Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
    
 | | 02/03/2006 1:22 AM |
| I recently caved in and bought Complete Warrior in hopes of finding some stuff to help me play a low strength warrior. I was a bit disappointed. That's no dig against Complete Warrior, just that it seems to focus on either 1) optimal character types, or 2) niches. It doesn't seem to offer as much for helping out suboptimal character types. (Which is what I view as the whole point of making prestige classes, but that's another topic.)
Here are my current ideas for playing a low strength fighter.
1) Focus on defense rather than offense. Fight defensively, go for high Con and soak up damage.
2) Raise your attack and turn that into Power Attack.
3) Go for more attacks rather than harder hits. Combat Reflexes, Cleave, etc.
4) Weapon enhancements can increase your damage. Either a flaming longsword or a flaming burst scimitar will work.
Is there anything else I'm missing? Do you have any nifty ideas for accomplishing these four things? | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
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MackeyJ
Underboss
1414 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 1:44 AM |
| Gauntlets of Ogre power.
Girdle of Giants Strength.
A couple spell caster levels so you can cast strength, enlarge or other buffing spells on yourself.
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John
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 1:59 AM |
| One thing you might want to consider, getting a weapon that can deal damage other than just HP. One example, a pair of Kukri's that are both + 1 / Enfeebeling. (It is out of the Book of Exalted deeds is = to a +1 and on a crit is does 1d6 + 2 Strength damage with no save.) A weapon of wounding, alot of light hits will really do alot of hurt on someone or something.
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AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 2:03 AM |
| | Go two weapon and go for # of hits over power of hits. If you hit more times each round it can even out. | |
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Cthulhufnord
Warlord
11113 Posts
Umass Amherst Baby!
| | 02/03/2006 2:09 AM |
| | How about a Dex based Ranged attack fighter, maybe toss in a few levels of Rogue as well. BTW how low are planning on going Strength wise? I think a fighter specializing in knives might be interesting, you could even go for the spring attack/whirlwind attack path. | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 2:15 AM |
| A Rapier wielding fighter with combat expertise. And then throw on wounding or enfeebleing on top of that. (See previous post.) If you get enfeebling, you would definetly have to get improved crit later.
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Sean-Khan
Commander
2731 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 2:23 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Gristlemane
2) Raise your attack and turn that into Power Attack.
Remember that this feat needs STR 13.
Against humanoids, you can use feats like improved disarm and such. Just check which don't need STR -check.
I guess you read the episode of Order of the Stick where there was half-ogre chain fighter? [:D] Use mobility.
Generally, I think fighter needs strength, but you could use fighter -class to boost other classes (rogue, monk, war-oriented cleric). You can't use non-light weapons with finesse (Well, except Rapier. And thus, it's mostly incompatible with power attack).
IIRC swashbuckler -class that gets it's INT -bonus to damage against those that are vulnerable to crits. That is also only with finesseable weapons. | |
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Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 2:27 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Sean-Khan
Remember that this feat needs STR 13.
I was basically thinking about a gnome or halfling warrior. So after racial modifiers you would end up with Str 13-15. You'd qualify for Power Attack, but your Strength would be too low to generate much damage. | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
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orcdoubleax
Sergeant
694 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 5:19 AM |
| I have a 5th level fighter that is specilized in the crossbow. He usally stay out of direct combat, but can defend himself if treatened.
He has spent all his feats on crossbow related skills and str is his least important skill at this point. He has 18 dex and 14 con and reasonable skill elsewhere.
piont blank
rapid reload
weapon focus
rapid shot
coordinated shot | |
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Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 02/03/2006 6:46 AM |
| Big fan of weapon finesse if you're playing a low strength type, rely on Dexterity for just about everything. I'd also add Intelligence into the mix of top stats, not only for Combat Expertise or Swashbuckling but for additional skills like Balance and my favourite Tumble.
Instead of going with heavy armour stick with a breast plate (at least until you can get some mithral heavy armour.) This way you can get the most of your Armour Bonus and your Dex Bonus plus your shield (Darkwood of course!)
