Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
    
 | | 07/14/2006 8:14 PM |
| Just wondering, since I only ever see people looking for WotC products in the trading threads.
No offense meant toward WotC, but there are a lot of good books by other publishers. Doesn't anyone use them? | |
My H/W list is not current...
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Most Edumacated
zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/14/2006 8:18 PM |
| My budget doesn't allow much wiggle room, so I tend to stick with the "official" material. Granted, I've never bothered with the Races or Locations (Sandstorm et al) lines or most of the FR/Eberron stuff.
I do like to support Mongoose when possible. I pick up all of the Lone Wolf books as they're published. I'd pick up the minis too, if they weren't rather expensive (although at some point I'll pick up a couple of Helghast/Crypt Spawn packs since nothing in DDM quite works). | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
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Kunimatyu
Sergeant
725 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 8:36 PM |
| | I have been known to buy other stuff -- Green Ronin is a current favorite, I've bought Malhavoc Iron Heroes, and Necromancer's Tome of Horrors monsterbooks are fun (in fact, if anyone has ToH 2 or 3, I'd be more than happy to send an Aspect of Tiamat your way...) | |
Champion of the Aboleth, Prophet of Denizens. BW Called Shot: Babau, UH Called Shot: Aspect of Vecna | |
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Hero of Skirmish
doubtofbuddha
Commander
3371 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 8:38 PM |
| | I use lots of Malhavoc stuff, and have a pretty large collection of d20 books in general. I plan on getting rid of most of them though. | |
I am not gone. | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6842 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 07/14/2006 8:38 PM |
| | It's easier for me to stick with WotC stuff. Mostly, it's due to familiarity. If I had someone very knowledgeable about the various companies (who wasn't a hobby shop salesman), whose opinion I respected, I would ask lots of questions about the other publishers' stuff. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 9:40 PM |
| | Well, for 3+ years (during the d20 heyday) I wrote reviews over at Mortality.net on books from lots of different (non-WotC) publishers. I could try to answer some questions (not that you necessarily respect my opinion [)]). | |
My H/W list is not current...
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delguidance
Sergeant
394 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 9:43 PM |
| | Nope, just wizards for me. | |
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CarrionCrawler
Underboss
1760 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 9:49 PM |
| I've bought lots of wizards products and the dragon compendium...there are a few non-wotc books out there I would buy if money wasn't an option. One I would love to get as a sort of companion piece to Frostburn was a book called "Frost and Fur" or something like that. Very well put together. I also enjoy Mongoose's stuff.
CC | |
Vindicated Night Below Champion of the Digestor!!! Knight of the OozesIcons called shot: Angry MobThe stink of rotten meat surrounds this multilegged creature with a segmented, 10-foot long body. Eight writhing tentacles protrude from its head, growing directly from below its clacking mandibles and tooth-filled maw. | |
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MechaKingGhidra
Sergeant
632 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 10:14 PM |
| Let's take inventory of my books:
Player's Handbook 3.5
Dungeon Master's Guide 3.5
Monster Manual 3.5
Monster Manual III(why it was printed after 3.5, I'll never know)
Forgotten Realms: Serpent Kingdoms
Draconomicon
Okay, then..............................................................to answer your question, yep it appears to be that I only use WotC. | |
Champion of the Prismatic Golem
MechaKingGhidra: Infamous for his absolute despisement of Red Dragons and devout worshipper of all Black Dragons. | |
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arbados
Underboss
1450 Posts
New York, USA
| | 07/15/2006 12:49 AM |
| | I pretty much now only stick to WotC. In the past I would go for others, but with the number of books released and minis the cost of getting all the other books is too much. I actually have cut down on my WotC book purchases just because there is soo much made. So to answer your question; Yes I only use WotC. | |
Give me more MIND FLAYERS! | |
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I Tyrant
Warrior
178 Posts
| | 07/15/2006 1:58 AM |
| | I use goodman games stuff when I don't use WOTC products, the power gamers 3.5 warror & wizard strategy guides are really good, good for the player that wants to survive and good for the GM that wants to cook up tough challeges for his/her players, monsters that come off as actually "elite" when it comes to combat & not just swing away, the best part is the guides only use the rules from the core books so it's not "big spender" time. Goodman's dungeon crawl line is also pretty solid as well. | |
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Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6842 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 07/15/2006 2:21 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kithmaker
Well, for 3+ years (during the d20 heyday) I wrote reviews over at Mortality.net on books from lots of different (non-WotC) publishers. I could try to answer some questions (not that you necessarily respect my opinion [)]).
