| | You are not authorized to post a reply. |
| | Author | Messages | |
SaintPauli
Warrior
189 Posts
    
 | | 08/01/2006 9:11 PM |
| Yeah you all knew this tread was coming!!!!
Post a 500 point warband that can kill the 500 point monster!
Gargantuan Black Dragon
CE 500 points
LEVEL/SAVE: 15
SPEED: F6
AC: 26
HP: 600
MELEE ATTACK
Bite +24 (45 magic); or Claw +22 (30 magic)
SPECIAL ABILITIES
Independent. Not Subject to Commander Effects. Flight.
Almighty (Not affected by allies's spells)
Aura of Fear 5 (Enemies in squares threatened by this creature get moral save -5)
Breath Weapon [][] (Line; 60 acid damage; DC 28)
Crush 45 (Can move through a smaller enemy's space to deal 45 damage and Stun; DC 28)
DR 5; Fearless; Immune Acid; Spell Resistance
Indomitable (If this creature is subject to any effect that would eliminate it but that does not deal damage, it is not destroyed but instead takes 100 damage)
Massive (This creature can end its move in pits. It can move through and end its movement in walls as though in difficult terrain; it cannot see through walls. Enemies can attack this creature within a wall only if 1 full square of wall does not lie between it and the attacker.)
Melee Reach 3
Tail Slap 15 (15 damage to 1 adjacent enemy. and push it 2 squares if Huge or smaller)
Tail Sweep 20 (Cone; 20 damage; DC 28)
This creature begins with 600 hit points and 6 activations per round; each activations counts as 1 of your2 activations in a phase. On each activation, choose 1 of the options below. Each option can be used only once per round. For every 100 points of damage this creature takes, reduce its number of activations by 1.
Whenever a damage-dealing or other harmful effect would apply on each of this creature's activations, it affects only the first activation in each round.
Move
Bite
Move & Claw
Move & Claw
Breath
Move & Crush
Tail Slap
Tail Sweep
Rock’n Roll
SaintPauli | |
| |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/01/2006 9:27 PM |
| 8 x Bonded Summoner
Each of the Bonded Summoners summons 6 x Little Fire Elementals. Then somehow encourage the Black Dragon to preferentially eat the fire elementals first.
6 x 8 x 5 Fire damage = 240 damage
Then convince the nice dragon to sit still while the bonded summoners barbeque it with scorching rays.
8 x 2 x 15 Fire = 240 damage
Hmmm - still 120 damage short - any suggestions?
Edit - doh! forgot about SR, means that half the Scorchers get resisted. So only total 360 damage. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
|
SneakyJoeKDB
Sergeant
593 Posts
Utah
| | 08/01/2006 9:37 PM |
| Well my first shot would be to go the obvious route and use GodSlayers
Uthok
3 x Bluespawn Godlslayers
+31 points of filler
With Uthoks bonus the godlsayers can hit the GBD at +23 and +18 for 35 dmg each. SO if all goes well each slayer delivers 70 dmg a round making a total of 210 dmg in one round. It will be a battle of longevity. But, the band does have 540 fearless hitpoints.
| |
"Like a thief in the Night"
| |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/01/2006 10:08 PM |
| Another try using the marvelous avenue of auto-damage.
6 x Beholder
12 activations, which will result in 10 points of damage (inflict wounds) 70% of the time and 30 points of damage (disintegrate) 10% of the time. I assume that the dragon will make 100% of it's saves (just to make the math easier) though it does fail on a 1.
That results in an average of 10 damage per activation, or 120 damage a round (assuming 100% LoS - not sure what the dragon's map looks like).
A full bank of beholders would take an average of 5 rounds to remove the required HP, but some of them are likely to fall during the battle.
