Kypdurron
Underboss
1206 Posts
    
Broken Hill
 | | 11/21/2006 3:22 PM |
| So I wanted to share my skirmish experience from last night
Shadow Dancers = AWESOME
It was my first go at constructed since Blood wars as released and I had been wanting to use shadow dancers I was going to team them up with Storm Silverhand for the fearlessness she grants but as I was flicking through the stat cards a plan formed As I came across an old favourite piece of mine " cue evil music" Moon elf Fighter..... I have been bringing out of and sending back to retirement this piece for years as I strive to find an effective use for that awesome comander effect .
So anyways heres the Band I took
 Moon elf Fighter 49 pts
Shadow Dancer 28 pts
Shadow Dancer 28 pts
 Shadow Dancer 28 pts
 Storm Archer 33 pts
Wizard Tactician 27pts
Tavern Brawler 4pts
Xeph Warrior 3 pts
Alright so the plan was simple keep everyone within 6 of MEF try to make em go where I want and whittle their activations with the Storm archer , Tacticians magic missle and the threat of jumping shadow dancers.... Then when the time is right pick a key piece. eg. commmander or squishy support or isolated hitter or titan and jump all 3 shadow dancers to it and lay on some damage if not more
 Then you bigbys slapping hand the target it is important to make sure your shadow dancers are flanking so as to get the sneak attack damage
Now hopefully target is destroyed..
MY favourite thing as ignoring attacks of opportunity with the shadow dancers by using the defensive roll ability then jumping away to either attack another more valuable piece or to exit his attack range which as I had ranged support worked in my favour.
Now Im not saying this is tier 1 or anything like that ...as it has some glaring problems namely constructs and Undead but it was really fun to play and could surprise a lot of bands. | |
my trade data
email
Completed trades:Nixlord,Lexander , DarkFather x2 ,minotoman38 x2, Mojoical, Smilin Irish, Smithmeg, Bugsy, Doone, gmd316,Bossman.Dargoth
Bad Trades:Chaotic Good ,
,Champion Of Plush Wrackspawn | |
|
Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 11/21/2006 4:17 PM |
| oooooh, that is such an evil warband idea.Â
I really like it. Nice.Â
Even if your Shadow Dancers are based at some point, the Definsive Roll at least keeps the damage off them for 1 swing. Plus, the Moon Elf Fighter is a pretty decent clean up hitter and with speed 9 she can get there.Â
My only remotely possible suggestion would be an Elf Warrior for the extra ranged attack at +3.Â
I too have been scratching my head on how to build a Shadow Dancers warband. Maybe my prayers have been answered.Â
| |
Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
|
Zoons
Underboss
1067 Posts
| | 11/21/2006 4:38 PM |
| Haven't figured out how best to use them either, but I like the piece.  Looks like a fun warband too.
  | |
Never teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of time and it annoys the pig.
Champion of the Blink Dog. | |
|
Vrecknidj
Warlord
10493 Posts
United States
| | 11/21/2006 4:49 PM |
| I like the general idea. Being able to drop the empowered magic missile on anyone, and with the Moon Elf you're able to do it any time, is nice. It's a lot of points to pay for a one-time surprise, but, it's not like the piece is helpless afterward.
The glaring problem of constructs and undead is still only a problem. It might be possible, depending upon what kind of hate band you face, to just acquire assault points and play keep-away for as long as possible.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
|
iluvxtina
Underboss
1501 Posts
Spain
| | 11/22/2006 2:29 AM |
| | I want my shadowdancers...NOW!I,m very angry because BW has not been released in europe yet.ARGGGh! | |
LOVE THIS GIRL | |
|
Sean-Khan
Commander
2731 Posts
| |
Kat_Dawg33
Warrior
291 Posts
USA
| | 11/22/2006 5:23 AM |
| Question: Do you need to use the defensive roll ability to avoid attacks of opportunity, or does the "swift" Shadow Jump avoid the attack of opportunity? I thought, and could be very wrong, that on the teleport temple map one could teleport away as a swift action and avoid the attack of opportunity... and I was thinking the Shadow Jump would be the same?
Anyway, I too like the Shadow Dancers and have played them twice with good success.
