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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
    
 | | 01/17/2006 9:42 PM |
| Hi Guys,
After several deaths in our game last weekend a few of us have decided to create new monk characters. One player is going with a clr/mnk/sacred fist, one player is making a githzerai monk, and I'm undecided. I'm thinking sor/mnk, or wiz/mnk, but I'm not sure. If I do go that way I'm going to try to be as dragonball z/wuxia film like as possible [:D] I don't have the complete arcane, but I hear that the enlightened fist is a pretty good PrC. I'm looking for advice on PrC's or general monk advice since I haven't really played one before. Oh, BTW, we're coming in at 9th level. Any help would be greatly apreciated. [:D] | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/17/2006 9:56 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by B
Hi Guys,
After several deaths in our game last weekend a few of us have decided to create new monk characters. One player is going with a clr/mnk/sacred fist, one player is making a githzerai monk, and I'm undecided. I'm thinking sor/mnk, or wiz/mnk, but I'm not sure. If I do go that way I'm going to try to be as dragonball z/wuxia film like as possible [:D] I don't have the complete arcane, but I hear that the enlightened fist is a pretty good PrC. I'm looking for advice on PrC's or general monk advice since I haven't really played one before. Oh, BTW, we're coming in at 9th level. Any help would be greatly apreciated. [:D]
If you are are going to be playing straight out of the players handbook, once you multi class to a class other than Monk, you can't take any more levels of Monk. There are certain societies that do allow it, such as the FR society - Monk of the Long Death.
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"Are you not entertained?" 
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 01/17/2006 10:11 PM |
| | Yeah, I knew that I couldn't freely multiclass. That's kinda why I'm looking for PrC advice. Besides, at 9th level i can just say that I took all of the sorcerer or wiz levels first or viceversa. Thanks though. [:)] | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Zenako
Commander
3472 Posts
| | 01/17/2006 10:32 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by B
Yeah, I knew that I couldn't freely multiclass. That's kinda why I'm looking for PrC advice. Besides, at 9th level i can just say that I took all of the sorcerer or wiz levels first or viceversa. Thanks though. [:)]
Will you be getting stuff comensurate with a 9th level PC as well? Will need to get items like Ring of Jumping, Boots of Striding and Springing and so forth to make some of the jumps and leaps all the more effective. I also believe that you will have to take all levels of the other class first, because once monk training begins, it cannot be interrupted or it ceases to advance. You might consider taking mostly monk levels, a few prestige monk class levels (can you use any of the Oriental Adventure Prestige Classes?) and then go into the wiz/sorceror line. Makes you a powerful warrior/MA who is now looking into arcane powers...
Like your Avatar Avatar....grin | |
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 01/17/2006 10:37 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Zenako
Will you be getting stuff comensurate with a 9th level PC as well? Will need to get items like Ring of Jumping, Boots of Striding and Springing and so forth to make some of the jumps and leaps all the more effective. I also believe that you will have to take all levels of the other class first, because once monk training begins, it cannot be interrupted or it ceases to advance. You might consider taking mostly monk levels, a few prestige monk class levels (can you use any of the Oriental Adventure Prestige Classes?) and then go into the wiz/sorceror line. Makes you a powerful warrior/MA who is now looking into arcane powers...
Like your Avatar Avatar....grin
Well, I'm note sure if we're getting full gp value for our level. I know that our DM mentioned that he believed that monks should spurn material posessions, but I'm definately looking for slippers of spider climbing at the very least [:D]
I'm pretty sure that we can use whatever PrC's we want. The basic gist is that the three of us decided to try an create different "flavoured" monks so that it wouldn't be redundant. I'm looking to be closer to the fantastic kung fu flick/dragonball z style martial artist, and that's why I was thinking of having some arcane spellcaster levels. Are there any PrC's/feats that you'd recommend?
Ps...yeah....airbender is kinda where I'm leaning right now [:D] | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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wildmage
Sneak
123 Posts
| | 01/17/2006 11:13 PM |
| The feat Extra Stunning from Complete Warrior helps you get the most out of getting in close and hitting your foes. Plus there are other feats (some are special fighting style feats) from various sources that allow you to convert Stunning Fist attempts into other mystical effects ala Crouching Tiger or Hero type moves (minus the cool swords unless your DM goes for that sort of thing).