If we assume that 1 dies each round except for the first, then the damage progression is like this:
Round 1: 6 x Beholders, 120 damage, Dragon at 480 HP and 5 activations
Round 2: 5 x Beholders, 100 damage, Dragon at 380 HP and 4 activations
Round 3: 4 x Beholders, 80 damage, Dragon at 300 HP and 3 activations
Round 4: 3 x Beholders, 60 damage, Dragon at 240 HP and 3 activations
Round 5: 2 x Beholders, 40 damage, Dragon at 200 HP and 2 activations
Round 6: 1 x Beholder, 20 damage, Dragon at 180 HP and 2 activations
Hmm - that doesn't look so good. Repeat, but assume 2 rounds with 6 beholders before they start kicking the bucket.
Round 1: 6 x Beholders, 120 damage, Dragon at 480 HP and 5 activations
Round 2: 6 x Beholders, 120 damage, Dragon at 360 HP and 4 activations
Round 3: 5 x Beholders, 100 damage, Dragon at 260 HP and 3 activations
Round 4: 4 x Beholders, 80 damage, Dragon at 180 HP and 2 activations
Round 5: 3 x Beholders, 60 damage, Dragon at 120 HP and 2 activations
Round 6: 2 x Beholders, 40 damage, Dragon at 80 HP and 1 activation
Round 7: 1 x Beholder, 20 damage, Dragon at 60 HP and 1 activation
That is a fair bit closer, but the big drag still wins out. So the Beholder player would basically need a hellavu lotta luck to take him out - though it is possible :) | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
|
Lord_rock
Underboss
1887 Posts
Portland OR
| | 08/01/2006 10:32 PM |
|
sounds like a difficult thing to do...nothing comes to mind really... archmages did until i read that last ability... other than big dmg sticks (which would still fall often) i don't know what i'd do... this things a monster... elf pyromancer just got a lot more use with that immunity spell...past that i just don't know... probably do somthing with no faction rules but i don't know beyond that... new fun puzzle...good one... i'll put some thought to it... | |
Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
|
warty_nosed_goblin
Underboss
1384 Posts
| | 08/01/2006 10:37 PM |
| Aspect of Bahamut pulled into CG by Elminster for the immunity spell from the pyromancer is a possibility, but that's a lot of points and not really very good synergy.
Aspect of Tiamet isn't to terrible either, as its immune to the breathweapon, can poison for some nice autodamage, and can block for your support, which is also helpful.
Aspect of Bane with Trog captain, grim necro (summons cursed spirit) and beholder might work, lower moral saves to rock bottom (that's -12 if I count correctly) then fear ray, and hope to get a route...its sorta cheap, but it could work. Something similar with Warduke and Vamp Aristocrat in CE might actually work better. | |
Call me: W.N. Gobo!
originally posted by grim:
While he is clearly insane, he does have a point. | |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/01/2006 10:55 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by warty_nosed_goblin
Aspect of Bane with Trog captain, grim necro (summons cursed spirit) and beholder might work, lower moral saves to rock bottom (that's -12 if I count correctly) then fear ray, and hope to get a route...its sorta cheap, but it could work. Something similar with Warduke and Vamp Aristocrat in CE might actually work better.
Unfortunately for this tactic, the GBD has Fearless. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
|
the_captain
Sneak
134 Posts
| | 08/01/2006 11:46 PM |
| This might be a silly question but...
How exactly is the GBD supposed to be played with? Is it the Dragon by itself vs. a 500 point band or is it the Dragon + 500 points of other minis vs. a 1000 point band or something like that? I'd be curious to know before I start building bands for fighting the GBD. | |
| |
|
Korhal_IV
Sergeant
852 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 12:18 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by the_captain
This might be a silly question but...
How exactly is the GBD supposed to be played with? Is it the Dragon by itself vs. a 500 point band or is it the Dragon + 500 points of other minis vs. a 1000 point band or something like that? I'd be curious to know before I start building bands for fighting the GBD.
GBD vs. a 500-point band.
The GBD has a pretty slow movement rate, so I might try to slow it down that way with blockers, or better yet, use the Couatl to pull the Mephling into LG, give a Mounted Paladin Flight, and the GBD will be unable to catch it easily because of Mounted Melee Attack.
