chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
    
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 12:25 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
Which do you think is better at fighting or just overall? fighter or knight?
And the debates go on and on...
There have been numerous discusions on which is better, the fighter or the barbarian? Now a new hat is thrown in the ring. The Knight really isn't any better or worse than the barbarian or the fighter, it is just different. Decide what you want to play and design the character around it. A few levels of knight with a few levels of fighter thrown in is fine.
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CTSparky
Sneak
128 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 12:25 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
Which do you think is better at fighting or just overall? fighter or knight?
Well one of my fellow players just switched his fighter to a knight, and so far for our group it works better. Can you say AC 28??? | |
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scruffydude7
Underboss
1196 Posts
Rock Hill, SC
| | 07/17/2006 12:27 PM |
| Personally I'd go with fighter in almost any situation, mostly because they're more versatile. The Fighter's bonus feats you can do what you want with. Knights get a set group of special abilities and bonus feats. When you play a knight, you're more or less limited to the playstyle the class is built for. When you play a fighter, you get to develop your character to suit your favored playstyle.
Even if you want to play a Knight type character, you can just play a Fighter and roleplay the Knight part of it. | |
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zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/17/2006 12:41 PM |
| I like a mixture of Fighter and Knight. Granted, I like 4 levels of Fighter with virtually any fighter-type I play (weapon specialization is just too sweet to pass up).
I think that the Knight offers a nice alternative to the fighter, but, like the Barbarian, is too different to make snap comparisons against (apples and oranges). | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 12:46 PM |
| | yeah i am probably going to multi-class them, and another decision comes up. Do i want a 2hand weapon? 2 1hand weapons? or a 1hand and a shield? | |
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zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/17/2006 12:54 PM |
| Two-handed weapon + Animated Shield (or convince your party wiz/sorc to cast Shieldbearer for you) [:D]
Weapon selection all depends on your fighting style.
One of my favorite tactical combinations is two-weapon fighting, buckler, improved buckler defense. You take a -1 penalty with your off-hand and always retain the buckler's AC bonus (plus any magical enhancements) to your AC. It's a win-win situation. | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 1:19 PM |
| | The problem with fighters are they eventually run out of feats to help them, that is what led me to most like multiclassing. I was also thinking about fighter/barbarian but it wont work because im LG. | |
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zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/17/2006 2:57 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
what is animated shield?
Magical property that can be added to a shield (IIRC it's termed dancing in the DMG). You still suffer the same penalties associated with shield use (armor check, attack penalty for using tower shield), however, it defends you on its own and allows you to wield two weapons or a weapon in two hands. There are lots of debates over whether or not this particular property is broken.
Shieldbearer spell (spell compendium) basically makes any shield animated for a set period of time (1st-level spell). | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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Kunimatyu
Sergeant
725 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 3:31 PM |
| It's a +2 equivalent, I believe.
Basically, here's the rundown:
Barbarian is best for an offensive fighter-type. Use a 2handed weapon and Power Attack.
Knight is best for a defensive ("aggro-pulling") fighter-type. Use a shield and a onehanded weapon, Combat Expertise, and pump your Armor Class. The Shield Specialization tree from PHB2 is very good for them.
Fighter is good if you really want a specific feat chain, or in combination with other classes. Unless you know what you're trying to make, there are often better options, however. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 4:52 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
The problem with fighters are they eventually run out of feats to help them, that is what led me to most like multiclassing. I was also thinking about fighter/barbarian but it wont work because im LG.
I can't ever see running out of feats. There are just too many goods ones without even looking at the ones from complete warrior and players HB 2 (some of them aren't really balanced.)
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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Most Edumacated
zenthrus
Warlord
5132 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/17/2006 8:45 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
but it's as good as a +1 heavy steel shield?
Technically, it's better. It does have the same level of protection as a +1 heavy steel shield. The difference is, it allows you to dual-wield or use a two-handed weapon and still retain your shield bonus to AC. Costs about 8000gp extra (+1 heavy steel shield is roughly 1165gp) for the advantage.
