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Subject: X-Men 3

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Sammael
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05/25/2006 5:16 PM  
Before going to see the movie, answer the following questions for yourself:

Do I care about the way characters are presented?
Do I want the plot to make sense?
Does pacing and direction matter to me?

Do I like special effects to the exclusion of the above three?

If you answered "yes" to at least one of the first three questions and "no" to the fourth one, avoid this movie like the plague. I won't spoil anything, I'll just say that I love the first two X-Men movies and thought they were strong movies in their own right, regardless of their comic ties (and I've never read a single X-Men comic in my life). The third installment is... different.

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Orion72
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05/25/2006 6:32 PM  
No.
No.
No.

Yes!

It's been a really long time since anyone bothered to make sense of these characters as people. All I care about at this point is lots of cool fight scenes.

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05/25/2006 11:40 PM  
I've been on the fence about this one: I still can't make up my mind. I'm keen to see Kitty, Beast and Angel get into things. But I'm also very wary about the "revolving director" situation they had.

Why couldn't Singer have stayed?!

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05/26/2006 2:40 AM  
Never saw the first two, so can't compare, but great special effects, and a very political theme.

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05/26/2006 3:55 AM  
Yup, it was quite disappointment. It was nice because it was X-men and had cool effects, but like in too many movies today, focus was fully on effects. Afterwards I thought that the movie should have had dark feeling, but it didn't feel like it.

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05/26/2006 4:40 AM  
Ahhh but the question is did you stay until the very end of the credits? [:D]

Dark Feeling? The movie ends on a generally optimistic high.

OP:
1) And how were the characters presented in your opinion? IMO many of the character were marginalized, but then again the most was alot shorter then I expected. So that lost time could have been used to add more character to Colossus, Jean, Mystic, Callisto, Storm, Rogue. But let's face it Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellan & Hugh Jackman are who people supposedly want to see so that's who we mostly saw.

2) Simple plot, 'cure' for mutants reflecting the 80/90's american christian view that homosexuality could be 'cured'. Plot 2 Jean Grey is back from the dead but 'something' is changed about her. (Sub-)Plot 3 sexual tension in Rogue as she believes she's loosing Bobby to Kitty, and questions whether or not this 'cure' is the answer to her problems.

3) Pacing & Direction, both were done well. They were done for a fast-paced Popcorn Action film. Now if we had gotten more character developement, Ratner would have had to change his style more to fit the Drama it would have involved, but drama was kept to a minimum.


I did get a kick out of Jamie Madrox/Multiple Man's two appearances. What I was disappointed with is that the Character's Siryn, Jubilee & Psylocke were credited in the film, but I didn't even notice them this time. At least Siryn was featured breifly in X2.

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05/26/2006 12:55 PM  
is the problem with the movie because it strays from the comics or is it justa bad movie. if u had no knowledge of the character would it be a decent movie.

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05/26/2006 1:23 PM  
I have very little knowledge of the comics, and I thought the movie itself was bad (compared to the previous two movies).

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05/26/2006 3:16 PM  
Grraaah! As a comic fan, I was very disappointed in the movie. I'm a huge Juggernaut fan, I was even more disappointed. Mutant? Ha! Only 7 feet tall? Ha! I'll still buy it when it comes out of course, but still...


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05/26/2006 3:35 PM  
The rest of the Marvel Universe doent seem to apply to the X-men movies.
The Spider man and Fantastic 4 movies dont cross over into the X-Men movies.
So there are only Mutants...Did you really expect Juggernaught to be anything other than a mutant? Getting his powers from a mystical crystal just doesnt fit in with the movies.

I havent seen it yet...But I will base my opinion based on the 2 previous movies. I will not compare them to the comic books.

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05/26/2006 8:32 PM  
I get off work at 9:30pm and will be watching it at the local thearer complex at 10pm.

I am there because I have already seen the other 2 so I gotta see the 3rd, and I am all about seeing effects, at this point I don't expect much plot from comic book movies.

The only way to get Juggernaut right (per previews) would've been to make it all CG and I rather they do not do things like that. I can still tell they are fake and it would have been as horrific as Hulk.

Comics are comics and nothing can capture that, not even films, imho, no matter how much technology advances in the visual field.