Work towards someone who avoids getting hit as much as possible while giving wicked cuts in return.
My 2gp. | |
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Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
| | 02/03/2006 7:21 AM |
| At lowish levels, a low strength fighter can work pretty easily. It's at mid- to high-levels that you'll start running into your bane: damage reduction.
Unfortunately, there's not much to be done about it. You'll need a cleric to provide the alignment component, or a wizard to provide aligned weapons. You could commission a specially enchanted set of weapons that can chance metal form -- adamantine, silvered, cold iron.
But you will run into DR you're not prepared for, and where a normal fighter can power through it, it will totally frustrate a low Strength fighter, no matter how accurate. | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 02/03/2006 3:46 PM |
| The problem I've found is that in pretty much every situation, a high strength melee fighter is always better than a low strength melee fighter. Having a better AB and damage is almost always a better thing.
If you truly want to make a low strength fighter that is as effective as a high strength fighter of equal level, with equal resources, you'll probably have to resort to a prestige class or alternative class. As mentioned before, one class that can be effective without an insane strength (although it must have a high dexterity and intelligence) is the swashbuckler from the complete warrior.
It has a good BAB progression, weapon finesse, and it gets to add its intelligence modifier to its damage at 3rd level (as well as strength) when using finessable weapons against any opponent subject to critical hits.
This base class is good to combine with rogue, ranger, eldritch knight, spellsword, whirling dervish or scout to create characters that can deal significant damage without a high strength. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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stonefro2000
Sergeant
465 Posts
| | 02/05/2006 3:19 AM |
| | i've been playing a archer with a 13Str and i do 20-45 damage a round. Dex, feat, selection and a +1 shocking burts longbow | |
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Luisjoey
Underboss
1704 Posts
Caracas Venezuela
| | 02/06/2006 6:58 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Gristlemane
I recently caved in and bought Complete Warrior in hopes of finding some stuff to help me play a low strength warrior. I was a bit disappointed. That's no dig against Complete Warrior, just that it seems to focus on either 1) optimal character types, or 2) niches. It doesn't seem to offer as much for helping out suboptimal character types. (Which is what I view as the whole point of making prestige classes, but that's another topic.)
Here are my current ideas for playing a low strength fighter.
1) Focus on defense rather than offense. Fight defensively, go for high Con and soak up damage.
2) Raise your attack and turn that into Power Attack.
3) Go for more attacks rather than harder hits. Combat Reflexes, Cleave, etc.
4) Weapon enhancements can increase your damage. Either a flaming longsword or a flaming burst scimitar will work.
Is there anything else I'm missing? Do you have any nifty ideas for accomplishing these four things?
Makes him an archer! they are pretty good (and i think they are better than ranger)
Remember that Attributes don´t makes powerful the character, levels do! you could find good items to improve you character Flaws. | |
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Sulaco
Underboss
1605 Posts
| | 02/07/2006 4:44 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Gristlemane
quote:
Originally posted by Sean-Khan
Remember that this feat needs STR 13.
I was basically thinking about a gnome or halfling warrior. So after racial modifiers you would end up with Str 13-15. You'd qualify for Power Attack, but your Strength would be too low to generate much damage.
When you said "low strength" I thought you meant below 10. A scores of 13-15 is not low Strength. Far from it in fact as it is well above average.
A truly low-strength fighter could concentrate on weapon finesse, weapons with high crit ranges, and ranged attacks. | |
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zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 02/07/2006 5:08 PM |
| | From experience low Strength fighters should focus on ranged support or mounted combat (mounted ranged support is awesome). Lots of finesse based feats don't overcome the fact that a high strength fighter using the same weapon without finesse will deal more damage/hit more often on average. Some ideas to play with for ranged support are Arcane Archer, Order of the Bow Initiate, etc. I think a well-constructed ranged fighter will outshine a ranger in most circumstances. | |
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Aramus
Warrior
181 Posts
| | 02/09/2006 11:10 AM |
| | go with rapier or kukri and improved crit/weapon finese (dex to attack) | |
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