dj-chuckles
Underboss
2455 Posts
    
The State that invented Spam!
 | | 01/25/2006 11:34 AM |
| Ok. I'm currently running a gestalt campaign.
This is the group:
Psychich Warrior/Monk - Githzerai Monk basically (extremely hard to hit)
Cleric/Warrior - he's the dumbest character I know. With a -16 penalty check.
Rogue/Ranger - not bad, but arrows in an undead city full of skeletons?
Can't remember the other guys class.
I think Scout/Warrior
The bad guys:
Goblin Wizard/Cleric - Necromancer
Cleric of Nerull/Fighter - Second Necromancer (sorta)
Ogre Barbarian/Monk - the muscle
I'm making more, its just a little more difficult to make these characters.
What do you think of the characters? About Gestalt | |
Posted By WakeXX on 09/25/2006 4:49 AM OMG DJ!This has to be the spammiest spam thread ever! 
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Zenako
Commander
3472 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 12:05 PM |
| Well it looks like the Cleric/Warrior must be dead. How can he get a -16 penalty check? (Unless you are referring to the players check...)
I am a little confused about how you are using Gestalt and these characters and the entire context of the question being posed.
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13069 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 01/25/2006 12:50 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by dj-chuckles
What do you think of the characters? About Gestalt
Okay, I'm going to proclaim my ignorance here and ask, What the hell is a gestalt character? | |
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I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 1:10 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Ghendar
quote:
Originally posted by dj-chuckles
What do you think of the characters? About Gestalt
Okay, I'm going to proclaim my ignorance here and ask, What the hell is a gestalt character?
Complete and total CRACK. It is out of the Unearthed Arcana and what it does is allow the characters to gain simultaneously advance in two classes at once. A first level character would be a Fighter 1 / Cleric 1. You would gain all of the class features and the best of each class in most aspects. If you do it for the characters, the GM really needs to do it for all NPC's as well. It is the only way to balance things out. It makes for an extremely powerful game and challenge ratings are pretty much thrown out the window.
We did a gestalt campaign for a little while and the characters were able to kill anything and everything. | |
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devasque
Sergeant
874 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 1:31 PM |
| I don't own it but I believe the Gestalt rules are from some Arcana book. I've played a few with both good and bad results. Back on topic...
Without knowing the flavor of your campaign outside 'an undead city full of skeletons' I'd have to wonder at the PCs choice of characters. The Githzerai Monk isn't that bad, punching and kicking isn't all bad vs. undead. Cleric/Warrior? Why not Cleric/Fighter? Not sure on the -16 check either, seems he'd be... beastial since the minimum is INT 3. Rogue/Ranger could be done better if you went a two weapon fighting route and had Undead as favored enemy.
As far as the bad guys go... the goblin and cleric are ok but if its a city of undead I think you need an ubber Necromancer leader type and I don't think those two fit the bill. I'm thinking Master of Shrouds, True Necromancer, Dread Necromancer (Heroes of Horror) or Necrocarnate (Incarnum). Switching the Celic of Nerul around to add Palemaster PrC as the ubber bad guys lieutenant wouldn't be a bad idea either. | |
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notserious
Sneak
117 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 1:54 PM |
|
. . ."Ogre Barbarian/Monk - the muscle"
is there another rule I'm missing - Barbarian = any non-lawful alignment, Monk = any lawful alignment. Aren't these mutually exclusive?
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 2:00 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by notserious
. . ."Ogre Barbarian/Monk - the muscle"
is there another rule I'm missing - Barbarian = any non-lawful alignment, Monk = any lawful alignment. Aren't these mutually exclusive?
Good catch... I can't really give advice on gestalt characters, I really feel that it is just too broken.
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13069 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 01/25/2006 2:03 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Malin Lug
quote:
Originally posted by Ghendar
quote:
Originally posted by dj-chuckles
What do you think of the characters? About Gestalt
Okay, I'm going to proclaim my ignorance here and ask, What the hell is a gestalt character?
Complete and total CRACK. It is out of the Unearthed Arcana and what it does is allow the characters to gain simultaneously advance in two classes at once. A first level character would be a Fighter 1 / Cleric 1. You would gain all of the class features and the best of each class in most aspects. If you do it for the characters, the GM really needs to do it for all NPC's as well. It is the only way to balance things out. It makes for an extremely powerful game and challenge ratings are pretty much thrown out the window.
We did a gestalt campaign for a little while and the characters were able to kill anything and everything.
Thanks.
That sounds messed up.  | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM
I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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Darastrix Maekrix
dariustad
Warlord
6322 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 3:44 PM |
| Gestalt is messed up. It's power gaming at its worst. Be glad none of them did a Vow of Poverty Monk/Cleric. [:P]
I also question the use of the Warrior (NPC) class. Fighter would be best for the feats, hp, bab.
