TroglodyteWizard89
349 Posts
    
USA
 | | 09/09/2006 7:53 AM |
| Hey guys. Ive been out of the skirmish loop for a while, but ive been trying to get back into it. A friend of mine told me that Sacred Watchers were huge in the national metagame. I have 5, and all of the other LG guys. I was wondering what the most solid build was with Sacred watchers. What Im looking at now is
Couatl
Marut
Sacred Watcher x4
Mialee
Timber Wolf
199 points, 8 activations
Can you guys help me out? Also, whats a good map to use these guys on. | |
Champion of Troglodytes!
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Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 09/09/2006 8:05 AM |
| The Sacred Watcher warband that you heardabout in the National meta is SWarm.Â
SWarm is the following warband:
Sword Archon
x6 Sacred Watchers
10 pt fodder piece
8 activations, ~200 pts
The Sword Archons CFX gives the fearless Sacred Watchers +5 dam for 15 damage a swing. And the Incoporal of the Sacred Watchers is a real pain for something that does cannot deal with it (is Chill Touch of Ghost Touch ability).Â
Basically you keep the SW's in CFX and swarm your opponent with them.Â
This warband does have its weaknesses though - high AC pieces, Zakya Rakshasa'a, fast pieces.Â
Sacred Watchers are a great piece either way. They fit in most LG warbands and can act as great blockers / targets that are 50 / 50 missed with any given attack. In general they can be a real pain to your opponent in most any LG warband.Â
Cheers. Â
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Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
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Maezer
Skirmisher
14 Posts
| | 09/09/2006 2:09 PM |
| I think a very key point that keeps being missed in these Sacred Watcher threads is point denial strategies.Â
Now the sacred watcher is a very efficently costed piece, and certainly can win matches just based on the charge into the middle of the field and hack it out strategy. In addition, you'll win a few more as your opponent misses more incorpereal checks than the law of averages would anticipate.
When you see this band doing well in the major tournaments, it almost always took advantage of point denial. Ideally you can get ahead on VP and fodder kills, and then hide until the hour is out.Â
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Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 09/10/2006 4:44 AM |
| I agree very much that SWarm is and can be used as a point denial warband. A skilled opponent will not allow the SWarm warabnd to do this though and he try to make them attack. It basically becomes a make the Incorporal checks you winn, miss the Incorporal checks and you loose (unless you are properly equipped).Â
Every time I have faced a SWarm warband they have attacked / swarmed me with their Sacred Watchers. 3 of these 4 times I had either Zakya's or Tordek to successfully counter them. The other time I did not and I missed almost all of the Incorporal checks. You can guess the result.Â
Cheers.
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Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
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TroglodyteWizard89
349 Posts
USA
| | 09/10/2006 11:29 AM |
| | So, SWarm is a point denial warband for the most part it seems. Is there an existing combat oriented SW band? SWarm seems devastating in both. I used a variant with 5 watchers and it was devastating. I think the best thing about this band is the option of point denial or combat. Has anyone tried working in some protection for the Sword Archon? Warforged Bodyguard might be an option, but I havent tried it. Is it worth it? | |
Champion of Troglodytes!
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Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 09/11/2006 8:17 AM |
| | I faced and narrowly lost to a band with a Sword Archon, 2 WF Bodyguards, 2 Watchers, a Healer and some other stuff. This was with my Rakshasa-led LE Quad. There are a few variants that aren't bad at all. | | | |
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Lynxen
Skirmisher
16 Posts
Canada
| | 09/13/2006 4:41 PM |
| Don't just think of the SW as a LG piece. When uses with 2 Grim Necormancers, you can summon two sacared watchers into the skirmish. Try this warband.
Grim Necromancer x2
Helmed Horror
Ghostly Consort
Dire Guard
Skeletal Equiceph x2
Summon in the two sacared watchers and its not a bad warband. You get alot of undead resistances and fearless on all your undead plus 2 Grim Necromancers to nock down the AC of your opponets heavy hitters.