Aramil is a good debuffer here - with a 500-point band that consists of one creature, it'll be relatively easier to hide Aramil, then spring him out for the Ray of Enfeeblement. Spell Resistance could be a spoiler, though.
It doesn't have Blind-Fight or Blindsight, so creatures with Conceal have a better shot than normal - can we spin something around the Displacer Beast Pack Lord?
Five Archmages ought to do relatively well - they spread out so the GBD can't track them all down, throw Mordy Swords at it, and run away flinging EMMs until the Dragon dies. If all ten swords get through, the dragon takes 150 at the start of a round - compensating for SR, an average of 112.5 damage gets through before the Archmages shoot EMMs (for an average of an additional 45-60 damage per round).
How often can it use Crush? Because that's what's really killing most warband concepts I'm coming up with. | |
I now have a Have/Want list updated with all my rares! Stop by to take a look!
Trade References: www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8560 | |
|
tahjn
Sneak
141 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 12:20 AM |
| Its the dragon by itself.
Id say your best bet to win is to focus on figures with Fearless and Immune Acid.
The Beholder is a good idea, but not for the fear ray. If you can decrease his save enough and pump the Beholder DC(Dark Naga) You might be able to nail him with enough Flesh to Stones to kill(6 would do it)
He is fairly slow so maybe a ranged band might be an idea.
| |
| |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 12:47 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by SaintPauli
Move
Bite
Move & Claw
Move & Claw
Breath
Move & Crush
Tail Slap
Tail Sweep
For the people saying that the GBD is slow - have a look at the list of actions. There are 4 there that have moving as part of them. If you assume that the move is just a single move, that means that the GBD is still going to end the first round 24 spaces from where it started.
Ranged is a good idea as getting close opens you up for the attacks, but the GBD can motor around pretty quick. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 12:48 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Korhal_IV
How often can it use Crush? Because that's what's really killing most warband concepts I'm coming up with.
The way that I read it - once per round. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
| 
Bert the Troll
Commander
3898 Posts
Adelaide
| | 08/02/2006 12:49 AM |
| Amaril is good idea. Or maybe even nighthag if playing LE for the conceals. For nighthags point half elf hexblade might be better choice for LE, as special ability has some chance of getting through. (SR 50%, hex curse <25%).
Spellscale might be valuable, doing RoE and Blurs.
Gold dragon(s) breaths could weaken damage more. If amaril and both dragons work, that 15 less damage...
Filchers? No save and will help out a bit.
Stuns, paralyze and the like to slow it down. It's save isn't _that_ good.
Doing damage to cancel out its activations seems the must though.
| |
"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
Semi-Secret sig business: "In the age of the internet attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy." - Benjamin Franklin
Champion of Epic Lolth, Orcus, & Demogorgon and bring us Asmodeus! | |
|
SneakyJoeKDB
Sergeant
593 Posts
Utah
| | 08/02/2006 12:55 AM |
| I thought about the mounted pally too, but the GBD can move during 4 activations allowing it to go up to 30 spaces in a round. So I dont think the mounted pally would make it even if he could fly.
Another strategy would be to line up the following:
1 x Epic Aspect of Moradin
2 x COuatl
2 x Arcane Balista
2 x War Weaver
1 x Elf Pyromancer
Ok the Arcane Balistas are there to do the dirty work. Couatls and War Weavers support the balistas through SS. Aspect of Moradin is a speed bump. The elf pyromancer can give the big bad dwarf immunity to acid.
Aspect of Moradin's 260 hit points is a lot for the dragon to chew through, and in the meantime, the Balistas can have up to 6 shots at 45 damage each for 2 rounds, thats 520 dmg if all goes well. War Weaver can give MW and D-HOP the Balistas if they get based. Aspect trys to slow the GBD down and may get a hit or 2 in, delivering 30 dmg each strike.
Well, it may or may not work if the GBD can get close enough to use his acid line, but I think it has some chances. After the first round the dragon could quite likely be down to only 4 activations helping the ranged bands chances for the following round. | |
"Like a thief in the Night"
| |
| Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
9934 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/02/2006 1:06 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Bert the Troll
Stuns, paralyze and the like to slow it down. It's save isn't _that_ good.