I think you would know enough that I could ask you some questions. I think that mostly, I would be looking for good adventures/campaigns. I am in the middle of DMing RHoD and will be doing that for several months. I haven't figured out what's going on next yet. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
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Fun Guy from Yuggoth
Cthulhufnord
Warlord
11113 Posts
Umass Amherst Baby!
| | 07/15/2006 2:55 AM |
| | Most of the OGL stuff I have is Green Ronin. Allthough now I'm looking at picking up Mongoose's Conan rpg. That is if they don't end up making a Runequest version of it. | |
Pathetic Earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void - without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe - anything at all - you would have hidden from it in terror. | |
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Dordledum
Commander
3463 Posts
Netherlands
| | 07/15/2006 3:40 AM |
| I'm sticking to WotC-stuff only as well. It's just something we agreed as players and DMs. With all WotC-source books combined there are plenty of options for character development. It is hard enough for the DMs amongst us to keep a clear overview as it is.
D. | |
Member of the Bearded Devils
Champion of the Huge Spider (WotDQ 46/60), A New Umber Hulk (DoDe 57/60), and the Orog Fighter! | |
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Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 07/15/2006 9:56 AM |
| Just WotC for rule books. I dont really trust or allow spells, prestige classes, feats ect from other companies.
I own plenty of adventures from Goodman, Necromancer, Green Ronin, AEG and Kenzer and co. | |
Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2731 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/15/2006 10:02 AM |
| I have a pretty descent sized d20 collection. The one co. I use the most products from is Kenzer, I run my game in Kalamar. After that it's probably Tome of Horrors (Necromancer) that's used the most.
I'm not fond of Mongoose. The brown books remind me of what killed 2nd ed. for me, the Complete line. Their hard cover books aren't so bad, I own a couple of those.
Malhavoc and Green Ronin are very good choices that I own several books from. I also like Fantasy Flight's Legends and Lairs series. | |
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Benimoto
Underboss
1125 Posts
| | 07/15/2006 11:21 AM |
| | For the most part I only use WoTC. In my case it's "once bitten, twice shy" as my group used several d20 products in the 3.0 era that were less-than-balanced. | |
Champion of the Rakshasa. Check out my Mini Terrain Maker, or my new Dungeon Map Maker (under development). | |
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taliesin
Underboss
1113 Posts
| | 07/15/2006 11:27 AM |
| | I think the only non-WotC books I have are the Traps and Treachery books, I think by Fantasy Flight Games. I picked those up just for the Monster Manual like entry of all of those wonderful traps! *Evil DM Laugh* | |
Champion of the Entire Monster Manual 1!
(Click link to see current progress!)
Uncommon Painting Competition 2 Winner | |
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orcdoubleax
Sergeant
694 Posts
| | 07/15/2006 12:18 PM |
| there are books I would buy, but I am spending too much on minis right now to expand the library beyond WOTC.
A change to 4.0 would make me buy other publisher. I can't justify changing to 4.0 and losing the investment I have made in 3.5. I could afford it, but I can't justify it. So I would buy what ever 3.5 stuff was avaliable from other sources. | |
Yes I am Gelatinous.
www.gelatinousdudes.com
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FeranEldritchKnight
Sergeant
385 Posts
Kansas City, MO USA
| | 07/15/2006 2:24 PM |
| Like Taliesin, I own the Traps and Treachery I and II from FFG. I also bought their Seafarer's Handbook, but that was quite a while before I know WotC was coming out with Stormwrack. Funny note on these two- I created a Coral Golem before I bought either book, giving me three versions of the creature (mine, FFGs, and WotCs).
Otherwise, I've looked over quite a few others, but usually don't buy anything. | |
Completed trades: Gausse, Mazra, Pagansexy, Galerians, Lord_Raven, Drakkengi, Temujinn x2, Random Sasquatch, elf_ranger, Azuretide, Hung4treason, Griffrat (face2face), Nasamonkey
Carpe Forum! | |
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Lab Monkey
Commander
4136 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 2:40 AM |
| I use some Soveriegn Press materials for my Dragonlance campaign.