Looking forward to it and I got 93 minutes to go

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05/26/2006 9:11 PM  
Just saw it, not for sure yet if I liked it or not. Special effects were great. I can't say more without spoiling it.

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05/26/2006 9:22 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by arcabious

Just saw it, not for sure yet if I liked it or not. Special effects were great. I can't say more without spoiling it.

thanks [:D]

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maijstral
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05/26/2006 10:35 PM  
I saw it and liked it.

I read the X-men comics for about 15 years,stopped about 5 years ago so I'm not familar with current events in the marvel world, so i'm familar with the basic characters but i try not to judge the movie based on the comic characters. I had no problem with the plot or the way the characters were presented I was a little disapointed with the lack of screen time of some characters but with a huge cast some are going to get shorted.I also didn't like what happened to a few of the characters, but this is 'comic book' land and anything can be changed in the future with imaginative writers.

If you see this movie you need to pay attention to the last scene before the credits(or just as the credits start I can't quite remember) and stay till the last credit has rolled.

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05/27/2006 1:14 AM  
Primary comment: Movie was too short.

Secondary comment: If plans are in the works for a fourth film, this film served its purpose very well. If this is the last of the line....umm....somebody in the scriptwriting/directing department needs a solid kick [:P]

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05/27/2006 2:56 AM  
Can’t recall right off hand. Has “Gambit” been included yet in the movie version?

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Sammael
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05/27/2006 3:08 AM  
Nope, no Gambit yet. And nobody in my theater waited for the end of credits... everybody was impatient to get out of there.

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05/27/2006 11:04 AM  
I enjoyed it, but am hoping for an "Extended Version" on DVD. I look at it like "The 13th Warrior" where they cut too much to get it to ADHD movie length. Unlike "The 13th Warrior" they didn't mainly chop the intro and outro, but a bits of character parts all along.

They did drop some MAJOR surprises along the way. Things that may rub fans the wrong way. They also had the problem of too many "main" characters. They still kept the Xavier/Magneto dynamic, which is very well done. Their friendship is reminiscent of the Carville household: Love and philosophical opposition. The charcter they seemed to cut the most from was Rogue, which is too bad because the Bobby/Marie/Kitty dynamic was a good one.

Kelsey Grammer was a terrific Beast.

A new controcersy started among us last night: Did the chess piece move?

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05/27/2006 11:26 AM  
As a fan of the comics I felt this movie took way too many liberties with the story. I think non fans will enjoy it more but I could not overcome it. I thought it suffered from MK: Annihilation syndrome, trying to cram way to much Marvel lore into one movie.
Oh and for the guy who inquired about Gambit, I think they kinda combined his role with Iceman's to reduce the focus on one character. But thats just my theory.
There will be a Weapon X movie coming shortly with Hugh Jackman again as Wolverine, hopefully it will be better.

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05/27/2006 12:13 PM  
If there's no Gambit, the movie can't be all bad!

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05/27/2006 2:30 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Can of the Cave Beer

If there's no Gambit, the movie can't be all bad!

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Gambit is one of the things that represents everything wrong in the late 80s early 90s comics. Can't decide on a gimmick so he has a staff and playing cards, can't decide on a costume so he has tights and a trench coat... its character creation by committee at its worst.

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05/27/2006 3:36 PM  
The movie was fine.
It wasn't perfect but it was good enough to serve as escapeism for a while.
The Prof X-Magneto duo working together to recruit a young Jean Grey was well done, as was the ending Wolverine/Pheonix showdown.
The flash of Sentinels in the Danger Room sequence was a nice nod to Project: Wideawake and the fastball special maneuver is X-men canon.
Leech, Calisto, and Arclight showing up was interesting but a little shocking given the Maruaders/Morlocks storyline in the comics and left me wondering about the movies timelines.
The Juggernaut would have HAD to be CGI to be the size he is in the comics so I don't blame the film maker for going with a bulky actor instead there.
The bridge sequence was great and highlighted Magnetos raw power.
The only real downside was the death of everal key characters for no good reason. Put them in the hospital/prison/into a coma/ but not kill them. It's almost a comic book law that no one ever dies...permanently. In comic book movies, the directors seem to go out of their way to kill off characters (all the villains of the batman movies, spiderman 1, etc).
All in all, a fun movie and worth the price of admission. YMMV.