Dragons are immune to paralysis. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
| Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
9934 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/02/2006 1:13 AM |
| Cormulan, the Beholders should be able to do it with limited success from the use of its flesh-to-stone eye ray. Any failed save would cause 100 HP of damage, which would result in another lost activation for the GBD. The Beholder's dual-activation helps a lot here.
tahjn, I would not used the Bright Naga with the Beholders even though that DC boost seems to help a lot. The massive drawback here is that having to group your Beholders near the Naga means that the GBD will have a field day with its breath weapons and tail sweeps. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 1:24 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thenameless
Cormulan, the Beholders should be able to do it with limited success from the use of its flesh-to-stone eye ray. Any failed save would cause 100 HP of damage, which would result in another lost activation for the GBD. The Beholder's dual-activation helps a lot here.
Yeah, the flesh to stone would be useful if you have some DC pumpers in there somewhere. Dark Naga is an easy include, pushing DC to 19 and fail chance to 15%. If only the Hexblade curse was more likely to stick (only 15% chance) - then you could start throwing eyerays with a 25% fail rate (or 35% with Dark Naga).
Otherwise it only has a 5% chance of sticking for 100 damage. Vs the inflict wounds having a 95% chance of 10 damage, 5% chance of 20. When you run the numbers it is more 'consistent' to just stick to the inflict rays and wear it down slowly. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
|
Bert the Troll
Commander
3898 Posts
Adelaide
| | 08/02/2006 1:25 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thenameless
quote:
Originally posted by Bert the Troll
Stuns, paralyze and the like to slow it down. It's save isn't _that_ good.
Dragons are immune to paralysis.
Drat, that's right. I guess a nap is out of the question too. So that leaves umm stuns.... not sure what else.
Warduke might make for a good speed hump... lots of hitties and methodical killer be fun vs a gargantuan critter. | |
"Mutton yesterday, mutton today, and blimey, if it don't look like mutton again tomorrer." Bert the Troll - The Hobbit
Semi-Secret sig business: "In the age of the internet attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy." - Benjamin Franklin
Champion of Epic Lolth, Orcus, & Demogorgon and bring us Asmodeus! | |
| Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
9934 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/02/2006 1:32 AM |
| | Warduke. Interesting. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
|
Cormulan
Sergeant
533 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 2:40 AM |
| Upon further reflection, Dual Epic Storm Archer could create a bit of havoc. Potential for 75 damage per turn per archer from any range :) and hits AC 26 pretty easily.
How about:
2 x Epic Storm Archer - 320
2 x Aspect of Kord (non-epic) - 130
Inspiring Marshal - 29
21 pts for 3 figures of fodder
The two aspects try and hold up the big boy in the middle ground while the Epic Storms let loose. | |
We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free. (Bill Hicks)
Disciple of Kithmaker | |
| Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
9934 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/02/2006 3:29 AM |
| | The key word there is "try". The GBD player will likely go after the Storm Archers first. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
|
Gunthar
Commander
2938 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 7:33 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Bert the Troll
Filchers? No save and will help out a bit.
Also, filchers only work on humanoids. | |
Champion of Prit(Wemic vindication is here)
Minneapolis/St. Paul area
Completed trades: Aspect of Cheese (Love that moniker), Tickparasite, Elderthing, Lalato, Sodj, Grimoire, SmilinIrish, Zeb, RWarehall,Link, wikkawikkawa, Auramancer, Rommers, HK, Ivid5,Qillan_dvra, Puggins, Arcabius, Ironfist Boulderbender, Robby, Corim Danex, monster_slayer, DNDJUNKIE, Kelemvor, Krush, ckissee, Massawyrm, hockey fan, Wish, Uninspiring Lieutenant, vtloon x2, Vrecknidj, Darthpoke, WakeXX, AnarionZell, lycusmike, papabear5 and umpteen local trades with board members
| |
|
Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 8:23 AM |
| Some interesting ideas here, but I'm not sure if some would actually work:
Aramil - interesting idea, but I'm not sure he affects most of the GBD's damaging abilities. Does ray of enfeeblement affect Trample on figs like the Treant? If not, it won't affect the GBD's Crush, Tail Slap, or Tail Sweep, as those are all special abilities as well.