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Fate must have a sense of humor. Why else would you have so easily been delivered into my hands? | |
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Faragdar the Wise
Commander
3547 Posts
Albuquerque, NM, USA
| | 09/13/2006 9:17 PM |
| Posted By Lynxen on 09/13/2006 4:41 PM
Don't just think of the SW as a LG piece. When uses with 2 Grim Necormancers, you can summon two sacared watchers into the skirmish.
In general, I don't think that's a good idea. With bands like these, you can't force your opponent to face off with the Sacred Watchers. Why would they, when they can just bypass them and eliminate them by whacking the exceedingly squishy Grim Necromancers? Another drawback is that they suffer in a match against LG Sacred Watchers. The LG Watchers do 20 damage to LE Watchers (25 with a Sword Archon--though that difference doesn't generally matter much to a 30 hp undead creature), while the LE ones do just 10 damage to the LG ones. | |
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XAos
Underboss
2413 Posts
London
| | 09/14/2006 8:32 AM |
| Posted By TroglodyteWizard89 on 09/10/2006 11:29 AM
So, SWarm is a point denial warband for the most part it seems. Is there an existing combat oriented SW band?
SWarm is an aggresive warband.
If it was designed for point denial, it would replace the excessivly vulnerable 80 point Sword Archon. with something a lot more defensive.
I know of 2 other warbands using Scared Watchers.
Marut + 7 Sacred Watchers.
Alusair + Sacred Watchers & filler. A charge for 20 damage that goes "streight through a wall"Â can be a nasty surprise.
Note; Â It's almost "through the wall", you only need to see one corner of the target figure, to declare the charge.
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 09/15/2006 3:01 AM |
| | some Germans are playing with 5-6 Watchers the Cleric of Syreth and other stuff. I think that's quit a good band. | |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
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Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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darthpoke
Skirmisher
39 Posts
| | 09/15/2006 3:30 AM |
| | Isolated, the SW works great as a screener or flanker. Try using it with the Gim Necromancer and Artemis Entreri for some fun! | |
Trades thread:
http://www.maxminis.com/trade/default.asp?user=darthpoke
Trading Refs:
On MaxMinis: http://www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14191
On Wizards:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=566273
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 09/15/2006 3:59 AM |
| | the Grim Necromancer is to quishy and when you kill him, then your Watcher dies too. And every watcher in LG will hit you for 15 instead of 10 damage (without rolling incorporeal) | |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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iluvxtina
Underboss
1501 Posts
Spain
| | 09/15/2006 6:40 AM |
| | everybody say this is a competitive piece but the truth is I have never seen a swarm winning a tournament (epic and non epic).Swarm is a good warband but I think it is not powerful enough to beat GAS,triple horror,marut+bodyguard and the true tier 1 warbands in 200 points.At least in playing zone.Sacred watcher is an interesting piece but 18 points....Cursed spirit is much more useful with its cursed aura and its 11 points.But I have to admit the sacred is a useful piece but not one of the most.I have tryed swarm two times and both lost,because sword archon is easy to kill | |
LOVE THIS GIRL | |
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Lord_rock
Underboss
2045 Posts
Portland OR
| | 09/16/2006 9:47 AM |
| when i first used watchers I didn't have enough of them for proper swarm...
sword archon
justice archon
dwarf artificer
mialee
t wolf
watchers
it has to be even more agressive once combat starts... the justice
archon just adds insult to injury vs. CE... it's great... fought a lot
of hill giant barbs at the time and didn't lose to them... more
offensive potential and a bit of defense to make up for lack of
watchers...
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Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
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RobWreck
Warrior
295 Posts
| | 09/22/2006 11:32 PM |
| How's this for a SW idea?
82 Sword Archon
64 Warforged Bodyguard (x2)
54 Sacred Watcher (x3)
-------------------------------------
200 pt/ 6 Act.
Yeah, it's light on activations, but in this case, with the twin bodyguards, the Sword Archon can duke it out for a while and not be taken out easily. Meanwhile, the B'Guards are Fearless under his command and get the +5 damage on their attacks. To have the Sword Archon no longer be the weak spot in the band means that you're more able to dish out the damage...