Otherwise I'm 100% WotC. | |
Have: Cat; Want: Storm Giant
Champion of Anything Dragonlance
Before trading, please check the Disputed Trades Thread | |
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Sammael
Underboss
1881 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 3:53 AM |
| There are WotC products out there that are just as unbalanced as some of the worst d20 material available. Case in point, Book of Exalted Deeds.
I generally have no prejudice against 3rd party stuff. My gaming budget is limited, so I probably have more WotC books than 3rd party books, but that's simply because 3rd party companies cannot publish Forgotten Realms products.
EDIT: Out of all d20 companies, I found Green Ronin's products to be the most to my liking (not surprising, considering Chris Pramas is one of my favorite RPG authors ever). Too bad GR is done with print d20 fantasy products. [:(] | |
Hypethetical Blood War Set List | Champion of the Gelugon | Vindicated Prophet of Blood War
Ha 69/80 | De 60/60 | Ar 57/60 | GoL 72/72 | Ab 60/60 | DK 60/60 | AF 60/60 | UD 59/60 | WD 57/60 | WDQ 3/60| BW
Total DDM Count: 1037 | No chance of finishing the set | Will finish the set | Set | |
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Alisair Longreach
Sneak
121 Posts
Denmark
| | 07/16/2006 5:23 AM |
| | I also have and use a lot of books from Malhavoc Press. | |
Powergamers of the World, Unite!
Completed Trades: jedijon, Rakhamon | |
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DarkWhite
Warrior
185 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 9:06 AM |
| I think in the early days of 3rd Edition, books from independent D20 publishers were numerous and popular because there weren't so many official D&D releases available yet, so they filled gaps not yet covered by WotC, expanded on popular themes already explored by WotC, provided an alternative to the "official" party line. Competition in any market is a healthy thing.
I was also interested in how D20 could be pushed to cover other genres. Prior to D20, every new game was published with a completely different ruleset. I found this a barrier to playing new games. I really appreciate that you can now play almost any genre using a consistent and familiar ruleset.
Some independent D20 series I enjoyed were: Mongoose Quintessential series, Fantasy Flight Games' Legends and Lairs series, AEG's one-word-title series and Green Ronin products. These covered niche topics well, and were generally of good production quality.
Third-party D20 products have received some criticism for being unbalanced, but I think you either a) accept and run with it; b) assess and adjust it; or c) avoid using the crunch, instead using these prodcuts as idea generators for your own campaigns.
However, nowadays, I am seeing a return to the WotC monopoly. There are fewer third-party D20 products on the market. D&D miniatures are eating into our budgets, and WotC are releasing more product per month than ever before.
Whereas fans would often look to independent D20 publishers for niche themes, WotC now have many of these covered.
There are still some good campaign settings published by other companies, I enjoy the World of Warcraft RPG for it's setting, and Living Arcanis because I occasionally play in the RPGA campaign at conventions. Though they all pretty much work with variations on the standard base classes, because these are freely available in the D20 SRD.
However, recent WotC products such as Magic of Incarnum, Tome of Magic and PHBII, have expanded the range of available base classes in interesting new ways. I think this is the new frontier for WotC, as it clearly differentiates D&D from other D20 competitors.
Other companies cannot touch WotC's creations unless they're in the SRD. WotC's 3.5 revision, increased product schedule and fresh innovative content, have tended to date third-party products, making them less relevant. WotC have picked up the pace, distancing them from their competitors.
WotC are increasingly cross-pollinating their products, with tie-ins between RHoD, MMIV and miniatures, for example, reason to seek out other WotC product, rather than look elsewhere.
The thing is that D&D is no longer just about playing an elf or half-orc, the game has broadened much more than that now. Chances are, you can find something to satisfy your interest without having to stray from "offial" WotC product. Truth is, I don't often refer to the D20 books on my shelf anymore, because D&D covers most of my gaming needs.
There was a time when independent D20 publishers were posing some threat to WotC's monopoly. Monte Cook comes to mind with Arcana Unearthed. However, where I think Monte failed was departing too far from D&D, thus creating a faction. I think successful D20 publishers will play WotC at their own game, producing compelling compatible product, not running against them. | |
http://www.maxminis.com/hwlist.asp?user=DarkWhite
[for trade only within Australia, no overseas trade thanks] | |
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Rising Dragon
Sneak
91 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 10:22 AM |
| | I own a few non-WOTC books, but for the most part I stick with WOTC. Like DarkWhite pointed out they pretty much cover every aspic of D&D now. | |
My webcomic: http://www.sentimentalhorde.com Bringing world peace by conquering on nation at time! | |
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kyrin
Commander
3171 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 10:36 AM |
| I use WotC books exclusively for game mechanics. Thankfully, my players are lazy and don't go hunting for third-party splatbooks.