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05/27/2006 6:09 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Grim


The only real downside was the death of everal key characters for no good reason. Put them in the hospital/prison/into a coma/ but not kill them. It's almost a comic book law that no one ever dies...permanently.



The deaths in this movie came from a mandate from Fox. Fox said these chars need to die so they did it.

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05/27/2006 7:15 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by AesophDarkfable

quote:
Originally posted by Grim


The only real downside was the death of everal key characters for no good reason. Put them in the hospital/prison/into a coma/ but not kill them. It's almost a comic book law that no one ever dies...permanently.



The deaths in this movie came from a mandate from Fox. Fox said these chars need to die so they did it.



I didn't want to spoil it by mentioning character death but now that the cats out of the bag.......

almost all the 'deaths' can be countered especially using comic book logic.

using invisotext, the first death scott cyclops summers we never saw any body or death for that matter we, and they , just assumed he died because of the proffessors reaction. The second death professor X , the last scene after the credits takes care of that one sort of. and the third death..... jean gray,she's died once and they brought her back and after all she is code named pheonix, she died at least twice in the comic books

all i'm saying is if they want to bring those characters back they would have no real problem.

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05/27/2006 8:26 PM  
For me the best part about X3 was the Superman preview.... well that and the Golden Gate bridge, that was pretty cool. I wasn't expecting the movie to live up to either of the previous two.

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05/28/2006 2:57 AM  
I'm pretty mad I skipped the credits end. Someone want to fill me in in whitetext?

Yes, the piece moved a bit at the end of the movie.

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05/28/2006 4:12 AM  
nm




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05/28/2006 8:03 AM  
Well one thing I was disappointed with is....What happened to Nightcrawler!?

No Gambit, that's a good thing in my books, Longshot was a better character in my books and even he paled in comparison to Nightcrawler.

I would have loved more of Colossus, the fact that in the comics he and Kitty were romantically involved; I would have preferred this to a bobby/marie/kitty triangle. Heck make it a square and throw Peter into the mix! [)]

Ya the chess piece moved, remember their had never actually been a successful test of the drug, Warren was supposed to be the first subject. IMHO I think the syrum is only a suppressant with a limited life-span.

As for Juggernaut, I totally love him in the comics, But I expected to see some serious changes for the movie. So yes, he's smaller, weaker a mutant and not the Step-Brother of Xavier, Oh and he's british. Where as Pyro isn't british but american in the movies.

Changes need to be made, I expect this with just about any and every comic book adaptation. I can easily accept this so long as the story works.

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05/28/2006 2:12 PM  
Considering how few lines Collossus had, he should have faked a Russian accent, even if it was bad.

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05/28/2006 3:11 PM  
Wasn't Pyro an Australian in the comics?

I'm not surprised to hear about Juggernaut's size. He's gone through a lot of changes in the comics over the years. Although I'm disappointed to learn that he's no longer related to Xavier.

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05/28/2006 8:44 PM  
I though it wasn't to bad of a movie, they changed some stuff around from comics, but it was about the same as what they did with the first two movies stories. I can't say I liked the change in director though. The feeling/tone of this movie was different from the last two and I really noticed it. They also had a lot more swearing in it. I liked the more subdued references in the first two, but I have to say the kick in the balls was good. Overall I though this was a lot more violent then the first two and I was kinda wishing I had screened it before I took my 8 year old to it.

I can't say I was happy with the idea that two of the main characters died off. I'm thinking they might have a fourth one on the back burned if this one does well enough.

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05/29/2006 2:50 AM  
quote:
Originally posted by Can of the Cave Beer

Wasn't Pyro an Australian in the comics?

I'm not surprised to hear about Juggernaut's size. He's gone through a lot of changes in the comics over the years. Although I'm disappointed to learn that he's no longer related to Xavier.



I don't remember the movie even addressing if he was related or not.

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05/29/2006 9:04 AM  
quote:
Originally posted by Corim Danex
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Can of the Cave Beer

Wasn't Pyro an Australian in the comics?

