The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
10836 Posts
    
In the constellation of Cygnus, or Central Connecticut
 | | 09/25/2005 2:24 PM |
| | recovered topic 9146 | |
On vacation 6/29 - 7/5
Leaning towards giving 4e the Digitus Impudicus
Champion of the Spider Eater with rider.
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
How many times in life do you get to eat your own Ctulhu? - Posted By Pedro on 03/31/2008 2:29 | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
10836 Posts
In the constellation of Cygnus, or Central Connecticut
| | 09/25/2005 2:24 PM |
| | I would like to see the summon tables expanded to include more creatures. I don't have any specific wants, I'd just like to have more options. | |
On vacation 6/29 - 7/5
Leaning towards giving 4e the Digitus Impudicus
Champion of the Spider Eater with rider.
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
How many times in life do you get to eat your own Ctulhu? - Posted By Pedro on 03/31/2008 2:29 | |
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The Mighty
jai
Commander
3235 Posts
| | 09/25/2005 4:10 PM |
| | i suspect this will show up in the complete compendiums ... | | | |
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gregreid
Warrior
276 Posts
| | 09/26/2005 12:51 AM |
| What is keeping you from adding to the Summoning List.
If you use the CR of the creature as a guideline, you should be able to subsitute without too much problem.
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Champion of the Wolf
Trades:Burned: 1 / Pending: 0 / Completed: 14
Trade Lists and References: http://www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17731
Page 11 and rising
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 09/26/2005 7:36 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by gregreid
What is keeping you from adding to the Summoning List.
If you use the CR of the creature as a guideline, you should be able to subsitute without too much problem.
CR is a horrible gauge of the use of a summoned monster. As an example, what would be the CR of a 5 hit point, 10 AC creature that can cast Heal at will? 1/2? Maybe 1? That's make it a SM I or SM II?
Now, how useful would it be as an ally? I would not let it be summoned by anything less than SM IX, if that ... | |
Champion of Meepo _*_ Myztek on the Wizards Boards. _*_ (2206 DDM on 03/06/06)
Please note: The use of the  indicates an attempt at humor ... often a bad attempt.
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 09/27/2005 7:04 AM |
| | Jgsugden makes a good point. For example, the Movanic Deva is weak enough to be on SM VII or VIII if we go by CR, but it can cast Raise Dead once per day. I'd summon them for sure! | |
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8-Bit Chibi Goths forever!
Champion of Mephistopheles
"Sorry! I was tryin' to open these beans!"
My Have/Want List, (Updated July 6 2004, will be updated soon)
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Mrfurious
Warrior
344 Posts
| | 09/27/2005 11:48 AM |
| For straight combat beaters, CR is a reasonable gauge for which summon monster to use. It starts getting messed up with spells and spell like abilities. And with the breadth of monsters out there, I doubt any easy formula would work for determining which level summon monster would be appropriate. So guestimation, comparison to other monsters on any given table, and playtesting are the only way to go.
Also one thing to note is as you add more monsters to the list, Summon monster/natures ally becomes more powerful due to added versatility so I'd advise not adding too many new options. | |
Sanity is a one trick pony, my friend, . . .but when you're good and crazy the sky is the limit.
http://www.maxminis.com/hwlist.asp?user=mrfurious
braman@che.utexas.edu | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 09/27/2005 6:03 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Mrfurious
For straight combat beaters, CR is a reasonable gauge for which summon monster to use. It starts getting messed up with spells and spell like abilities. ...
Yes and no. In general, this is a decent guide for 'beaters', but even they can have characteristics that increase or decrease their value so that CR is not a good gauge. It is rare to find a pure beater that has no special abilities that distinguish it from the crowd. Some (non spell or spell-like) characteristics that can make a creature more or less useful than its CR would indicate when summoned as an ally: DR, the number of attacks, feats, size, speed, transportation abilities (burrow, flight, swim, etc ...), etc ... | |
Champion of Meepo _*_ Myztek on the Wizards Boards. _*_ (2206 DDM on 03/06/06)
Please note: The use of the indicates an attempt at humor ... often a bad attempt.
BAD EBAY SELLERS LIST (CLICK HERE): AVOID AT ALL COSTS
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Fry
Underboss
1724 Posts
| | 09/28/2005 11:26 AM |
| | I'm trying to remember where I saw rules for permanently substituting new creatures onto your character's summon list... | |
"Why am I all sticky and naked? Did I miss something fun?"
-Vindicated champion of Tordek, Dwarf Champion | |
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2290 Posts
Toronto
| | 09/28/2005 12:04 PM |
| | If you have looked I'd suggest the Unearthed Arcana, they have a number of possible lists for summoning and talk about how to create a list. | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
Sales/Trades Bad (1): Ironfist Boulderbender
Trades/Sales completed (8.): Danthl, Dafrca, Garyaxe, qillan_dvra, realmaster, Vandal_Savage, cavedweller, unearthed arcana.
Champion of Gem Dragons, VINDICATED Squire of Duergar Commander, Knight of the Astral Stalker.
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kyrin
Commander
3136 Posts
| | 09/28/2005 5:20 PM |
| Thanks for the tip, Monsoon. I'll have to finally look at that book. The core Monster Summoning tables clash in some places with my game world. I mean, I can understand a wizard summoning something weird, but I don't think the Greek gods would send a bison or wolverine to aid their clerics...
JIM
aka kyrin | |
My Have/Want List <-|-|->My Trades and References 1 <-|-|->My Trades and References 2
Pronounce "Drow" like "crow"! Viva la Revolution! We Shall Overcome!
Vindicated Champion of the Stirge! Vindicated Champion of the Githyanki Knight on Red Dragon!!
Vindicated Champion of the Androsphinx! | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 09/28/2005 6:05 PM |
| Actually the historical distribution of the European bison went right down through the Balkans, into Thrace!
On the other hand, wolverines never got closer than Norway. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 09/28/2005 8:05 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by IanB
Actually the historical distribution of the European bison went right down through the Balkans, into Thrace!
On the other hand, wolverines never got closer than Norway.
Man, Ian, you are such a geek.
I'm jealous. | |
Champion of Meepo _*_ Myztek on the Wizards Boards. _*_ (2206 DDM on 03/06/06)
Please note: The use of the indicates an attempt at humor ... often a bad attempt.
BAD EBAY SELLERS LIST (CLICK HERE): AVOID AT ALL COSTS
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2290 Posts
Toronto
| | 09/29/2005 3:03 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
Man, Ian, you are such a geek.
I'm jealous.
LoL!
Np Kyrin, I just got the book in the mail this week in fact. Won it for 12 bucks on Ebay (was never convinced to pay full price for this one but was always interested in it. [thanks to the original being so excellent!]) The book actually discusses 'themed summoning lists' then has three sample themes: Defenders of the World Stone, Light of Heaven and Petitioners of Yeenoghu. They also discuss 'Individualized summoning lists'(with two samples). Both are useful in my opinion and they even have a behind the curtain sidebar with a list of other themes. | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
Sales/Trades Bad (1): Ironfist Boulderbender
Trades/Sales completed (8.): Danthl, Dafrca, Garyaxe, qillan_dvra, realmaster, Vandal_Savage, cavedweller, unearthed arcana.
Champion of Gem Dragons, VINDICATED Squire of Duergar Commander, Knight of the Astral Stalker.
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