I think monks benefit a lot from Dodge/Mobility and Spring Attack if you want to be a fast and hard hitter. If you're all going to play monks and if your monk ends up being the front-liner I could see taking Improved Toughness to up your HPs.
If you plan to take the arcane caster levels first you might want to take enough of them to get at least 2nd or 3rd level spells. There are some nice touch spells to up your damage potential as part of making melee attacks. It's always cool when a monk can wield force and fire effects along with his fists. In general monks get a lot of benefit out of even 1st level spells such as Mage Armor for defense and True Strike to make sure that the blow for a Stunning Fist attempt gets landed. | |
Champion of the Bone Naga
(There's just so much roleplaying to be done with a large skeletal snake!) | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/18/2006 1:26 AM |
| Something to take a look at is the Shadow Dancer PrC. We recently had a couple of deaths in our group and one of the players made a deep gnome Monk / Shadow Dancer. Doesn't do alot of damage, but is almost impossible to see and damn hard to hit. And even with prestige classes, you can't go back and take more levels of monk. If you want to pick up oriental adventures, the monk is a bit different but can multi-class freely.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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| Hero of the Force
Siddartha of Suburbia
Underboss
2277 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 3:39 PM |
| Has Grim already stated we should aschew the personal possessions? i was thinking about this but not heard anything from him yet.
It's not easy to go that way, as frankly the swag of adventuring is part of what makes a certain level of character up to the equivalent CR, it is assumed that they have that "x" value worth of gear. | |
"We can't stop here...This Is Bat country!"
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 3:57 PM |
| | Oh, I agree. He mentioned something in passing, but I haven't heard anything since. OH. We got another thing from that company for the thing that we can't talk about. Bab 5. nice hunh? | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 3:57 PM |
| | If you want to totally spurn all material possesions, then take a look at the totally broken "Vow of Poverty" from the Book of Exalted Deeds. [:0] I still have not met a GM that would allow it, but if yours would, it would fit perfectly. | |
"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Grim
Sergeant
482 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 4:13 PM |
| | His will not. I know him well. | |
I am a leaf on the wind...Urrk!!--Wash, "Serenity" | |
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reezel
Sergeant
555 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 4:52 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Grim
His will not. I know him well.
If that's the case, then why should that one class avoid material items? Sounds like a lame and unnecessary restriction. | |
Champion of the Beholder and Beholderkin
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 5:17 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by reezel
quote:
Originally posted by Grim
His will not. I know him well.
If that's the case, then why should that one class avoid material items? Sounds like a lame and unnecessary restriction.
I agree... There really isn't a reason to avoid material possessions. It would be very realistic to have to donate 10% or more of their income to their school, but to avoid acumulation of wealth and magic items makes PC's not up to par for the Challenge Rating system. (Not that the CR's are all that great.)
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 01/19/2006 6:31 PM |
| Up until the part where you were saying you wanted to take levels of Wiz/Sor; I was thinking the Jordain PrC from Shining South, but that would take you in the complete opposite direction.
What race were you planning on?
Sacred Fist is probably the way to go for a PrC if you want to advance in divine spellcraft or Enlightened Fist for arcane progression.
In either case your going to need to take combat casting, but if you go with cleric (or Favoured Soul/Shugenja) you only need to take one level, where as an Enlightened Fist takes three levels of an arcane class. | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
Sales/Trades Bad (1): Ironfist Boulderbender
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devasque
Sergeant
874 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 6:44 PM |
| Not sure if your DM or you are open to taking a level adjusted race for something different or flavor but that's another option for you.
- Half-dragon w/ monk levels (could leave room to delve into the Draconomicon goodies ala dragon feats etc)
- Half-celestial w/ monk levels (no wings though, guardian of the celestial court type thing)
Of course you could always be a radical and go with a wild monk/drunken fist [:D] for something fun. | |
You see! There ARE others out there just like me. What? Why are laughing? | |
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 01/19/2006 7:17 PM |
| | THE DECISION HAS BEEN MADE!! [:D] I'm going to be playing a human monk 3/sorcerer 3/enlightened fist 3. I'll be using a style that I'm working on called "Seven Storms Northern Boxing". I'm really marking out on this monk idea. I've been watching anime and kung fu flicks all week to get myself in the mood [:p] Thanks for the help guys. | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Zenako
Commander
3472 Posts
| | 01/20/2006 10:37 AM |
| Back to the possessions issue, it has no real game basis (although it might have a campaign basis). One could argue that a monk will avoid collecting wealth for wealths sake, but obtaining items of utility and power to enhance ones ability to achieve ones goals should be within the concept and characterization of the PC's in my opinion. By their very nature, monks avoid, armor, shields, many weapons, etc. They cannot carry too much or they become encumbered and lose some boons. An enchanted kimono or gi (with mainly bonuses to special things rather than just AC would be cool), and rings and amulets and shoes/boots and more all fit within the general concept.