Other ways to utilize an animated shield are:
Dual Wand Wielding
Lighting a torch (shouldn't be an issue if you can afford the shield, but you never know)
Using a bow/crossbow
Juggling [:D] | |
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taliesin
Underboss
1113 Posts
| | 07/17/2006 9:50 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by zenthrus
quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
but it's as good as a +1 heavy steel shield?
Other ways to utilize an animated shield are:
Juggling [:D]
Don't laugh. One of my players is a bard with perform (juggling), and a shield bonus to her AC while using her bardic music class feature wouldn't be bad for her. Maybe I'll give her a small suggestion... | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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Chris Orlando
Warrior
187 Posts
| | 07/18/2006 2:45 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
could you tell me what adamantine armor does and how much it costs? also what should i buy with 6,000 gp?
If i remember correctly adding the addimantine mod adds somewhere around +$9000 to the cost for heavy armor, and it gives you DR/Addimantine bassed on weather the armor is Light (DR 1/ Add), Med Dr 2/Add, heavy (DR 3/Add). If i remember correctly it counts as a +2 mod or somthing like that (atleast i know it does for a weapon). Also it costs marginally more to get it enchanted (I don't remember the premium but its somewhere around %25. So +1 add fullplate would cost around $10,000 + 1,250 (normal + 1 is 1000). I'm am not 100% sure about all of this, but i know if im not exactly correct, I know im close. By the way If you want a amazing weapon go with and Addamantine Greatsword because you bypass DR less than 20, so someone would need a +3 or greater weapon inorder for you to not be able to powerattack/sunder there weapon. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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Kelmech_Ra
Skirmisher
22 Posts
| | 07/18/2006 4:57 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Chris Orlando
quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
could you tell me what adamantine armor does and how much it costs? also what should i buy with 6,000 gp?
If i remember correctly adding the addimantine mod adds somewhere around +$9000 to the cost for heavy armor, and it gives you DR/Addimantine bassed on weather the armor is Light (DR 1/ Add), Med Dr 2/Add, heavy (DR 3/Add). If i remember correctly it counts as a +2 mod or somthing like that (atleast i know it does for a weapon). Also it costs marginally more to get it enchanted (I don't remember the premium but its somewhere around %25. So +1 add fullplate would cost around $10,000 + 1,250 (normal + 1 is 1000). I'm am not 100% sure about all of this, but i know if im not exactly correct, I know im close. By the way If you want a amazing weapon go with and Addamantine Greatsword because you bypass DR less than 20, so someone would need a +3 or greater weapon inorder for you to not be able to powerattack/sunder there weapon.
I believe adamantine dissolves in sunlight, however. The Drow use adamantine for most fo their weapons and armor, and prolonged exposure to sunlight weakens and eventually breaks the adamantine. | |
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 07/18/2006 5:44 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kelmech_Ra
I believe adamantine dissolves in sunlight, however. The Drow use adamantine for most fo their weapons and armor, and prolonged exposure to sunlight weakens and eventually breaks the adamantine.
Your confusing adamantine with adamantite from 2nd ed (and I might be misremembering the name myself). In the latest edition, this is just a material that you can make armor and weapons from, there is no ties with vulnerability to sunlight. There is a weapon enhancement in FR Underdark that simulates this and has the properties you mention. | |
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Darastrix Maekrix
dariustad
Warlord
6322 Posts
| | 07/19/2006 12:06 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Chris Orlando
quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
could you tell me what adamantine armor does and how much it costs? also what should i buy with 6,000 gp?
If i remember correctly adding the addimantine mod adds somewhere around +$9000 to the cost for heavy armor, and it gives you DR/Addimantine bassed on weather the armor is Light (DR 1/ Add), Med Dr 2/Add, heavy (DR 3/Add). If i remember correctly it counts as a +2 mod or somthing like that (atleast i know it does for a weapon). Also it costs marginally more to get it enchanted (I don't remember the premium but its somewhere around %25. So +1 add fullplate would cost around $10,000 + 1,250 (normal + 1 is 1000). I'm am not 100% sure about all of this, but i know if im not exactly correct, I know im close. By the way If you want a amazing weapon go with and Addamantine Greatsword because you bypass DR less than 20, so someone would need a +3 or greater weapon inorder for you to not be able to powerattack/sunder there weapon.
