The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
    
 | | 05/11/2005 3:10 PM |
| | recovered topic 3505 | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 3:10 PM |
| | 3/3.5 is better to me simply because it so much easier to teach new players. THAC0, the old saves system were just to hard to use unless you knew the system well. | |
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CarrionCrawler
Underboss
1760 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 3:25 PM |
| | 3.0 and 3.5 are collectively known as 3.x [)] | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6621 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 05/11/2005 3:31 PM |
| | I believe that 3.5 is superior in many ways (but not all) to 2.0. Your group is accustomed to 2.0 already, so that explains their attachment to it. I don't know your group dynamics. If you volunteered to DM next using 3.5, that may help sway them. There is a bit of learning to be done, but 3.5 isn't difficult to learn if everyone puts in the time to read the player's handbook. At least until it gets to the spell descriptions. That covers the basic rules fairly well. Once I adjusted to the new system, I found that I liked it a lot more. I don't see myself ever playing pre-3.x D&D again. | |
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 3:36 PM |
| Play 3e. Whether or not you liked 2e or 1e you've got to face facts that the ship has sailed. Unless you've still got a wealth of useful material and don't mind the total lack of support and new things being added to 2e, I'd really suggest 3e.
I gave my opinion on the 3e-v-previous debate. I still feel that the mechanics of 3e are more internaly consistent and that characters, etc. start and remain on a more equal footing ... but I do believe the system has lost some of its inherent mystery and fantastic qualities. Now magic, classes, abilities, etc. have been turned into (basically) another well-defined science. It's much better suited to tactical situations (which I love since I'm a wargamer) but loses something intangible along the way. | |
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kestrel.ca
Underboss
1677 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 3:42 PM |
| What Corim said.
Seriously, although I think at one point I was pretty conversant with 1.0/2.0 rules, 3.x is so much easier to run/play. I've even gone so far as to sell all my pre-3.x rulebooks (needed the money for minis!). | |
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Gnolaum
Sergeant
854 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 3:46 PM |
| Yeah, I'm kinda interested in DM'ing, and I won a FNM tournament last week and used the $$$ to pick up the 3.5 books...
The only problem is that there is another fellow, with a fair bit more experience, that has picked up the 2e books...
And there we are...
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 4:50 PM |
| | Why don't you just play a couple of games using either system and then do a vote on which you all prefer? | |
Bite me. | |
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 7:04 PM |
| | I still play 2E but that is because I do not have the disposable income to buy all the books I would need to run a comparable game in 3.x. The advantage I have seen in 3.x is a character can be set up from the beginning to travel a certain path. Many PC's benefit greatly from well defined tangible goals to shoot for, but there is something intangible that is lost, and it may very well be for the same reason. Character's with clearly defined game mechanics goal tend to suffer in the finer details of role-playing. Plus I have noticed that you run into more rules lawyers in 3.x for the simple reason that the rules are easier to understand and are a more "present" aspect in the game then they were in previous editions. The Nostalgic Romantic fool in me wants to tell you to play 2e, the gamer in me says 3.x | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 9:48 PM |
| I think Wynd summed it up in the last few sentences of his post.
quote:
Plus I have noticed that you run into more rules lawyers in 3.x for the simple reason that the rules are easier to understand and are a more "present" aspect in the game then they were in previous editions. The Nostalgic Romantic fool in me wants to tell you to play 2e, the gamer in me says 3.x
I can't really say, since I've only ever examined the 2E books, having never played it, but I can see exactly where this thought comes from. | |
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MerricB
Underboss
2350 Posts
Australia
| | 05/11/2005 10:04 PM |
| Although I enjoyed playing 2e, the array of options available in 3.5e makes me prefer the latter system to a considerable extent.
Cheers! | |
Merric Blackman
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Oni
Underboss
1131 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 11:32 PM |
| I enjoy both versions, and don't see why you could not play both (no not at the same time don't be silly [:P]).
Last year we played a few fast games from a lot of systems. Everything from 3.x (we use both rules at same time), L5R R&K (the game I am currently running), 2nd E., to Hackmaster.
Ever set of rules will leave you're players with a different game. I find L5R R&K brings out the best heroic deeds. 3.X lets my players make any kind of character they can imagine. Oddly enough with 2nd E., and Hackmaster my players seem best at Role-Playing.
Now that is just my group, and how they react. I am sure everyone is different. My point is experiment with you're group if you don't you may be missing out on something great.
I get so mad when people go oh god I will never try (insert odd setting world here) even as a player I would rather stop playing first. Being the old settings such as Spelljammer, and Dark Sun to the newest setting Eberron. | |
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Gnolaum
Sergeant
854 Posts
| | 05/11/2005 11:34 PM |
| | Thanks all, I'm going to push my hardest to get use 3.5e. | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
11217 Posts
The Dark and Forbidding Lands of The Necromancer.
| | 05/12/2005 7:11 AM |
| Hell, I'd still play 1st ED if I could find someone willing to play, but then again, I'm a freak.
Anyway, it would be hard for me to break away from 3rd at this point. Although I don't agree with certain things. (rampant, overused templates for instance) I find it to be a fine, smooth gaming system overall.
Something 2nd ED (or 1st) was not.
