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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
    
Wadsworth, OH
 | | 12/14/2006 9:24 AM |
| I've been tinkering with this build for awhile now. Figure I could post it here to get a few thoughts. The idea behind this character was to try to have the versatility of a mystic theurge build, but without haveing to multiclass. Please feel free to make comments or suggestions. I do have some room to switch feats around if needed. Hopefully this will be the nest character I am able to run.
Setting: Forgotten Realms
Race: Human Cleric of Mystra
Class Variants: Spontaneous Domain Casting (PH2), Flaws (Unearthed Arcana), Cloistered Cleric (Unearthed Arcana)
Domains: Rune, Magic (Spontaneous Casting), Knowledge (Cloistered Cleric Bonus), Spell (Divine Disciple Bonus)
Flaws: Non-combatant, (flaw that makes you suffer armore based spellcasting failure with divine spells)
Class Progression
Cloistered Cleric 5/Dweomerkeeper 2/Divine Disciple 3/Dweomerkeeper 1/Divine Disciple 1/Dweomerkeeper 7/Divine Disciple1
Feats:
1st: Magical Training (Regional), Divine Spell Power (Human), Improved Initiative (flaw), Improved Counterspell (flaw)
3rd: Customize Domain (Dragon Magazine)
6th: Reactive Counterspell
9th: Initiate of Mystra
12th: Truename (Dragon Magazine)
15th: Quicken Spell
18th: ??
The Dweomerkeeper allows a PC to add certain spells to a list that can be spontaneously cast using any spell slot much like a Cleric already can cast Cure or Inflict Spells. Add that to the Spontaneous Domain Casting and you will have a lot of useful spells to spontaneously cast. You do lose the ability to spontaneously cast cure spells, but you are able to memorize them in your domain slot. The amount of healing I can do will be reduced, but with with the right selection of spells, that can be mitigated somewhat.
Mantle of Spells:
3rd: Dispel Magic
6th: Greater Dispel Magic
7th: Limited Wish (from Spell domain granted from Divine Disciple)
8th: Chain Dispel
9th: Miracle
The Customize Domain feat allows you to substitute spells on your domain for other spells of the same type. The magic domain, however, allows you to add any spell you have access to, except it must be from one level lower. Since the magic domain granted power allows you to use magic items as if you had access to the wizard spell list, you can add wizard spells to the domain. After customize domain this is what the Magic domain would look like (spells with an * were originally in the domain):
1st: Detect Magic
2nd: Magic Missile
3rd: Scorching Ray
4th: Fly
5th: Improved Invisibility
6th: Firebrand
7th: Spell Turning*
8th: Greater Teleport
9th: Mordenkainen's Dysjunction*
This will give me access to some of the best Wizard Spells, if at one level higher.
The initiate of mystra feat also gives me access to Anyspell and Greater Anyspell as regular cleric spells. you can now memorize any 1st or 2nd wizard spell in a third level spell slot, and any 1st - 5th spell in a 6th level spell slot, as long as you have a scroll or spellbook.
The Dweomerkeeper also has the ability to cast a few spells each day as supernatural spells. This means that spells can be cast and ignore SR, attacks of opportunity, and all components. This would allow the casting of Limited Wish and Miracle without the loss of XP. Now, this could easily be abused, but as long as you stick with using them to create the effects of 6th and 7th level arcane spells, it shouldn't cause too much trouble with a DM.
This character has the ability then to cast almost any wizard spell of 7th level or lower, and always has a way to keep his/her own buff spells from being dispelled. I would say its worth a turn to dispel your opponent's dispel, greater dispel, chain dispel, or Mordenkainen's Dysjunction.
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 12/14/2006 1:52 PM |
| I would say its worth a turn to dispel your opponent's dispel, greater dispel, chain dispel, or Mordenkainen's Dysjunction.
A very true statement. Have you thought of taking Divine Spell Power? Your turning ability is not worth it since you haven't pumped feats into it, which is fine, but you can dump to make turning attempts to change the level of your spells. Since buffs are important, this raises caster level which increases time, number affected, bonus, etc. and has the added bonus of making it harder to dispel if that caster has a quickened dispel spell ready after you dispeled the firts one. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
| | 12/14/2006 2:45 PM |
| Actually yeah I have divine spell power in there at first level. I figured it would work best there since it is a pretty handy feat. Just hope to have a high enough Charisma to have a pretty reasonable chance to avoid the penalties.
Also of note: The spell Battlemagic Perception in Heroes of Battle allows you to sense and counter spellcasting as a free action. It says that otherwise counterspelling is handled normally. The wording is a little confusing on how the spell would work if you did not have the Reactive Counterspell feat, however with the feat it seems clear that you could counterspell a single spell and not have to skip your next turn as long as that spell was up.
This build will have a much lower healing output than a standard cleric, due to the loss of the ability to spontaneously cast cure spells, but the right spell choices can help somewhat. Therer are certain spells, such as mass lesser vigor and vigorous circle, that let you heal a group for 1, 3, 5, etc hp a round, and last for as much as 25 rounds. This build would still let you heal the party, but it will not be as effective in the middle of combat. The healing will have to be done outside of combat, aside from the heal spell anyway. These would be good spells to have on scrolls and wands.
