Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
    
 | | 03/25/2006 6:31 PM |
| The Adamantine Body feat says that a warforged built with it is "considered to be wearing heavy armor."
If the warforged in question doesn't have the Heavy Armor proficiency, does he suffer the increased penalties (double the armor check penalty, I think)? | |
Jeff "Wayne Laredo" Wilder | Email | Have/Want List | Trade Policies | Are You an Ethical Trader?
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Lead Moderator
LCS
Underboss
1928 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 8:22 PM |
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It's technically not an armor check penalty. Take a look at the FAQ, it's mentioned in one of the entries (regarding whether the penalty is doubled for Swim checks).
quote:
Can a warforged swim? Should I double its armor ck penalty when applying it to Swim checks?
Although slightly denser than most other characters, warforged can swim about as well as any other race. A warforged has a penalty on Swim checks, but this isn’t an “armor check penalty” and thus isn’t doubled for such checks.
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Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 9:49 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wayne
Yeah ... I'm really not liking the "free heavy armor proficiency" thing, though. I've sent something to customer service, just to make sure.
Is it really free if you have to pay a feat for it? | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 9:57 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by IanB
Is it really free if you have to pay a feat for it?
By comparison, yes. One of the few drawbacks of warforged is that they can't wear armor. This means, for example, that a warforged fighter has to take Adamantine Body if he wants a decent AC. A character without the Heavy Armor proficiency -- i.e., not trained to fight in heavy protection -- is getting the feat effectively free. That seems pretty backward to me. | |
Jeff "Wayne Laredo" Wilder | Email | Have/Want List | Trade Policies | Are You an Ethical Trader?
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maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 10:13 PM |
| I believe Keith Baker said it best in one of his ask Keith threads.
To paraphrase he said " you are always proficient with your own body".
Because you have to take the body feats at 1st level it is assumed you you were created with the admantine/mithral/darkwood body type so you learned to use it while learning everything else the warforged learned 'growing up'. | | | |
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Lead Moderator
LCS
Underboss
1928 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 10:52 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by maijstral
I believe Keith Baker said it best in one of his ask Keith threads.
Unfortunately, when it comes to mechanics, "believe" and "Keith Baker" don't belong in the same sentence. I just found out I have a 10% worse chance for my artificer to scribe scrolls than I originally thought because I had been working off an incorrect example he used.
He's responsible for the fluff, and other people are responsible for the crunch.
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Lead Moderator
LCS
Underboss
1928 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 11:07 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wayne
The Adamantine Body feat says that a warforged built with it is "considered to be wearing heavy armor."
If the warforged in question doesn't have the Heavy Armor proficiency, does he suffer the increased penalties (double the armor check penalty, I think)?
The rules for encumbrance also state that a character who is carrying a medium or heavier load is considered to be wearing medium or heavy armor for the purposes of any ability that or skills that are restricted by armor.
Does that mean that a character without proficiency in heavy armor should get double the penalties because they weren't properly trained in how to carry too much junk around?
Body plating on a warforged takes the spot normally used for armor, but it's something different. I think the sentence you pulled out of the body feats is referring to the same thing as encumbrance. It's encumbering enough that it prevents the use of skills and abilities which only normally function if the creature is wearing less armor.
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
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LargeMarmot
Sergeant
463 Posts
| | 03/25/2006 11:53 PM |
| | So youre the reason we get so many warforged in DDM! I'm kidding, I'm a big Mystara fan. We have Meks. | |
Champion of the Tohr-Kreen.
WotDQ Called Shot: Fang Dragon. | |
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maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 03/26/2006 11:03 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by LCS
quote:
Originally posted by maijstral
I believe Keith Baker said it best in one of his ask Keith threads.
Unfortunately, when it comes to mechanics, "believe" and "Keith Baker" don't belong in the same sentence. I just found out I have a 10% worse chance for my artificer to scribe scrolls than I originally thought because I had been working off an incorrect example he used.
He's responsible for the fluff, and other people are responsible for the crunch.
Despite the fact his answer is in the official FAQ and despite the fact he usually runs his 'offical' answers by the rules crunchers my point was I agreed with his opinion.
I don't believe mr. Baker is the be all end all offical of the Eberron universe but if he comes across with an opinion on how something should be run and it makes sense to me I will generally take it under advisment as a house rule if nothing else. He has, after all, run this world longer than any of us. I agree you should be proficent with your own body hence the equivalent of heavy armor profiency but all that metal plating is still heavy and bulky so skill check penalties. | | | |
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Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
12481 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 03/26/2006 9:39 PM |
| | If I may digress a little, how have players of Warforged characters found them to measure up against other core races? Unfortunately, I don't play in an Eberron campaign, but I was thinking of asking our DM if one could be imported into our FR or GH campaign. Thanks. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 03/27/2006 5:58 PM |
| Warforged can be a bit on the sucky side if you don't have access to the repair spells or especially the artificer class.
With those in play, they're quite strong, joining dwarves at the top end of power for races with a level adjustment of +0. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
| | 03/27/2006 8:35 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thenameless
If I may digress a little, how have players of Warforged characters found them to measure up against other core races? Unfortunately, I don't play in an Eberron campaign, but I was thinking of asking our DM if one could be imported into our FR or GH campaign. Thanks.
I think there are some potentials for abuse if you hyper-optimize but no different than the optimized frenzied berserker half orc or the human druid or the (anyone) artificer.
The real key is that, at higher leves, with random treasure you're going to have a harder time boosting your AC as a warforged unless you spend cash. If you've got an artificer in the party, you're in good shape because that class is freaking powerful.
I'm not a good one to ask though; I love the concept but I admit I'm playing about as least-optmized a 'forged as you can go. I'm playing a Favored Soul which needs Wis and Cha for spell casting (the two stats that have a -2 adjustment). I can't really heal myself well (since I don't have repair) but I'm loving the character personality.
To be honest, I think there are alot of "broken" things running around right now and Warforged are no broken than the others (although I think a Warforged Druid just got a power boost with the new polymorph / shape change ruling). | |
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