Single 'speed bump' like Aspect of Moradin - no go; it flies, the Dragon's Crush ability allows it to move through a single attacker's space and still deal damage (and based on the Trample ability, I'd suspect that a 'Move and Crush' is also a potential double move, meaning that the Dragon, if given a convenient piece to Crush, can move up to 36 squares in a single round), and it can move into or through walls. If you have a key piece, there doesn't seem to be any way to protect it from the GBD's attention.
Conceal - again, a nice thought, but Conceal doesn't affect special abilities, either, so the Dragon can still breathe, Crush, Tail Slap, and Tail Sweep without having to worry about Conceal checks.
Incorporeal has a shot at being useful, but since there aren't any figs with a really high HP total plus Incorporeal, it's possible your Incorporeal folks will drop like flies if your enemy has a good run of die rolls.
If this thing is actually Epic-legal, I suspect that the Epic landscape just changed a lot more with this one figure than it did with the release of WotDQ. And, of course, the mirror match seems like it would be somewhat dull.
--
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
|
Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 8:27 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Pauper
If this thing is actually Epic-legal, I suspect that the Epic landscape just changed a lot more with this one figure than it did with the release of WotDQ.
Answered my own question - according to the DCI Floor Rules, the GBD is not legal in a sanctioned Epic tournament.
--
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
|
Weaponbreaker
Skirmisher
47 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 8:39 AM |
| To kill a GBD use the following formula
1.Set up various 'shell' employers
2.Hire various adventuring groups though these employers
3.Disavow any knowledge of said companies and adventurers when there is an angry GBD asking questions.
4.Never get questioned by an angry GBD!!!
5.Always carry a vital Relic of the Realms when being questioned by a GBD so Elminster will show up with his posse and Silver Fires this thing to oblivion | |
Hunter of CE d20's. Destroyer of false hope and punisher evil dice across the planes. | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 8:43 AM |
| Here's what I see:
On the first round that you get within 12, GBD breaths for 60 (forget about making a DC 28 reliably) on your heavy hitters and some of your support. Then it moves 6 and makes a Reach Claw for 30. Next phase, Bite and Claw for another 75. Something in your warband has now taken 165 damage, and the GBD might still have an activation or two left.
Looks kinda tough.
Maybe Epic Kord, 5 Crow Shamans, IM and Moon Elf? GMA Kord up, he moves and attacks for 40, then the Crows fly up and swiftness him for 5 more attacks and 200 damage. Then the breath kills what it kills, next round Kord with Aggression hits for 50... no, I don't see this working either. Dang!
Bahamut with +24/+19/+19 (greater magic weapon) doing 105 damage, then 3 swiftnesses for another 105... still tough. But a blurred, AC buffed AoB is one thing the GBD could actually miss with its attacks. Of course, with Reach 3 vs Reach 2, the GBD might choose to eat the AoO and move back from AoB, forcing AoB to lose attacks and possibly swiftness opportunities as well.
Archmages would have to stick 7 swords to reduce the GBD's activations each round. Meanwhile, one or more gets acid lined for 60, and another one or more gets lined again next round. And if the GBD doesn't feel like rolling Conceal, the Tail Sweep cone will finish off any AMs who were breathed on.
There are chances for any of these ideas to work, but most of them are going to rely on a high degree of good luck.
Oh well, at least GBD owners won't get bored with their new toy anytime soon! | | | |
|
Sean-Khan
Commander
2717 Posts
| |
Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 08/02/2006 9:43 AM |
| Elminster
3x Archmages
2x Elf Pyro
2x Satyr
On Hellspike Prison would make him angry. | |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
|
ShadowLord XT
Commander
2631 Posts
Plane of Shadow
| | 08/02/2006 9:51 AM |
| EPIC Tordek
Buffering allies
6 rounds with Tordek is 600 dmg. | |
Disipline is the only way to overcome chaos.
