, which is a great advantage, because it lets me try and fling him in/out for flanking or just toss him into the middle of their warband and force them to either deal with countersong (no more +5 damage!) or deal with me transposing a giant right into the middle of things in his place. Either way, he survives one hit from a Marut or a Sword Archon, which is one less hit on a Fomorian.
Still, transposition is what gets it done here. Being faster than the Maruts and having reach 3, means I can conceivably take an attack and move completely out of range, or take 2 attacks, and force a channel of one Marut at a time. Being able to swap out the injured is majorly significant. In the end, I think the ability to dish out 230 damage per round (and in 3 activations, no less), is simply too much to deal with.
Driders are broken. 2 Driders are more broken. Warbands like this are why this piece got banned. The gods help us if it ends up that I win init against that +7 SoH and we end up on the teleport temple :P
Good Luck Janos! It's actually a pleasure to see an LG band pummelling on a CE band in the finals of something. [:D] | |
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Avatar of the Tank
Newtoncain
Commander
2985 Posts
Land of 10,000 taxes
| | 03/21/2006 10:48 AM |
| | The Doc, Kiddoc that is. | |
They just don't know what's good in life...Conan, tell them what is good in life.
To rip the boosters. To count the minis spilled out before you, and to hear the indifference of the women... | |
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/21/2006 10:56 AM |
| Thankx Kiddoc.
btw. how do you get Melee Reach 3 Cleaves?
If remember the rules correctly I have to be in the Smoke with only one square to negate your Melee Reach... (Or am I wrong?)
So no cleaving into juicy targets.
But It changes the result anyway. | |
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Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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EldritchSoul
Warrior
324 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 10:58 AM |
| Having played fomorians at a recent tourney, i can tell you this. they miss maruts. teleporting or not, it's not too often that they hit, and i'm talking average dice rolls. they need 8 and 13, not incredibly great. it may take a few rounds, but the maruts and the sword archon will win out in the end, particularly with the likelihood that kiddoc will be down a fomorian at the outset. (if it's on the teleport temple, then he'll be down a fomorian no matter which side he starts on, if he's then on side B, he'll also be down a drider. being down 149 points at the start of the match isn't promising.
my vote is for janos. | |
Champion of Dracotaur- Vindicated!
T32 | |
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Sean-Khan
Commander
2720 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 11:25 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kiddoc
Mpphh! Kiddoc can indeed MW 2 (two!) of the Giants, which is huge. 2 MW giants may just equal dropping 3 Maruts in one round (let's not forget about the fun that is cleave at reach 3). Even if I don't get 3, I'm almost certain to get 1.5 with those +18/+13 (40M), +18/+13 (40M) attacks. At that point, I'm still looking to cleave into something juicy.
As Brad mentions, transposing in the DCoL in an emergency is the ace up my sleeve. If I have a Fomorian at less than 40HP left, and he has an activation to go, I can take advantage of single-mindedness, and force his hand a bit. It's a dirty trick.
Another thing that's interesting, is that the Maruts are not naturally energy resistant. If I make spell resistance (6 bolts to burn, and blur doesn't do a whole lot for me), even taking 5 damage when they're all bunched together can be huge (especially for my giant without MW).
I have another useless wardrummer in this match, which is a great advantage, because it lets me try and fling him in/out for flanking or just toss him into the middle of their warband and force them to either deal with countersong (no more +5 damage!) or deal with me transposing a giant right into the middle of things in his place. Either way, he survives one hit from a Marut or a Sword Archon, which is one less hit on a Fomorian.
Still, transposition is what gets it done here. Being faster than the Maruts and having reach 3, means I can conceivably take an attack and move completely out of range, or take 2 attacks, and force a channel of one Marut at a time. Being able to swap out the injured is majorly significant. In the end, I think the ability to dish out 230 damage per round (and in 3 activations, no less), is simply too much to deal with.
Driders are broken. 2 Driders are more broken. Warbands like this are why this piece got banned. The gods help us if it ends up that I win init against that +7 SoH and we end up on the teleport temple :P
Good Luck Janos! It's actually a pleasure to see an LG band pummelling on a CE band in the finals of something. [:D]
Oops, sorry, my bad [B)] Don't have DCOL myself and checked it's mw's from the gallery hastily and saw only one. So it's pretty sure then, I voted for the right one anyway!
Didn't think of countersong either! 4 Maruts is a fearsome opponent but this still seems pretty clear now. | |
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Korvax
Warrior
263 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 12:15 PM |
| | Kiddoc wins, for combining ridiculous damage output with incredible mobility (despite having a core consisting of 3 huges) and very decent survival rate. | |
Champion of the Phoenix!
"By the leaking snot of Skurmsh[!]" - Teflon Jeff | |
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robbdaman
Underboss
2380 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 12:50 PM |
| Kiddoc wins. Slipping by the Beholder forces by match luck which I think would have caused far too many chances to fail eye rays of death and the antimagic eye Drider screw. I do feel Tallcar or myself could have given him a run for his money from a defensive standpoint and damage output against him. Few other warbands have enough HPs to live long against 3 Fomorians though. In this battle 1-2 Fomorians would probably drop but the Maruts would all be destroyed. Not a fair tradeoff.