2nd also suffers from a HUGE amount of books. Making it unwieldy. Plsu, the player option books were frequently broken. | |
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2299 Posts
Toronto
| | 05/12/2005 8:31 AM |
| 2E was great fun and if you have people still wanting to work with that system, then I say trying playing both for a while just like Oni mentioned.
Give your group a chance to feel out the differences between the systems.
Personally I prefer the 3.x edition better, the problem IMO was that characters ultimately felt too much the same (a wizard is a wizard is a wizard) and I never cared for the Kit concept much, where as the Feats and PrC's of 3.x I love very much. An added bonus is that the new system is easier, which will always prove useful if you get new blood in your gaming group.
It still may not be a perfect system (broken classes, spells over-used templates) but it is immensely enjoyable. | |
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 05/12/2005 4:48 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Ghendar
...I'm a freak.
How is it fair that you're allowed to say it but if *I* said it, all Hell would break loose?
I tell yah, it's just not cricket [:D] | |
Bite me. | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
11217 Posts
The Dark and Forbidding Lands of The Necromancer.
| | 05/12/2005 6:12 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Iksander
quote:
Originally posted by Ghendar
...I'm a freak.
How is it fair that you're allowed to say it but if *I* said it, all Hell would break loose?
I tell yah, it's just not cricket [:D]
You can't announce to the world that you're a freak? You're a much bigger freak than I. [:p] | |
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Champion of the Spider Eater with rider.
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
How many times in life do you get to eat your own Cthulhu? - Posted By Pedro on 03/31/2008 2:29 | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 05/12/2005 9:11 PM |
| Overused templates are a problem with GMs though. Use them sparingly, or use them to create new creatures (think of it as that rather than X+Y).
Play whatever suits your group. If you like 2E, that's your pergoative. | |
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Darastrix Maekrix
dariustad
Warlord
6322 Posts
| | 05/13/2005 1:29 AM |
| I made the shift to 3.x rather quickly. When I got back into gaming, it was just coming out; so, I climbed on. (I had to stop due to school.)
I did play 2E, and I enjoyed it. However, I agree with others. It's an old system, now. Very little support remains for it, and none from the originating company.
Besides, I find gaming stagnates if you don't learn something new every so often. [)] | |
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 05/13/2005 3:43 AM |
| I prefer 3.x, but I came to the conclusion that you have to approach a game using the 3.x rules in a much different way than if you were running one with 2nd ed. I was still holding on to all my old habits as a long-time 2nd ed. DM and found my games wanting for 'that certain something'.
For instance, in 2nd ed, I could play fast and loose with the rules. I could add a rule in on a whim without causing any upset, and thus experiment with different rules even during the same session!
But with 3.x, I think you have to be much more careful about the introduction or creation of new or variant rules as they tend to have a much more far reaching impact since the system is so tight. Change one thing and it tends to have a cascading effect through the rest of the system which can dramatically change game-play.
I was adding in all sorts of homebrew rules to my 3.x game, with nary a thought to them (well, that's not true, I put a lot of effort in, but play-testing is always the true test), and I wondered why my players were kicking up a fuss and why my games lacked a spontenaity and excitement that I had previously.
I do prefer 3.x, but I think you've really gotta use a different style of DM'ing for it to 'work'. | |
Bite me. | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
11217 Posts
The Dark and Forbidding Lands of The Necromancer.
| | 05/13/2005 7:23 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Iksander
For instance, in 2nd ed, I could play fast and loose with the rules. I could add a rule in on a whim without causing any upset, and thus experiment with different rules even during the same session!
But with 3.x, I think you have to be much more careful about the introduction or creation of new or variant rules as they tend to have a much more far reaching impact since the system is so tight. Change one thing and it tends to have a cascading effect through the rest of the system which can dramatically change game-play.
I agree.
3rd is a much more tight system, thereby restricting (somewhat) the ability to "play fast and loose with the rules."
I prefer a looser rule base personally. It's nice to have a specific rule for just about every situation but I feel restricted by it sometimes. | |
Ghendar - Now with 51% more snark
Champion of the Spider Eater with rider.
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
How many times in life do you get to eat your own Cthulhu? - Posted By Pedro on 03/31/2008 2:29 | |
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Retired Tank
Vulturedoodle
Sergeant
791 Posts
| | 05/13/2005 8:48 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Testament
If you like 2E, that's your pergoative.
Don't you be insuting our pergoatives....
[:)] Steve F. | |
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PatEllis15
Commander
4462 Posts
| | 05/13/2005 12:30 PM |
| quote:
The Nostalgic Romantic fool in me wants to tell you to play 2e, the gamer in me says 3.x
Nastalgic Romantic? You meanyour ready to go back to the original D&D, or perhaps First edition?!
2nd edition is so full of holes... Playtesting by TSR was sacrificed to the alter of the almight dollar. It happens today with Wotc as well, but with there expeirience with Magic the Gathering, they seem much more aware of the need to keep things fairly well balanced (they same may not be said of all the d20 publishers out there.).
2nd edition is filled with supplements that are unbalanced, or unfair, they reference rules spread through the 30 or 40 different books that had been released. Making it (at times) pretty complicated to use there off the shelf material.
Stick with 3e
Pat E | |
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