Or prehaps you can point out that since you are no longer bound by the pure strictures of monkdom, having gone into the sorceror class and more, that all those limits are now passe as well. | |
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If I seem scarce at times...blame DDO - Sarlona | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/20/2006 1:12 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Monsoon28
In either case your going to need to take combat casting, but if you go with cleric (or Favoured Soul/Shugenja) you only need to take one level, where as an Enlightened Fist takes three levels of an arcane class.
I am not a big fan of the Combat Casting Feat, Skill Focus - Concentration actually is much more beneficial. Comabt casting gives you a + 4 concentration but only casting defensively (that actually becomes very easy at higher levels) where the skill focus gives you a + 3 in every situation.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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thedip
Sergeant
737 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 4:17 AM |
| A monk was one of the most broken characters that I ever played. He was a Half-Ogre monk with 10ft reach and combat reflexes. I counter the insane amount of damage he did I played up his restricted INT to the full. Think of a D&D version of Lennie in "Of Mice and Men".
Cheers
Thedip | |
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Pale Rider
Underboss
1023 Posts
London, Ontario, Canada
| | 01/23/2006 9:31 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by thedip
A monk was one of the most broken characters that I ever played. He was a Half-Ogre monk with 10ft reach and combat reflexes. I counter the insane amount of damage he did I played up his restricted INT to the full. Think of a D&D version of Lennie in "Of Mice and Men".
Cheers
Thedip
I think you might have that backwards. I think you meant to say the Half Ogre was the most broken race you ever played. | |
Completed Trades: Crescent Hawk, Vimes, demagogue, vidman, Eric is God, Strachan Fireblade, FungiMuncher, Dudeeehm, Shasack, gausse, kyrin, nyjastul69
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BigBC
Sergeant
620 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 9:49 AM |
| | I'm playing a warforged monk and, after reviewing the feat, my DM allowed the Vow of Poverty. It makes sense for my character since warforged technically don't require wealth anyway, and since I'm LG, giving my loot to the poor is my character's way of taking care of the others who are downtrodden and at the bottom of Eberron society, like the warforged. I only carry a kama and a sling and use my fists to exact justice. My DM gets his kicks by putting out warforged items that would be great for me, but I can't take because of the feat. He knows what a treasure hog I've been with other characters I've played. I think the main reason he allowed it is that my character is the main front-line fighter (the other characters are a rogue/wizard, warmage/archer, druid, and NPC fighter/artificer with not many hit points), and we're only sixth level right now so not very powerful yet. My feats so far were Sacred Vow (1st), Vow of Poverty (3rd), and Blind-Fight (6th) since he also likes to use darkness and invisibility, ALOT! I know that many here think the Vow of Poverty is overpowered, and I agree that some things such as Exalted Strike and the ability boosts might just be. I also know that it can lead to an alienation within the party since you can't share in party items as you aren't allowed to technically own much except some simple items. So far, my fellow party members have been very forgiving of my not sharing in on items, and hopefully that will last. Both my DM and I know that this is a powerful feat to allow, but as long as I play my character correctly he agrees with the need of it in this particular party makeup. | |
Complete: Ha, De, Ar, GoL, Ab, Dk, Af, Ud, WD, DQ, BW
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 11:16 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by BigBC
I'm playing a warforged monk and, after reviewing the feat, my DM allowed the Vow of Poverty. It makes sense for my character since warforged technically don't require wealth anyway, and since I'm LG, giving my loot to the poor is my character's way of taking care of the others who are downtrodden and at the bottom of Eberron society, like the warforged. I only carry a kama and a sling and use my fists to exact justice. My DM gets his kicks by putting out warforged items that would be great for me, but I can't take because of the feat. He knows what a treasure hog I've been with other characters I've played. I think the main reason he allowed it is that my character is the main front-line fighter (the other characters are a rogue/wizard, warmage/archer, druid, and NPC fighter/artificer with not many hit points), and we're only sixth level right now so not very powerful yet. My feats so far were Sacred Vow (1st), Vow of Poverty (3rd), and Blind-Fight (6th) since he also likes to use darkness and invisibility, ALOT! I know that many here think the Vow of Poverty is overpowered, and I agree that some things such as Exalted Strike and the ability boosts might just be. I also know that it can lead to an alienation within the party since you can't share in party items as you aren't allowed to technically own much except some simple items. So far, my fellow party members have been very forgiving of my not sharing in on items, and hopefully that will last. Both my DM and I know that this is a powerful feat to allow, but as long as I play my character correctly he agrees with the need of it in this particular party makeup.