R~ | |
Champion of the Titan
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legend
Skirmisher
36 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 4:03 PM |
| Kiddoc wins
Not even close formorians just deal to much damage | |
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frogrodeo
Sergeant
706 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 4:23 PM |
| I'm going to vote for Mr Rogers in a blood stained sweater......
Ok, actually I think Kiddoc. Either map. | |
Champion of Remorhaz, and the Mighty Goblin Frog Riders | |
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Mortusbard
Sergeant
427 Posts
North Carolina
| | 03/21/2006 4:33 PM |
| I think a lot does hinge on the map.
Assuming both warbands arrive intact.
Kiddoc | |
Unto Death We Strive,
From Birth unto the Dust, | |
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nasamonkey
Warrior
296 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 5:14 PM |
| wow wee....
the broken drider sorcerers and very effective undercosted wardrummers in the same warband..
hehe.
my vote however goes to the Kiddoc (evil dude)
cleave,teleport,blur,+14 save, extreme damage,reach 3....concede
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Beer Baron
Sneak
106 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 5:47 PM |
| Tought Call, But With Mobility And Staying Power + The Stupid Damage Output...
*Kiddoc*
Go Fomorians! | |
- Got Greed? | |
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Aramus
Warrior
181 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 5:48 PM |
| | I'd have to go with kiddoc. The commander 5 and wardrummer giving giants a 19 morale save is the difference. It essentially makes them fearless (unless i'm rolling) | |
Play and have fun, this hobby is an escape from the harsh realities of life | |
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Dagni
Sergeant
870 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 6:03 PM |
| Kiddoc.
- Dagni | |
Proud member of the GRUUMSH fan club! | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 6:24 PM |
| | Kiddoc, Maruts are tough, but thats a lot of damage to go through them fast. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Kypdurron
Underboss
1206 Posts
Broken Hill
| | 03/21/2006 7:05 PM |
| Kiddoc
Just way too flexible to deal with ! | |
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forkedmoon
Underboss
1305 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 7:11 PM |
| | Kiddoc | |
Champion of Cyclops
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Eliminator53
Sergeant
628 Posts
| | 03/21/2006 9:50 PM |
| | Despite the fact of how much I like Maruts... I have to vote for Kiddoc. Crazy Driders+Formorians=Broken | |
Champion of Tavern Stripper
Knight of Knights
Squire of Death Giants
Somethin-or-another of Big Arse Swords | |
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taliesin
Underboss
1113 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 3:24 AM |
| I wish I could vote for the maruts, I really do, but 75 hp just isn't enough to stand up to fomorians.
Kiddoc | |
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grifter100
Skirmisher
48 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 6:54 AM |
| Kiddoc wins.
I´ve said it before and I´ll say it again: this was the band to beat from the very start, and it makes me sad to see so few participants building actively against it. Those that have where taken out early.
Again, this proves to me that banning the Drider was the smart thing to do back then. | |
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ickthegreat
Warrior
291 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 8:15 AM |
| | Kiddoc wins. | |
trades pending: (0)
everything is perfectly going out of control
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
United States
| | 03/22/2006 9:57 AM |
| Well, well, well. I don't really see any point in dragging this out.
As the judge for WBC V, I hereby declare Kiddoc the winner.
(Dave holds up applause sign for the rest of you.)
After Kiddoc finishes basking in the glow of his victory, perhaps he'll give us all a nice wrap-up post about his band. Maybe he'll even comment on the whole notion of my allowing the Drider to be legal for this event to showcase its problems.
And, please, anyone else, feel free to comment.
I look forward to what the '04 Champ has in store for us for WBC VI.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/22/2006 10:49 AM |
| Congratulation Kiddoc!
No Bad Matchup for your Warband spoke words about the Drider/Fomorian... | |
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Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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Ack
Underboss
1476 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 11:20 AM |
| | Im pretty sure "Activation 501" (cause its a grad level class and the play on words with the 500 point match) can thrash Kiddocs band. | |
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robbdaman
Underboss
2380 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 11:40 AM |
| Kiddoc cheated! His dice was loaded! He sluffed on marking HP! He purposely forgot to make SR rolls! [:p][:p][:p]
In all seriousness he got some good matchups which makes a huge difference. Early round Bye is always too easy. Then again the voting for these WBCs is subject to knowledge of the individual (or lack there of).
So what will Kiddoc do for his WBC?!?!?! Inquiring minds want to know......
R~ | |
Champion of the Titan
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Successful trades with: Tickparasite, Iyceman, Faragdar The Wise's friend, avrivah, Drakkengi, brucemc, Krush, maniacal_mini_monger, hung4treason, Gandy, NarlethDrider, Kunimatyu, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah..... | |
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