I used:
Inspired Martial
Crow Shaman
Shadow Dancer x2
Storm Archer x2
Nebin, Gnome Illusionist
Timber Wolf
This band wasn't so much about the Shadow Dancer as much as I was trying to use the Storm Archers and I thought the Shadow Dancers might be what I needed to help keep the threat away from the Archers. Instead, it opened my eyes to the possabilities of the Dancers.
So then I used:
Champion of Eilistraee
Warforged Barbarian
Shadow Dancer x2
Nebin, Gnome Illusionist
Gray Cloak Ranger + Wolf
Lolth Sting x2
The Stings, with Ghost Step, were great in helping set up flanks. One time I was able to see a figure, but I jumped to a spot that allowed me a charge, I had a Sting in place for the flank, and the Champion of Eilistraee was close enough... +19 to hit. | |
Champion of "Ember, Monk Champion"
Vindicated Champion of the "Mounted Dragon Knight" | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 5:47 AM |
| | Shadow Jump isn't movement, and it avoids attacks of opportunity. | | | |
|
tundrin
Sergeant
424 Posts
Randolph, NJ
| | 11/22/2006 5:55 AM |
| I ask for a clarification on the jumping. I used her in Prerelease to good effect but therre were two interpretations of the jump ability.
Does she jump to another space that she can see, that is next to a wall that she can see.
OR
To ANY space that borders a wall, as long as she can see a piece of that wall (and therefore jump to a space that she cannot see directly but is along a wall that she can see)
The first makes her good, the second is even better. | |
Champs 2007 Top 16, Team Amish Class of 2007
Seeking Northern NJ DDM'ers - "There can be only one" (I hope not)
Champion of the Doppleganger | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 6:14 AM |
| | She has to be able to see the space she's jumping to, AND that space must be bordered by a wall (meaning a wall on at least one side, not a wall at the corner). | | | |
|
Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7715 Posts
| |
Vrecknidj
Warlord
10493 Posts
United States
| | 11/22/2006 6:29 AM |
| And wasn't there a rule that the borders of the map, if they aren't clearly illustrated as a wall, then they're not a wall (even though for skirmish purposes, they're wall-like in that you can't go through them)?
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 6:30 AM |
| | The Dancer needs to meet the conditions for a legal charge before she starts moving. She must have a clear path from her current position to the nearest square adjacent to the enemy, it must be the nearest enemy she can see, etc. She can swift Jump before moving in order to create a charge opportunity that wasn't available from her starting point, but she can't begin an illegal charge and then make it legal by Jumping around or through a wall. | | | |
|
Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7715 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 6:32 AM |
| | So, if she has line of sight to the closest enemy figure (but perhaps not a clear path), she jumps to a clear path, then charges that same enemy, it's all good? | |
Greyhaze's DDM Spoilers
Champion of a Medium Dog & then a Darkenbeast , Raistlin Majere, Nightmare WDQ25/60, Warduke WD60/60,
Anti-Champion of Guns, "Knight of Bugbears", and Joke Champion of Venger.
Called Shots: Frost Giant in Dangerous Delves. | |
|
Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 6:50 AM |
| Actually, if she Jumps first, charge conditions are determined based on her new starting square. She doesn't need to see any enemy at all before she Jumps, or she can see one enemy but Jump and charge a different one.
| | | |
|
Duke of Spoils
greyhaze
Warlord
7715 Posts
| |
tundrin
Sergeant
424 Posts
Randolph, NJ
| | 11/22/2006 8:00 AM |
| And you can stack charge and flanking(?)
Her attack bonus is OK to start, adding in the flank, and then a charge makes it pretty good. Then the 20 magic damage is nice.
Since she is holding two weapons, I would have liked to have seen a second attack, even +5 for 5 non magic. Thinking about comparing it to Slayer of Domiel. The second attack would make that sneak attack bonus be VERY useful. | |
Champs 2007 Top 16, Team Amish Class of 2007
Seeking Northern NJ DDM'ers - "There can be only one" (I hope not)
Champion of the Doppleganger | |
|
Chairman7w
Sergeant
484 Posts
| | 11/22/2006 8:54 AM |
| Yep, a guy won our Weekly league event using a triple Shadowdancer band with a Storm Silverhand, Half Ogre Barbarian and Gnome Trickster.