Rob
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Champion of Aspect of Pelor
If the Founding Fathers of our country were conservatives, we'd still be colonies of England... | |
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dj-chuckles
Underboss
2455 Posts
The State that invented Spam!
| | 09/22/2006 11:44 PM |
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Posted By RobWreck on 09/22/2006 11:32 PM
How's this for a SW idea?
82 Sword Archon
64 Warforged Bodyguard (x2)
54 Sacred Watcher (x3)
-------------------------------------
200 pt/ 6 Act.
Yeah, it's light on activations, but in this case, with the twin bodyguards, the Sword Archon can duke it out for a while and not be taken out easily. Meanwhile, the B'Guards are Fearless under his command and get the +5 damage on their attacks. To have the Sword Archon no longer be the weak spot in the band means that you're more able to dish out the damage...
Rob
I like this army. I'm gonna try it soon
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Posted By WakeXX on 09/25/2006 4:49 AM OMG DJ!This has to be the spammiest spam thread ever! 
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Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 09/23/2006 7:31 AM |
| Posted By RobWreck on 09/22/2006 11:32 PM
How's this for a SW idea?
82 Sword Archon
64 Warforged Bodyguard (x2)
54 Sacred Watcher (x3)
-------------------------------------
200 pt/ 6 Act.
Yeah, it's light on activations, but in this case, with the twin bodyguards, the Sword Archon can duke it out for a while and not be taken out easily. Meanwhile, the B'Guards are Fearless under his command and get the +5 damage on their attacks. To have the Sword Archon no longer be the weak spot in the band means that you're more able to dish out the damage...
Rob
It looks like an interesting warband. Â
But IMO a little short on activations at 6. A warband with 8 or more activations might cause a lot of problems. Also, the low level of the WFB (lvl 6, but fearless) make it susceptible to failing other saves.Â
Overall, it might be fun to play.Â
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Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
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Low Key
Underboss
1231 Posts
| | 09/23/2006 7:52 AM |
| Posted By RobWreck on 09/22/2006 11:32 PM
How's this for a SW idea?
82 Sword Archon
64 Warforged Bodyguard (x2)
54 Sacred Watcher (x3)
-------------------------------------
200 pt/ 6 Act.
Yeah, it's light on activations, but in this case, with the twin bodyguards, the Sword Archon can duke it out for a while and not be taken out easily. Meanwhile, the B'Guards are Fearless under his command and get the +5 damage on their attacks. To have the Sword Archon no longer be the weak spot in the band means that you're more able to dish out the damage...
Rob
I'd drop one of the Sacred Wathers, and replace with Standard Bearer, Timebr Wolf and Man-at-Arms. That way you get full activations, a VP grapper and countersong. | |
Champion of the Sarrukh | |
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troll4death
Sneak
99 Posts
Whitewater, Wisconsin
| | 09/24/2006 10:46 PM |
| Heres what I like:
Sword Archon 82pts
War Weaver 33pts
Sacred Watcher X4 72pts
Man at Arms 3pts
Standerd Bearer
SNAKE SWIFTNESS!!!!! But so much more magic weapon on the Sacred
watcher +1 and magic damage not bad deal. What do you guys think?
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Low Key
Underboss
1231 Posts
| | 09/25/2006 7:08 AM |
| | The War Weaver build is pretty interesting, too. Sword Archon is a bit scary with SS backing it up. It might be squishy, but it will do alot of damage. | |
Champion of the Sarrukh | |
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MAURIZIO
Sergeant
960 Posts
Lima, Perú
| | 09/25/2006 10:37 PM |
| Posted By troll4death on 09/24/2006 10:46 PM
Heres what I like:
Sword Archon 82pts
War Weaver 33pts
Sacred Watcher X4 72pts
Man at Arms 3pts
Standerd Bearer
SNAKE SWIFTNESS!!!!! But so much more magic weapon on the Sacred watcher +1 and magic damage not bad deal. What do you guys think?
you can use instead of 1 SW and M@AÂ (total of 21 points), something like Warforged scout (8pts)Â for VP, and some tech like Aramil, adventurer (13pts) Â using Ray of Enfeblement to weak enemy hitters.
It´s a choice, of course you loose some damage, but you have some magic to weak heavy hitters! | |
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