Champion of Half-Golems
Knight of Golems
"This world is made for love and peace" - Trigun
"anyway..shadow..you've figured women out. KUDOS." - raye_kino16 | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 10:00 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ShadowLord XT
EPIC Tordek
Buffering allies
6 rounds with Tordek is 600 dmg.
And 2 rounds with the GBD is 330 damage. | | | |
|
RobWreck
Warrior
295 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 11:00 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Orion72
quote:
Originally posted by ShadowLord XT
EPIC Tordek
Buffering allies
6 rounds with Tordek is 600 dmg.
And 2 rounds with the GBD is 330 damage.
Yeah, but don't count the spill-over damage to Tordek's bodyguards... either warforged or Guen (via Redgar's warbanding). The damage above what's needed to kill the bodyguard is great 'lost' damage, dramatically lowering how much damage the GBD actually does...
Rob
| |
Champion of Aspect of Pelor
If the Founding Fathers of our country were conservatives, we'd still be colonies of England... | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 11:13 AM |
| | One line kills a WFBG, two plus a Tail Sweep kill Guen, no Conceal rolls. Bodyguards may help on one or two attacks, but don't count on them as your sole means of preserving Tordek or other hitters. | | | |
|
Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 11:20 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Orion72
On the first round that you get within 12, GBD breaths for 60 (forget about making a DC 28 reliably) on your heavy hitters and some of your support. Then it moves 6 and makes a Reach Claw for 30. Next phase, Bite and Claw for another 75. Something in your warband has now taken 165 damage, and the GBD might still have an activation or two left.
Looks kinda tough.
Agreed, though Epic Elminster at level 20 can actually make a DC28 save pretty reliably (nearly 2/3 success chance).
quote:
Bahamut with +24/+19/+19 (greater magic weapon) doing 105 damage, then 3 swiftnesses for another 105... still tough. But a blurred, AC buffed AoB is one thing the GBD could actually miss with its attacks. Of course, with Reach 3 vs Reach 2, the GBD might choose to eat the AoO and move back from AoB, forcing AoB to lose attacks and possibly swiftness opportunities as well.
Conceal 6 shouldn't eat into melee damage often enough to reduce the overall damage output that significantly. Even if the GBD uses three attacks in a round rather than special abilities, you'll have to consider yourself fortunate if two of six attacks over two rounds miss due to Conceal.
Plus I wouldn't bother with giving Bahamut an AoO when I can just Tail Slap him and move him back to Melee Reach 3 range, then attack (or cone, or breathe...). Instead of taking 35 damage, I'm dishing 15 damage and still depriving Bahamut of a full attack.
quote:
Archmages would have to stick 7 swords to reduce the GBD's activations each round. Meanwhile, one or more gets acid lined for 60, and another one or more gets lined again next round. And if the GBD doesn't feel like rolling Conceal, the Tail Sweep cone will finish off any AMs who were breathed on.
And even worse, to get 7 Mordy's swords to stick, you're probably going to have to have more than 9 available to cast, even from figs with Spell Penetration. So non-epic El and three Archmages can't even guarantee being able to 'put the clock' on the GBD this way. Five Archmages might be able to pull it off, between their 10 swords, but I'll guarantee at least one of those Archmages will have to pass a morale check before being able to double-sword, and without a commander (and with the potential for Aura of Fear to come into play), I'm not liking those odds.
quote:
Oh well, at least GBD owners won't get bored with their new toy anytime soon!
And if you think this is a tough match, wait until the Colossal Red is released next month...
--
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 11:35 AM |
| Four Archmagi with Elminster gives you 12 swords and a Commander 5. That's the max if you're looking at a sword-based strategy.
I forgot about Tail Slap - that would completely neuter AoB's damage output.
