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Hejas
Sergeant
435 Posts
    
Poland
 | | 05/06/2006 10:13 AM |
| I'm still playing D&D3.0, as there are no 3.5 books in Polish yet. (I have a few in English, but we decided to stick to 3.0 for a while)
I think we all see how unbalanced - and stupid - polymorph spell is.
It's 4 level spell that heals your hp, gives you enormous physical atributes, flight etc. and lets you still use your spells, psionic powers, special abilities, magic items, weapons etc. It's absolutely sick. And it lasts forever. (or until some "dispel magic" effect)
Then why wouldn't the whole team polymorph into Solars and stay like that forever?
So how does it look in 3.5? How to make it more balanced?
Yet another thing in my 3.0 campaign that I have to change. :P | |
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ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 05/06/2006 10:52 AM |
| I'm actually surprised by the amount of difficulty that Wotc and some players have with the polymorph spell. Sure, I thought that the 3.0 version was broken, so I didn't use it. When tome and blood came out it had that weirdly worded lawyer-esque errata, which i didn't really follow, so I still didn't use it. Then 3.5 came out and I assumed that everything was going to be OK on the polymorph side of things, y'know, i thought "no matter what they change they can only change polymorph for the better". Nope. Still broken...ish. I still didn't use polymorph. Now they are revamping the spell again? Man, the spell description should read as follows:
Polymorph Sor/Wiz 4
transmutation
Change into stuff. Nothing too big or too small. Nothing to strong or too fast. Nothing gross. Just stuff. y'know, stuff.
Ha! poke holes in that you rules lawyers! [:p] | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 05/06/2006 11:19 AM |
| Polymorph is a very difficult spell to balance, because it has so many variables, and it opens itself up to being abused via the introduction of 3rd party materials.
WotC finally started down the only path that works with regard to Polymorph... listing a specific form for a specific spell, granting all abilities of the form, and stripping the caster of their normal abilities (similar to the stripping in Tenser's Transformation). The major problem with this approach is that the polymorph spell then loses scalability, and becomes less useful as the caster rises in power.
However, they only began to adopt this philosphy in PHB II - which is just about to be officially released.
In the future (4.0?), I expect to see WotC release spells that handle polymorphing similar to summon spells - with list of acceptable forms specified at each 'level' of polymorphing spell. However, we are not there yet. | |
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IHawk
Underboss
1054 Posts
Lisle, Illinois
| | 05/06/2006 11:39 AM |
| I don't mind the "spell loses scalability, and becomes less useful as the caster rises in power" there are many, many spells that have this problem or restriction. It helps to balance the lower level cost of a pretty powerful spell.
The reduction in duration, limiting type of moster based on caster hit dice and size restrictions are all great ways of limiting what kind of moster you can polymorph into.
Another more specific way of limiting what you can polymorph into, is to force the caster to do research on the monster. If he has to spend gold and lots of time to gain the knowledge of a specific monster in order to use it as a polymorph goal, that will limit the
variablility of the spell considereably...unless research in your campaign is no big deal. He will also begin to lag behind his
companions in treasure and experience.
Yes I like polymorph, it a great tool. It is not an end all spell
in my home game, and as the DM, i refuse to allow it to be abused.
Just a thought.
mpk.
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Korhal_IV
Sergeant
852 Posts
| | 05/06/2006 1:04 PM |
| | I have honestly never had a problem with Polymorph abuse. I can see how it would easily become a problem, but I think the current updates are a bit harsh just to stomp on munchkins. | |
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taliesin
Underboss
1113 Posts
| | 05/06/2006 9:54 PM |
| | Oh, trust me, that spell can be abused. The spell as written doesn't mention templates at all, so by the RAW, you can polymorph into a creature already at the hd cap for your caster level that is also a half-dragon (+8 Str). I am very glad the spell is being overhauled in the way it is, maybe I'll let it back into my games. | |
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Thenameless
Warlord
12481 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 05/06/2006 11:38 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by B
I'm actually surprised by the amount of difficulty that Wotc and some players have with the polymorph spell. Sure, I thought that the 3.0 version was broken, so I didn't use it. When tome and blood came out it had that weirdly worded lawyer-esque errata, which i didn't really follow, so I still didn't use it. Then 3.5 came out and I assumed that everything was going to be OK on the polymorph side of things, y'know, i thought "no matter what they change they can only change polymorph for the better". Nope. Still broken...ish. I still didn't use polymorph. Now they are revamping the spell again? Man, the spell description should read as follows:
Polymorph Sor/Wiz 4
transmutation
Change into stuff. Nothing too big or too small. Nothing to strong or too fast. Nothing gross. Just stuff. y'know, stuff.
Ha! poke holes in that you rules lawyers! [:p]
I like that. Kind of like when a teacher used to ask me what I had in the plastic bag. I'd just say stuff, and they couldn't do a thing about it. | |
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Arandae
Sergeant
713 Posts
UK
| | 05/07/2006 7:25 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by IHawk
The reduction in duration, limiting type of moster based on caster hit dice and size restrictions are all great ways of limiting what kind of moster you can polymorph into.
Great idea - I'll be using the caster hit dice restriction from now on. Thanks IHawk [:)]! | |
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FeranEldritchKnight
Sergeant
385 Posts
Kansas City, MO USA
| | 05/07/2006 1:29 PM |
| | I guess I just don't see the problem with Polymorph. I just assumed templates were off limits. I probably was an offender with Polymorph though, as we would polymorph into a Large dragon and travel as the party's mounts when we didn't know where we were going (ie, Teleport was out of the question). | |
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