I'm not surprised to hear about Juggernaut's size. He's gone through a lot of changes in the comics over the years. Although I'm disappointed to learn that he's no longer related to Xavier.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't remember the movie even addressing if he was related or not.

I think everyone just assumed that since they changed Juggernaut so much, and since they never mentioned he was related to Xavier, he must not be related any more. I did.

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05/29/2006 11:34 AM  
They likely left the Juggernaut as Xavier's brother out because it would have added nothing to the story, same as Juggernaut's crystaline origin. Heck, they edited enough of the more "important" character stuff that I would have been vexed had they added that stuff in. They didn't follow the comics exactly which is also good. The comics are a different medium and those that wanted the movies to remain "true" are a niche of a niche and not worth catering to if you sacrifice a better movie (re: better ticket sales/profit) just to make the anal-retentive geeks happy.

Internal dialog is a beyotch to do in a movie, so I'm actually glad they never did the Thomas Covenant movies that Donaldson was in talks to do a number of years ago.

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05/29/2006 4:46 PM  
Dagnabit! I left right after he moved the chess piece. Can someone tell me in whitext or email about what that last scene was about?

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05/29/2006 7:45 PM  
quote:
Dagnabit! I left right after he moved the chess piece. Can someone tell me in whitext or email about what that last scene was about?


here you go

the veggy body that prof X was talking about earlier in the movie in the class setting about transfering another persons mind into the body was showned at the end of the credits. After Jean offed the prof he was able to transfer his mind to that body. The doctor that was friends with Prof X comes into the room and he talks to her and she's stunned and askes if is him. So basicly he can come back in another movie.

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05/29/2006 9:39 PM  
Ok I saw it. I thought it was excellent.
I dont understand what the problem is. It takes ALOT of liberties from the comics. The X-Men movie universe is a completely different continuity from the Marvel Comics universe.
For what it was it was just as good as its predicessors. The story made perfect sence. I dont understand people getting confused about the plot.
If Juggernaught was Prof.X's step-brother that would have added more to bog down the plot. Making him just another mutant to join the brotherhood and replace Sabertooth and Toad was perfect. Thats all he's good for anyway. He didnt need to be fleshed out. Same with all the morlocks. They are mutants who join the brotherhood...period. Perfect. Why make things complicated?


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05/30/2006 1:37 AM  
I agree, my initial reaction was just frustration from going to a 12:00AM showing, my fanboy heart set on some amazing, comic true event, and not getting it. My rational mind knew this is how it would be, and as I think about it more, it worked just how it should have. It was easy for people who aren't Marvel fans to follow along without having to worry about where the heck Phoenix came from, or why Juggernaut wasn't a mutant.

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Umass Amherst Baby!

05/30/2006 2:38 AM  
After a few days of digestion I've roughly broken it down why I didn't like the movie... !Spoiler alert!











1) Magneto - I wasn't keen on the acting direction for Magneto in this movie, he seemed a tad too bloodthirsty in regards to his "fellow" Mutants. His treatment of Mystique after her transformation kinda shook me too. Magneto is a great villian because he is a sypathetic character, the acting direction for the movie changed it...

2) Ice-man / Rogue subplot - I found this to be pretty iritating and distracting from the overall plot. We allready have the "love" portion of the movie covered with Jean Grey and Logan. I could have gone without that whole bit.

3) Psyclops / Prof X - I know they were not able to get the actor who plays Psycops to be in the whole movie. I realy felt it could have been a much better piece with him in it. Also I felt the Prof X biting it and then doing the "Transfer" was lame.



Pathetic Earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void - without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe - anything at all - you would have hidden from it in terror.

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05/30/2006 8:53 AM  
I've been a comics fan for years, I've read every X-Men comic ever published (ok, almost!), I can recite the dialogue of the first two movies by heart, and I gotta say...


X-MEN 3 TOTALLY ROCKED!!!!


I think an action movie is exactly what I needed. Three movies into the franchise, the characters are sufficiently well-developed that I don't need tons of talking head scenes. I need mutants beating each other to bloody pulps, and that's what I got.

I won't go into too many spoilers, but this movie killed me with the awesome details and side-bits that only an X-fan would even notice - just like the first two. (I think Whedon should be happy that so much of his recent stuff was borrowed.)

I wanna see it again!
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