One thing... you have already broken your Vow of Poverty. You have a Kama which is an exotic, not a simple weapon. Too bad so sad. All those abilities gone for good. [)] Well go ahead and start hording wealth now.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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BigBC
Sergeant
620 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 11:54 AM |
| | Ouch, you're absolutely correct. I confused light with simple, but it is considered exotic. Even though it's one of the few weapons monks are proficient with, it's not a simple weapon. I'll need to discuss it with the DM as I've only kept it to aid in tripping attacks and I only used it once, before I took the feat. Maybe he'll be leinent and allow me to just pretend I got rid of it when I gave away my other items. I can always hope. [:(] | |
Complete: Ha, De, Ar, GoL, Ab, Dk, Af, Ud, WD, DQ, BW
Favorite Supplier
"Indecision may, or may not be my problem." - Jimmy Buffet
Champion of the Gibberling | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 2:01 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by BigBC
Ouch, you're absolutely correct. I confused light with simple, but it is considered exotic. Even though it's one of the few weapons monks are proficient with, it's not a simple weapon. I'll need to discuss it with the DM as I've only kept it to aid in tripping attacks and I only used it once, before I took the feat. Maybe he'll be leinent and allow me to just pretend I got rid of it when I gave away my other items. I can always hope. [:(]
Yeah... an oversight by both you and your DM. Unless he is a complete hard a#$, it shouldn't be a problem.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 01/23/2006 8:59 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Malin Lug
I am not a big fan of the Combat Casting Feat, Skill Focus - Concentration actually is much more beneficial. Comabt casting gives you a + 4 concentration but only casting defensively (that actually becomes very easy at higher levels) where the skill focus gives you a + 3 in every situation.
Ummmm that's all and good, but unless his DM allows him to substitute feats, he is going to need to take it for the PrC regardless.
It wasn't a personal preferrence I was stating but a mandatory requirement for the above mentioned PrC's. | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
Sales/Trades Bad (1): Ironfist Boulderbender
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Champion of Gem Dragons, VINDICATED Squire of Duergar Commander, Knight of the Astral Stalker.
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 9:28 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Monsoon28
quote:
Originally posted by Malin Lug
I am not a big fan of the Combat Casting Feat, Skill Focus - Concentration actually is much more beneficial. Comabt casting gives you a + 4 concentration but only casting defensively (that actually becomes very easy at higher levels) where the skill focus gives you a + 3 in every situation.
Ummmm that's all and good, but unless his DM allows him to substitute feats, he is going to need to take it for the PrC regardless.
It wasn't a personal preferrence I was stating but a mandatory requirement for the above mentioned PrC's.
I know... I wasn't bagging on you or anything, I was just pointing out the weakness of the Combat Casting Feat compared to Skill Focus - Concentration.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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| The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 9:32 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by BigBC
Ouch, you're absolutely correct. I confused light with simple, but it is considered exotic. Even though it's one of the few weapons monks are proficient with, it's not a simple weapon. I'll need to discuss it with the DM as I've only kept it to aid in tripping attacks and I only used it once, before I took the feat. Maybe he'll be leinent and allow me to just pretend I got rid of it when I gave away my other items. I can always hope. [:(]
Quarterstaff is vow of poverties best friend. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/23/2006 9:39 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by AesophDarkfable
quote:
Originally posted by BigBC
Ouch, you're absolutely correct. I confused light with simple, but it is considered exotic. Even though it's one of the few weapons monks are proficient with, it's not a simple weapon. I'll need to discuss it with the DM as I've only kept it to aid in tripping attacks and I only used it once, before I took the feat. Maybe he'll be leinent and allow me to just pretend I got rid of it when I gave away my other items. I can always hope. [:(]
Quarterstaff is vow of poverties best friend.