Three invisible Shadow Dancers are very solid!!! A great band. | |
Dr. Simon: A phrase that's encoded in her brain, that makes her fall asleep. If I speak the words, "Eta...
Jayne: Well don't say it!
Zoë: It only works on her, Jayne. | |
|
iluvxtina
Underboss
1501 Posts
Spain
| | 11/23/2006 4:19 AM |
| | I think shadowdancer is one of the most useful pieces in BW and maybe a true tier 1 piece.She can be easily added to an archmage warband with inspiring marshall,right?And more...Its desing is so cool...a ninja woman...i,ll use her a lot for sure | |
LOVE THIS GIRL | |
|
Chairman7w
Sergeant
484 Posts
| | 11/23/2006 2:06 PM |
| Posted By iluvxtina on 11/23/2006 4:19 AM
I think shadowdancer is one of the most useful pieces in BW and maybe a true tier 1 piece.She can be easily added to an archmage warband with inspiring marshall,right?And more...Its desing is so cool...a ninja woman...i,ll use her a lot for sure
Waitaminute, weren't you saying that there were no Tier 1 pieces in Bloodwar, just a couple of weeks ago?
I seem to remember you saying it was not a very good set.
| |
Dr. Simon: A phrase that's encoded in her brain, that makes her fall asleep. If I speak the words, "Eta...
Jayne: Well don't say it!
Zoë: It only works on her, Jayne. | |
|
iluvxtina
Underboss
1501 Posts
Spain
| | 11/24/2006 5:08 AM |
| oh....I have said that?I do not remember my friend.Bloodwars is cool and a lot fo its pieces could be tier 1.Remember I am european so I do not have test it yet.I have said that I think underdark is a best set but not bloodwars is a bad one.But if I have said that,I was mistaken.Right? | |
LOVE THIS GIRL | |
|
Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 11/24/2006 5:19 AM |
| Posted By iluvxtina on 11/24/2006 5:08 AM oh....I have said that?I do not remember my friend.Bloodwars is cool and a lot fo its pieces could be tier 1.Remember I am european so I do not have test it yet.I have said that I think underdark is a best set but not bloodwars is a bad one.But if I have said that,I was mistaken.Right?
We'll let it slide this time.Â
On a serious note, keep up the good inputs, especially once you get your Blood Wars figures and have
had some time play with the new toys.Â
Cheers.Â
Â
| |
Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
|
Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 11/29/2006 11:33 PM |
| | I've used multiple dancers with great success. Constructs and undead are its bane. Maugs and SW and such. It is possible to design a band completely around the dancer as the main offense and dominate. Almost every band has juicy targets for the sneak attack. Think of the dancer as a better Rikka. The shadow dancer is cheaper, has higher level, same speed, same AC, more HP (When you factor in the Def Roll), more maneuvarability (This is a huge advantage over Rikka who needs to waylay into a vulnerable position sometimes - the two jumps are way way better). When used properly the dancers as a team will be swinging at +15 for 20 magic just like Rikka. They are much more survivable as Rikka almost always routes after taking 40 damage. The Dancer can Def Roll 15-30 damage attacks and avoid auto crits and stuns and such and then get away. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
|
Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 11/30/2006 12:43 AM |
| Posted By Chad the DragonLordofAiur on 11/29/2006 11:33 PM
I've used multiple dancers with great success. Constructs and undead are its bane. Maugs and SW and such. It is possible to design a band completely around the dancer as the main offense and dominate. Almost every band has juicy targets for the sneak attack. Think of the dancer as a better Rikka. The shadow dancer is cheaper, has higher level, same speed, same AC, more HP (When you factor in the Def Roll), more maneuvarability (This is a huge advantage over Rikka who needs to waylay into a vulnerable position sometimes - the two jumps are way way better). When used properly the dancers as a team will be swinging at +15 for 20 magic just like Rikka. They are much more survivable as Rikka almost always routes after taking 40 damage. The Dancer can Def Roll 15-30 damage attacks and avoid auto crits and stuns and such and then get away.