This build can also get a lot out of the scribe scroll feat. The Truename feats allows you to increase the caster level of items you create without increasing their base cost. You could make a scroll of magic missile at the price listed in the DMG but have it cast at your character level. This can be pretty handy with certain spells. you also may want to add another item creation feat in there, such as craft staff or wand to use this ability to the fullest.
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 12/14/2006 3:20 PM |
| I missed that feat in the list of 20. Now, if you are looking for a good 18th level feat, maybe Heighten Turning? Combined with Divine Spell Power you can insure that your caster level when using it is always +4 without rolling.
In my curent campaign I'm playing a healing/turning cleric. Something I found useful is using rods of extend spell on the vigor spells which doubles the healing output of each spell. If it lasts long enough, and you have the slot, fast healing 5 a round during combat is still good, even if at your level this isn't healing fast enough.
Reading your build over again, I think you can't add the arcane spells to your list. The Magic domain does not give you access to those spells, just allows you to use spell completion items as if you had them on your list. A cleric can't use the Magic domain to make arcane wands, fpr instance. Unfortunately, the spells aren't on your list for your mantle of spells either. | |
Completed trades: blackthorne, Drakkengi,Thorgrin, Ironfist Boulderbender x2, ckissee, nasamonkey, Username, Star, Ace13 x3, emontedodger x2, Drconveyor, church, Joeyb, Sir Bozak The Damned, Xeromod, the other guy x2, Qucalion of Celene, Dagaron x2, berus316, qillan_dvra, AshloreDarkShadow
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 12/14/2006 4:27 PM |
| | Yeah, I concur that as written the Magic domain doesn't work like that. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
| | 12/14/2006 7:12 PM |
| I'll agree that the wording of the feat from Dragon for Customize domain is a little fuzzy. I may have to ask for some sort of official ruling. Here is the text from the feat.
Customize Domain
Type: General
Source: Dragon #325
You open up one of your domains to new sources of magical power.
Prerequisite: At least one domain, ability to cast 3rd-level divine spells.
Benefit: Choose one of your cleric domains. You permanently exchange spells on your domain spell list for similar spells on any spell list you have access to. You customize your domain when you choose this feat; you cannot later change your domain spells or return to your original domain spell list. You can only choose to substitute spells that are of equal or lower level and that adhere to the following restrictions by domain. Note that certain spells gain descriptors depending on how they're cast; you can choose such a spell as a spell with the descriptor you require so long as you only cast the spell in such a manner as to give it that descriptor.
- Air: Spells with the air or electricity descriptors.
- Animal:
Spells that specifically affect animals, spells that summon animals,
spells that have animals in their name (such as bull's strength and
owl's wisdom).
- Chaos: Spells with the chaotic descriptor.
Death: Spells that create death effects or that deal with the undead. - Destruction: Evocation spells that deal damage.
- Earth: Spells with the earth descriptor.
- Evil: Spells with the evil descriptor.
- Fire: Spells with the fire descriptor.
- Good: Spells with the good descriptor.
- Healing: Spells of the healing subschool.
- Knowledge: Divination spells.
- Law: Spells with the lawful descriptor.
- Luck: Abjuration spells or spells that allow a bonus on a d20 roll
- Magic: Any kind of spell, but you must select a spell one level lower than normal.
- Plant: Spells that specifically affect plants, spells that summon plant creatures, spells that have plants in their names (such as treestride)
- Protection: Abjuration spells.
- Strength: Spells that grant a bonus to Strength or cause a penalty to strength.
- Sun: Spells with the light descriptor.
- Travel: Spells that alter speed or provide movement.
- Trickery: Illusion or transmutation spells that alter appearance.
- War: Spells that begin with "mass."
- Water: Spells with the water descriptor and spells that create or modify water.
Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new domain.
As far as the mantle of spells goes, all of the spells added to it are on the cleric class list, except for Limited Wish, which is in the Spell domain.
If the Customize Domain trick wouldn't work, the build still has plenty of tricks up its sleeve. Would put the initiate of mystra feat there instead so I'd have access to Anyspell earlier. I'm not sure the customize domain feat would be worth it due to the level below requirement. though, on a mroe rational side of things, im not entirely sure it makes sense to have to put cleric spells at a higher level then you would get them normally. Oh well.
EDIT: The Spell domain is not listed here. If you were to try the feat on that domain, how would you categorize it? Would it be like the Magic Domain? Would it be different?
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gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 12/14/2006 7:55 PM |
| If I am guessing your thought process, you are taking the phrase "Any kind of spell" to mean any spell. However, it really is "any kind of spell you have access to". The magic domain does not give yo access to the spells, for instance a cleric can't cast fireball unless it is on a domain list. The desciption under the domains does not trump the paragraph above it, which would invalidate your choice of domain spells. To do what you want you'd need levels in some arcane class.
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Completed trades: blackthorne, Drakkengi,Thorgrin, Ironfist Boulderbender x2, ckissee, nasamonkey, Username, Star, Ace13 x3, emontedodger x2, Drconveyor, church, Joeyb, Sir Bozak The Damned, Xeromod, the other guy x2, Qucalion of Celene, Dagaron x2, berus316, qillan_dvra, AshloreDarkShadow
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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