I do look to other publishers for inspiration, however, especially adventures from Necromancer Games and Goodman Games. I have many of the "Slayer's Guides," but have had no time to read them.
JIM
aka kyrin | |
My Have/Want List <-|-|->My Trades and References 1 <-|-|->My Trades and References 2
Pronounce "Drow" like "crow"! Viva la Revolution! We Shall Overcome!
Vindicated Champion of the Stirge! Vindicated Champion of the Githyanki Knight on Red Dragon!!
Vindicated Champion of the Androsphinx! | |
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Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
| | 07/16/2006 7:03 PM |
| | Fantasy Flight Games has always impressed me. The Seafarer's Handbook was the best aquatic book until WotC made Stormwrack. Green Ronin has always seemed very hit or miss to me. Goodman Games has some nice adventures, but the Dungeon Crawl Classics aren't really original material anyway. | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
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Weaponbreaker
Skirmisher
47 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 3:25 AM |
| | I have Dmed for most of D&D v3.X and I have to say that there are some seriously lame books produced by WotC, but I have yet to see anything D&D related that wasn't broken/overpowered, flavor (ie PrC that were just specialist wizards), or a direfently named new core class covered in a WotC product. I have allowed players to bring over feats from other publishers but only after careful consideration. Some of the monster hunter books lose relavancy pretty qwik, the "Ultimate Fighter" style books seem a waste of money. I like to stick to the basics of D&D rather than waste money on books I'll never use, and that includes many WotC books | |
Hunter of CE d20's. Destroyer of false hope and punisher evil dice across the planes. | |
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The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
13069 Posts
Mud Lick, Kentucky
| | 07/17/2006 7:23 AM |
| I've bought books from publishers like Kenzer & Co., Malhavoc, Goodman Games, Fantasy Flight, Necromancer, Penumbra and others I can't remember.
I particularly love Goodman's Dungeon Crawl Classics modules. | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM
I dont mind butting heads every once in a while. It makes thing interesting. Thats why I'd be heartbroken if Ghendar ever left - Posted By Count Dooku on 04/03/2006 11:58 AM
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Master of the
Awesome Sauce
Teflon Jeff
Warlord
7908 Posts
Sector 2814
| | 07/17/2006 8:37 PM |
| I will purchase the occasional non WotC product, But WotC is, in my opinion, much more reliable as a rule set. D20 OGL stuff can be riddled with broken feats and abilities. So can Wotc, but it's usually far less rare, and less common. I do purchase the slayer's guides, from mongoose, because I like the "fluff" they provide, for a decent price. I do buy Ravenloft (when S&S had it) as well as the occasional Dragonlance (3 books total) I also like some of Kenzerco's kalamar stuff.
Mostly, I stick with a few companies.
AEG, they are excellent, love World's largest Dungeon.
Mongoose publishing, only for the slayer's guides and encyclopaedia arcan/divine/psionica
Most E. Gary Gygax books for D20.
The occassional other company. | |
Official Delegate, Wizards of the Coast
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 8:48 PM |
| I stay away from non-WotC d20 stuff for the most part. Paizo would be an exception, and occasionally I'll pick up something from Malhavoc.
In general the editing is worse and the game balance is more, uh, "interesting" in non-WotC books. In addition a lot of it overlaps or breaks when combined with WotC d20 content that's outside the SRD (3rd party publishers besides Paizo can only use the SRD, remember.)
This is not to say that there aren't occasional gems out there, or that WotC products are perfectly edited or balanced, but there is, in my experience, a significant quality difference in WotC's favor.
Probably a lot of my antipathy for non-WotC books can be traced to my numerous problems with the first Creature Catalog, which could have been awesome... but was actually a mess. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 11:48 PM |
| | Thanks to everyone who has chimed in here. It's interesting to me to see the different opinions on various publishers. In my time reviewing products from many of these publishers, I've formed my own opinions, seemingly direct opposites of some of the players here. | |
My H/W list is not current...
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