Actually, I like the sling idea. [:D] | |
"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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wicked cool
Underboss
2151 Posts
| | 01/24/2006 11:09 AM |
| | what feats would u recomend. im also working on a monk/sorcerer build. my dm allows me to multiclass and take monk levels later on as the sorcerer is a house created sorcerer who is trained in monk temples. im allowed to create up to 6th level and i was thinking 3/3 but the feats are tough to choose. im leaning towards expertise because of high dexterity(elf) and maybe 2 weapon fighting(staff)? any suggestions? | |
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BigBC
Sergeant
620 Posts
| | 01/24/2006 4:19 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by wicked cool
what feats would u recomend. im also working on a monk/sorcerer build. my dm allows me to multiclass and take monk levels later on as the sorcerer is a house created sorcerer who is trained in monk temples. im allowed to create up to 6th level and i was thinking 3/3 but the feats are tough to choose. im leaning towards expertise because of high dexterity(elf) and maybe 2 weapon fighting(staff)? any suggestions?
For your sorcerer levels you might want to take Practiced Spellcaster so the 3 levels of monk won't affect your caster level. This will allow your caster level to be six (and if your next level is monk, seven), which will affect spell penetration and duration usually. For monk, it might depend on what you encounter most. I took Blind-Fight since I'm a frontline fighter and my DM uses creatures with the darkness ability or sometimes invisibility. Again, it depends on what you encounter in your campaign world. That can make all the difference. | |
Complete: Ha, De, Ar, GoL, Ab, Dk, Af, Ud, WD, DQ, BW
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wicked cool
Underboss
2151 Posts
| | 01/24/2006 4:20 PM |
| | what book is practiced spellcaster in? | |
The ROCK layeth the smacketh down. Long live Farscape
Vindicated-CHAMPION of the INTELLECT DEVOURER
i will change my avatar when martin completes dances with dragons | |
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wicked cool
Underboss
2151 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 11:50 AM |
| | Also how do most of u roleplay monks? frontline fighters or diplomats or scouts. also favorite monk weapons. | |
The ROCK layeth the smacketh down. Long live Farscape
Vindicated-CHAMPION of the INTELLECT DEVOURER
i will change my avatar when martin completes dances with dragons | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2731 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 01/25/2006 12:01 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by wicked cool
what book is practiced spellcaster in?
I think it's in Complete Arcane. | |
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BigBC
Sergeant
620 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 12:04 PM |
| | Yes, the feat is in both Complete Arcane and Complete Divine. | |
Complete: Ha, De, Ar, GoL, Ab, Dk, Af, Ud, WD, DQ, BW
Favorite Supplier
"Indecision may, or may not be my problem." - Jimmy Buffet
Champion of the Gibberling | |
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Zenako
Commander
3472 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 12:19 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by wicked cool
Also how do most of u roleplay monks? frontline fighters or diplomats or scouts. also favorite monk weapons.
In our OA game, they are second tier fighters, just do not have the HP and toughness to sit up front (like the High CON Raging Barbarian Korobokuru does....) Excellent at getting into position to flank or disrupt enemy casters due to movement and tumbling levels.
In our group, not a diplomat (given CHA based Sorcerors and Shugnega) in play.
They could be effective as a scout, but the player did not develop the PC that way (it is a Monk/Shaman). We have much better scouts in our group (Ranger/Shadow Scout and a Rogue/Sohei/Templar). When the shadow scout goes to hide, it is almost better than being invisible in many circumstances.
The monk ends up being good at a number of things, but not the best at anything that gets done in the group. (We also have about 10 PC's in the group if everyone shows, which makes it harder to be the best at something as a Monk.) | |
Built the addition for this addiction, now on to the "gaming table" project....
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Zenako last updated 29 May 2006
Set Status: in a nutshell = all of all
In Process trades0), (Sig last updated 05/29/06) 300 plus Completed Trades -
If I seem scarce at times...blame DDO - Sarlona | |
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 12:59 PM |
| | I watched the movie "Unleashed" last night. The fight scenes in that film are VISCIOUS! I actually felt a little disturbed. I really want to play a monk/barbarian though [:D] Raging martial arts kick arse! [:D] | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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