But do the Shadow Dancers have resistences, SR or DR? So I think there both good figures but for me they don't fill the same roll.
Anyway I like that Warband most:
Moon Elf Fighter 49
Gnome Trickster 27
Rikka, Angelic Avenger 31
3x Shadowdancer 84
Mialee, Elf Wizard 6
Xeph Warrior 3
There are two real good maps, either Tomb of Queen Peregrine as well as Mithral Mines.
If Rikka is waylayed right then you can get +15 / +15 / +14 / +15 for 20 magic damage each in the first round. In the second you can all your dancers use there 2nd jump to get back to your commander and Trickster and cast Invisible on them. Hopefully you killed a good piece with that 80 Damage (Couatl, Coda, Dragonmarked, and so one). Because after that round Rikka will likely make morale or die.
| |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
|
Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 11/30/2006 3:58 AM |
| In my eyes they do fill the same role. I've usually seen Rikka used to waylay and then attack the support or commanders. The shadow dancers are used to attack the soft support. Some people try to bring Rikka in as melee support but she usually gets creamed because of her low AC and level. She can be used as a spell blocker but her resistances don't affect the outcome nearly as much as the shadow dancer's jumps will. I suppose if people use Rikka correctly she is very good but most people do not.
To me the Shadow Dancer fills the role of support assassin much better than Rikka does. Rikka's role in the metagame is unclear right now. I feel the Shadow Dancer replaces her as support assassin as I described above. Rikka does have the resistances you described and she does have flight and will always do 20 magic (Not situational like the Dancer) so perhaps someone can discover a role for her where those abilities would make her more suitable than the Dancer. But for me I will look at the Dancer as my choice over Rikka most of the time. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
|
Lord_rock
Underboss
2045 Posts
Portland OR
| | 11/30/2006 5:59 PM |
| rikka was like an ace up my sleeve in the underdark sealed tourny... just when my opponent would be getting things handled... i waylay rikka this round... suddenly my opponent didn't think he had things handled anymore...
Rikka requires either a great commander (something CG isn't known for) or to never make a moral save... when i utilized her she seldom had to make one... She is a finisher and endgame piece that can't be taken for easy points without melee assault... and if you opponent decides to take her out whatever they were taking out is no longer in danger equating to your opponent "wasting resources" in the early game... ignore her and she never makes a save... once again an interesting piece...
I do like the idea of using her with a shadowdancer. together they can take out most support pieces or even route most hitters... Don't know yet though... just don't know...
Shadow dancers are the real deal, i say... until proven otherwise... | |
Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
|
Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 12/01/2006 12:47 AM |
| Rikka and the Shadow Dancer don't fill the same roll because of Rikka's low save. You said they're both commander/Tech Hunters. But to be great in that job you must have either a high chance of not getting hit (conceal, incorporeal, high AC), absorb damage (defensive roll), lots of HP with a good level (7-10). So Rikka fails to be in one of this categories, while the Shadowdancer is not.
As a Tilegrabber Rikka isn't cheap enough so she fails there too.
But hat is her role?
I would describe it as tactic stopper. If you play her with either the Free League or the Satyr you can leave her off the Board to press on your oponnents tactic. Because you can have a +4 higher Initiative and can bring her in places where she can hunt single pieces. So your opponent is limited to group his figures together so he can react on a near waylayed Rikka, or to avoid the victory areas with his key commander/Tech/only Tilegrabber. If he does the first thing (bunch figures together) you setup your figures in good distance to him (like GMA-full attack distance) because if you do that he has a hard time to thing abou his next to activations. Shall he use his next two activations to engage you early and denie you your positioning (knowing that this will leave a defensive hole where Rikka fly in)? Or does he stay with his hitters near the tech and give you the better strike position next round (knowing that you will use your +4 ini and waylay Rikka anyway)?
If he chose the second option (avoid tech near to VA) then you must take advantage of that. Place your figures in squares where he only can see you if he moves near a victory area. Or place you figures in a spot where your opponent can engage you but will be trapped between your forces and his own VA (with Rikka coming next round striking his backline).