Where to begin...
1) The cost per items, which nycfarmkid said nearly correctly:
Light: +5000gp
Medium: +10,000gp
heavy: +15,000gp
2) All admantine weapons are considered masterwork, thus granting them a +1 to attack rolls. All adamantine armour is also masterwork, with a subsequent -1 to AC penalty.
3) The "default" magic enhancement for all metals was dropped in the move from 3.0 to 3.5. The Masterwork properties take over instead. In anti-magic areas, they retain the +1 to attack rolls. It no longer (officially) retains the +2 to attacks -- this can be house ruled, of course.
4) The Damage Resistance offered by Adamantine armour is as follows:
Light: 1/-
Medium: 2/-
Heavy: 3/-
It is not dependent on the metal. It functions just like the Barbarian's ability to ignore damage from every thing thrown at it.
5) Adamantine does not cost more than steel to be enchanted. You have this confused with cold iron.
6)
Example: +1 Adamantine Full Plate
Cost: +1 (1000 gp), Adamantine full plate (16,500gp (15,000 (adamantine) + 1500 (full plate) = 17,500gp
The masterwork cost is already included in the price of the adamantine. It doesn't have to be added a second time. | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
| | 07/19/2006 10:09 PM |
| | Is there a way i can hold a greatsword in one hand (probably taking some penalty) and holding a shield in the other and not animated shield? | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/20/2006 12:15 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
Is there a way i can hold a greatsword in one hand (probably taking some penalty) and holding a shield in the other and not animated shield?
Yes there is a feat in the complete warrior that allows you to use a weapon one size larger, called "Monkey Grip" it gives you a -2 to hit instead of the usual -4. You would lose the advantages of a two handed weapon though (double the amount on power attack for instance and the bonus for disarm and sunder.)
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Thenameless
Warlord
12481 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 07/20/2006 7:34 PM |
| | From what I gather, the knight is specifically better at challenging a tough opponent, while a fighter is better for general purpose combat. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
| | 07/20/2006 10:11 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Malin Lug
quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
Is there a way i can hold a greatsword in one hand (probably taking some penalty) and holding a shield in the other and not animated shield?
Yes there is a feat in the complete warrior that allows you to use a weapon one size larger, called "Monkey Grip" it gives you a -2 to hit instead of the usual -4. You would lose the advantages of a two handed weapon though (double the amount on power attack for instance and the bonus for disarm and sunder.)
Also this feat was errated to disallow the use of a Large 2 handed weapon in two hands. It only works on weapons held in one hand. | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 07/21/2006 8:41 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by chrisman321
so you are saying i can't hold a greatsword in one hand then?
That's not what he's saying, but it's a little confusing if you don't know the feat. The feat allows you to hold in one hand a weapon that is one size larger than what you can usually hold. So for a medium creature, you can normally only hold a lonsword or similar size weapon in one hand.
With this feat you can hold any weapon that a medium sized creature can hold in two hands in one hand (there is another benefit but that's not the kind you are looking for). Soyou can hold a greatsword or a large one handed weapon in one hand (both normally requiring two). It was errata'd so that in no way could a medium character use a Large two handed weapon in one hand. To get around this, you need to be a race with Powerful Build, like Goliaths. | |
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chrisman321
Warrior
308 Posts
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 07/23/2006 1:05 AM |
| Yup. That's a potential drawback but it may be worth it for the money you save.
First, before I go on, you only get 1.5 your Str bonus wielding something with two hands, not 2x. You do get 2 x your power attack, though which is what you may be thinking of.
If you do the math, then, you see that it's not so bad. If you have less than an 18 Str, you only lose one point of damage on average. From 18 to 21 Str it's only 2 points. It's not that much of a difference.
Power attack changes this as you do lose more on average, as you'll miss more often and for each point you draw off your BAB for power attack the gap will widen by 1 point. If you want to power attack often I wouldn't do this. | |
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