The -16 penalty check? For what? Is that the penalty for a poorly made gestalt character? [:P] | |
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Rising Dragon
Sneak
91 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 3:59 PM |
| Yea I agree gestalt characters are powergamers wet dream. Our poor DM in my current campain as hard time challenging us. we easly take out creatures five CR above are party level. Feats from the complete adventure become truely broken. Honestly I don't think I would ever let Gestalt characters in my game.
Oh by way ranger works great in undead campaign as long your favored enemy is undead. | |
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Fun Guy from Yuggoth
Cthulhufnord
Warlord
11113 Posts
Umass Amherst Baby!
| | 01/25/2006 4:04 PM |
| | Sounds almost like the old Multi-class rules from second edition. | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13069 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 01/25/2006 4:14 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Cthulhufnord
Sounds almost like the old Multi-class rules from second edition.
On steroids! | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM
I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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Darastrix Maekrix
dariustad
Warlord
6322 Posts
| | 01/25/2006 4:18 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Ghendar
quote:
Originally posted by Cthulhufnord
Sounds almost like the old Multi-class rules from second edition.
On steroids!
More like PCP. Well, if the characters are designed properly, anyway. [:P] | |
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 01/25/2006 5:04 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by dariustad
More like PCP. Well, if the characters are designed properly, anyway. [:P]
Yes definitely PC's on PCP's!
I read through that section of UA and thought no way would I every allow that!
Just sounds too messed up, sure it could work but the amount of work for the DM...Goodluck Chuckles you'll have sleepless nights trying to come up with challenges that aren't a cake-walk or TPK.
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JodyJ
Warrior
260 Posts
| | 01/27/2006 5:27 PM |
| We've been enjoying gestalt for the last 2 years.
Makes it easier if only 2-3 out of 4 players show up for a session.
Also lets each character cover two roles so no one is saddled with just being the medic or just being the face.
As the DM I run everything else normal (non-gestalt) and just run ELs a couple levels higher.
We limit numbers of classes and use fractional saves/BAB and it seems fine. Not any worth than going overboard with loot levels or starting point buy.
We also set a party theme where everyone had to have some ability slant - for example our group started as all Knights in training so they were encouraged to all start with some levels in a full BAB class while still being able to cover nuker (ranger/sorceror), healer (pal/cleric), skills (fighter/rogue and fighter/bard). Around 10th I let them retool to account for new books and 3 of 4 went Monk/xxx. That lasted until I pointed out that SR can be irritating and the FoB doesn't work with PA as well as plain 2 handed. For healing almost everyone could use a CLW wand through class or UMD but now they rely more on the Cleric/Pal, potions, and Wholeness of Body. | |
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Fearfrost
Sergeant
518 Posts
| | 01/27/2006 5:40 PM |
| | Ok my turn to proclaim ignorance what is this Vow of Poverty I keep seeing people talk about? Everytime I've seen it mentioned it is talked about as if it is game breaking or at least unbalanced. | |
Asystole is a stable heart rhythm | |
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Darastrix Maekrix
dariustad
Warlord
6322 Posts
| | 01/27/2006 6:18 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Fearfrost
Ok my turn to proclaim ignorance what is this Vow of Poverty I keep seeing people talk about? Everytime I've seen it mentioned it is talked about as if it is game breaking or at least unbalanced.
You need to find a copy of the Book of Exalted Deeds and read through it. Then, run through some of the information and start applying it to your favorite classes, especially the Monk. You'll start understanding why it's considered as such.
If you have the BoED, or have read through the VoP info, feel free to ask questions about it. | |
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Fearfrost
Sergeant
518 Posts
| | 01/27/2006 6:32 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by dariustad
quote:
Originally posted by Fearfrost
Ok my turn to proclaim ignorance what is this Vow of Poverty I keep seeing people talk about? Everytime I've seen it mentioned it is talked about as if it is game breaking or at least unbalanced.
You need to find a copy of the Book of Exalted Deeds and read through it. Then, run through some of the information and start applying it to your favorite classes, especially the Monk. You'll start understanding why it's considered as such.
If you have the BoED, or have read through the VoP info, feel free to ask questions about it.
Ahh I don't have that book not sure if anyone in my group does either. Could you give me a brief overview so I know what people are talking about? | |
Asystole is a stable heart rhythm | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 01/27/2006 6:46 PM |
| Basically the VoP gives two benefits:
- bonus exalted feats at a very fast rate
- bonuses to stats, AC., etc, of various different types
The cost is:
- You pretty much get no stuff or money of any kind, ever, minus the clothes on your back and a quarterstaff.
For the most part, the feats you pick up aren't that excessively strong and the bonuses mostly just make up for the items you're missing out on.
There are a couple combinations that are reallllllly powerful. Druid is especially bad as all those bonuses persist in wild shape. | |
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 01/27/2006 8:56 PM |
| | Yes pretty much a VoP for Monks and Druids is killer, but not something you'd really ever take as a Fighter or Wizard...or most other classes. The kicker is that Druids and Monk really don't need much in any case. So their isn't really much reason not to take the Vow in the first place? | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
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