Another tactic stop is to avoid getting beat by Ranged units and spells. If you loose map ini and your opponent has the advantage of shooting easily at you units choose Rikka as a Blocker. She will only take 2 or 3 hits before routing but you will have a chance letting her stay in most cases rolling an 11. So he has to take more shots on her.
| |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
|
JohnnyFive
Warrior
207 Posts
| | 12/01/2006 9:39 AM |
| The main difference, tactically speaking, between Rikka and the Shadowdancer, IMHO, are the types of pieces they need to encounter in order to be the most useful. For Rikka, these pieces are often the more squishy-yet-important pieces, such as commanders and ranged pieces, who are often relegated to the back lines and stay out of melee. As we all know, she excels at getting past the front lines and getting to those pieces.
The Shadowdancer, however, generally needs to engage the heavier-hitting (living) targets in an opponent's warband, to make the most of her Defensive Roll ability. On top of this, your Shadowdancer needs a partner in order to make her offensive capability shine, which means that the Shadowdancer is typically more of an in-the-fray type piece than Rikka is.
I think both of these pieces still have viable places in CG warbands, and maybe with the right build, they could be extremely effective side-by-side. But, looking at the current meta, I'd argue that current conditions favor the Shadowdancer over Rikka in a piece-by-piece comparison. | |
Champion of the Elf Duskblade | |
|
tundrin
Sergeant
424 Posts
Randolph, NJ
| | 12/01/2006 10:10 AM |
| That sounds like a double edge for the Dancer.
Rikka will likley be on the far side of a map, likely out of command, and more prone to fail MC.
The Dancer is more likely to be surrounding a main hitter, who is likely up front, meaning the dancers are under command (and fearless with Storm or at least with a decent MC chance with moon elf - her two most common commanders)
Plus with defensive roll, the Dancer can elude the first hit, and has a swift move to get back out of trouble, a taking off Rikka will still incur an aoo.
The other benefit they gave the Dancer is HIDE. When you lose map init and get stuck on King's Road or Dragon Grotto, with little hopping opportunities, you can still at least move around in the trees pseudo-invisible.
Now we have to work on anti-dancer bands
auto damage spells, area of effect (to probably catch multiple swarming dancers) illuminator or blindsight etc (useful also considering how many bands have tricksters in them, and the usual constructs and undead. | |
Champs 2007 Top 16, Team Amish Class of 2007
Seeking Northern NJ DDM'ers - "There can be only one" (I hope not)
Champion of the Doppleganger | |
|
Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 12/01/2006 11:20 AM |
| | You don't need a counter to them. They aren't that good that they change meta. They're more like the Ballista ill efficienct against certain types of creatures or on certain maps, but they to all else they aren't that great. | |
My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
|
Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 12/01/2006 11:34 AM |
| @Janos - everything you say about Rikka can apply to the Shadow Dancer as well. Think about it, read your post and apply it using the Dancer in place of Rikka.  That is the exact same role. The Shadow Dancer does all of that and more. Rikka can only pop in on a VA. The Dancer can pop in almost anywhere on the board. And, to top it all off, the Dancer has a second jump to run away or to return to the main battle. Rikka is stuck sometimes and can only return with a double move and possibly provoke an AoO. And, to top it off some more, the Dancer can leave and Def Roll the AoO, Rikka can't. Those two things right there make the Dancer superior to Rikka.
@JohnnyFive - The advantage the Dancer has is that she can do both equally well. Attack the hitters as flanking support OR attack the back line tech support and commanders. She is not limited as you say. With two jumps she is never away from the battle. She can jump in and attack support and then DefRoll any AoO and jump back in to flank the hitter all without wasting any activations to a double move.
@Everyone - I'll let you in on a little secret. Make the Dancers invisble and the first attack is a sneak attack, no partner needed. Second dancer pops in - bang, 40 damage to something thats going to hurt severely and still be double based if it lives. Both Dancers can still DefRoll the counter attack and jump away.
I've piloted bands using four invisble dancers and won with them. Sometimes very easily. Almost every band has something vulnerable to sneak attack. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
|
Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 12/01/2006 11:51 AM |
| | I beg to differ - to all else they are very good. Not unbeatable but still very good. Certainly better than "not all that great". | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
|
Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 12/01/2006 11:54 AM |
| | Watch how fast four of them bring down a Fire Giant. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
|
jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 12/01/2006 12:09 PM |
| No fair quoting people across threads... if you start doing that, people actually have to think before speaking!