Is the Gargantuan Blue also going to be 500? I'm interested in picking one up if it is. I'd get the Black just to play out this scenario, if I didn't hate the look of it so much. | | | |
|
Thurbal
Skirmisher
46 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 11:35 AM |
| I would try:
Tordek epic
arcane balista
2x couatl
aramil
Mephling pyromancer
Scout
BPM
On the grotto map...
Still really ruff match... | |
| |
|
RobWreck
Warrior
295 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 3:21 PM |
| How about CoDA, Arcane Ballista and 6 War Weavers? For every action that the Black takes, your ballista can be Snakes' Swiftnessed to take a shot back. Dim hops can grant better LoS when needed. CoDA is there purely for initiative and to get a good map w/ good lines of sight (any Commander 7 will work).
Rob | |
Champion of Aspect of Pelor
If the Founding Fathers of our country were conservatives, we'd still be colonies of England... | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 3:31 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by RobWreck
How about CoDA, Arcane Ballista and 6 War Weavers? For every action that the Black takes, your ballista can be Snakes' Swiftnessed to take a shot back. Dim hops can grant better LoS when needed. CoDA is there purely for initiative and to get a good map w/ good lines of sight (any Commander 7 will work).
Rob
The line breath reduces the Ballista to 5 hp, unhealable, plus taking out x Weavers. Next round, second breath ends the game. | | | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 3:41 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thurbal
I would try:
Tordek epic
arcane balista
2x couatl
aramil
Mephling pyromancer
Scout
BPM
On the grotto map...
Still really ruff match...
Tordek gets GMA'd up to Dragon, takes two swings. Dragon Tail Slaps him back, now you can't use swiftness. Dragon then devastates your backfield, or hits Tordek from Reach, or...
It's very similar to a build I beat with Bahamut, except that one had 1 Couatl and 2 Weavers. 'Ruff' is a gross underestimation.
Finally, we have what I've always wanted - a Dragon that puts the fear of Dragons back into the game. I'm heartbroken over its appearance though. Maybe I'll warm up to it when I see it in person.
Anyone with a GBD wanna swing by Detroit? | | | |
|
SaintPauli
Warrior
189 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 4:23 PM |
| Here is my first try. Not sure it’s enough though.
Inspiring Marshal
Regdar, Adventurer
Tordek, Dwarf Champion (Epic)
Rikka, Angelic Avenger (Epic)
Elf Pyromancer
Crow Shaman
Ethereal Filcher
Inspiring Marshal
Regdar, Adventurer
Tordek, Dwarf Champion (Epic)
Rikka, Angelic Avenger (Epic)
Crow Shaman
Crow Shaman
Eberk, Adventurer or Aramil, Adventurer + Xeph Warrior
Rock’n Roll
SaintPauli | |
| |
|
Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 08/02/2006 4:34 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Orion72
The line breath reduces the Ballista to 5 hp, unhealable, plus taking out x Weavers. Next round, second breath ends the game.
Believe it or not, it's worse than that. Since the Ballista needs an adjacent spellcaster to fire, chances are good that spellcaster just got melted in the initial breath.
He runs up another spellcaster to power the Ballista, and on your next set of activations you fly up, crush the Ballista, then tail sweep as many casters as possible.
Over in one round.
To me, the coolest way to use the GBD in an unofficial 'tourney' is not to build a single Epic warband to take it out, but to bring four 200 point warbands. Set up five maps - the GBD's map in the center and the map for each warband along each edge of the GBD's map. Instead of map init determining the map to be played on, the winner of map init (between the warband pilot and the GBD pilot) chooses which start area to use, while the loser chooses the orientation of the map.
Then, once everybody is set, slug it out. GBD versus the adventurers. The dragon is outpointed and far out-activated, but the adventurers are going to have to coordinate and work together to have any chance of seriously hurting the dragon, as no single figure legal in a 200 point warband has any chance of facing down the dragon alone.
*That* would be cool.
--
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
|
| | You are not authorized to post a reply. |
|
| |
ActiveForums 3.7 | You must be signed in to participate in the
games. |