My version was a bit simpler:
Moon Elf (49 - 1)
Shadowdancer X5 (140 - 6)
Devis (6 - 1)
Timber Wolf (5 - 1)
200 Points - Dragonshrine
As this is primarily a fun warband, I think it is better to stick to the theme and the sudden punch of 5 Shadowdancers railing on enemies all at once... | |
Champion of Meepo _*_ Myztek on the Wizards Boards. _*_ (2206 DDM on 03/06/06)
Please note: The use of the indicates an attempt at humor ... often a bad attempt.
BAD EBAY SELLERS LIST (CLICK HERE): AVOID AT ALL COSTS
| |
|
Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 12/01/2006 12:16 PM |
| Very impressive, Kyp - I've been playing a Storm/Shadowdancer band occasionally on VASSAL and doing very well, and I'll be bringing one very similar to yours to our local event tomorrow: Storm Silverhand
Shadowdancer x3
Gnome Trickster
Wizard Tactician
Timber Wolf I'd been wondering about the value of swapping Storm for a Moon Elf Fighter, as it didn't seem as in most of my matches that the Shadowdancers really needed to be Fearless - usually only one was hit hard enough to force a morale save. (Then again, that might be a side-effect of the Fearlessness - rather than go after each one and force a MC, the opponent realizes that he has to eliminate one to drop the damage output.) The Wizard Tac's Bigby's slapping hand is especially good against living, high HP but low save targets like the Bluespawn Stormlizard, Dire Bears, Hill Giant Barbarians, etc. And don't forget that the Trickster has Sneak Attack as well! --
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
|
Sirohk
Commander
3938 Posts
USA
| | 12/01/2006 3:00 PM |
| Posted By Chad the DragonLordofAiur on 12/01/2006 11:34 AM
@Everyone - I'll let you in on a little secret. Make the Dancers invisble and the first attack is a sneak attack, no partner needed. Second dancer pops in - bang, 40 damage to something thats going to hurt severely and still be double based if it lives. Both Dancers can still DefRoll the counter attack and jump away.
I've piloted bands using four invisble dancers and won with them. Sometimes very easily. Almost every band has something vulnerable to sneak attack.
Chad - Thanks for the tip. I was thinking about how devastating such a move would be. In my head it looked too hard to consistently pull off. Then...
Posted By Chad the DragonLordofAiur on 12/01/2006 11:54 AM
Watch how fast four of them bring down a Fire Giant.
I saw such a Shadowdancer/Storm warband on Vassal totally destroy a FGFP warband. It was a little scary as I love the big fella and sad to see him go down so fast / easily.Â
A lot of folks (including myself) do not fully understand how to sneak attack. But we're learning.Â
And I totally agree with your assesment on Shadowdancer and Rikka.Â
| |
Sirohk, the Bard of Heartstone
Knight of the Rahshasa's
And Crusader of the Zakya, Ak'chazar, Naztharune, and Naityan Rakshasa's | |
|
nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
| |
jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 12/01/2006 5:29 PM |
| | The Shadowdancer is a nice piece, but it isn't too powerful. It is just strong in the current metagame because a lot of people are focused on titanish pieces (FGFP, Kord, Marut, etc...) that feel the effects of the defensive roll at a much greater level. The presence of the defensive roll ability is a pretty neat way to force people back towards non-titan beaters... | |
Champion of Meepo _*_ Myztek on the Wizards Boards. _*_ (2206 DDM on 03/06/06)
Please note: The use of the indicates an attempt at humor ... often a bad attempt.
BAD EBAY SELLERS LIST (CLICK HERE): AVOID AT ALL COSTS
| |
|
nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
| |
Lord_rock
Underboss
2045 Posts
Portland OR
| | 12/01/2006 5:47 PM |
| | a few dancers is one thing but 4-5 hmmm... I think the law of variance beats that one up a bit... I can see using 2... I havn't got to play enough though so things could still change my mind... Typically though i alway choose to run different figs rather than multiples... | |
Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
|