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D&D Miniatures
Guru
guyf
Sergeant
545 Posts
    
 | | 04/09/2006 8:49 PM |
| At this point, I kind of regret bringing up the whole slow play issue. I don't want anybody to take this as a "Slow Play at the California Open" headline. My report is a first draft of info that will ultimately go up on my web site, so it contains info that I wouldn't necessarily have included in just a message board post. If somebody wants to talk more about slow play, they should start a new thread.
So please keep this thread on topic: Let's talk about everybody's great experience at the Open! [:)] | |
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Guy Fullerton
Official D&D Miniatures Net Rep | |
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elder_basilisk
Sergeant
410 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 9:17 PM |
| My report:
In the main tournament I played:
Coatl
Cleric of order
Rikka
Justice Archon x3
Man at arms
hill dwarf warrior
Broken Demongate
Round 1:
vs. Gil Acosta with blood ghost beserker x2, urthok, helmed horror, goblin skirmisher, xorn, timber wolf. Map-teleport temple
I thought this was going to be a good matchup for me, but obviously it wasn't. Gil started by winning map init and selecting teleport temple. He was able to get turn one assault points and I started Rikka on my start area in order to benefit from greater resistance. Then I moved her up to control a teleporter on round 1 and didn't get it off anyway. Bad move. So by turn two, I was behind on points and Gil was retreating to a defensible area. I took a risk and moved Rikka and my coatl agressively through the teleporters after Urthok. In the next turn, I was able to move some support up but then I moved a key justice archon that had been blocking a route for one blood ghost beserker to access the coatl. That blood ghost moved up, and hit the coatl which routed. Then, in short order, Rikka routed as well. By this time, I opted to have the justice archons beat on the helmed horror rather than kill the xorn or Urthok and they proceeded to miss on six or seven straight attacks (with only two more needed to defeat it). Then the xorn killed my cleric of order, and my justice archons started running for the exit. They didn't have to make it though since assault points pushed Gil over the edge.
Congrats to Gil on taking what should have been a tough matchup and schooling me.
Round 2: Vs. a player whose name I don't remember with:
2x HGB, tiefling, wardrummer, orc warrior.
I won initiative, picked broken demongate, then won again and set up on the good side. In turn 1, he moved his lead hill giant up to within 8 squares of Rikka (deployed on the forward start area), so I was able to move Rikka up and attack then follow up by placing all my justice archons in flanking positions.
Next turn, I won initiative again. One of the justice archons attacked twice and the front hill giant routed. Through some combination of hits and misses on AoOs, it ended up with 5 hit points, a few squares from the exit and still not having attacked. I attacked the second HGB with a justice archon that was basing it and also hit twice. He activated that hill giant, hit the justice archon once and then I followed up with attacks from Rikka (95 damage total--he passes morale), the other justice archon (130 damage total) and a snakes' swiftness on a justice archon for the kill. The game went another round or two, but that was the exciting part. So, my band worked like it was supposed to against HGBs. Too bad I only drew one HGB matchup.
Round 3: Vs. Guy--3x helmed horror, dark moon monk, etc.
Guy summed this one up pretty well. It was a tough matchup and slightly sub-average rolls left him with two helmed horrors rather than one by the time it was three justice archons vs. the helmed horrors. The justice archons routed and that was all she wrote. I had been thinking I would stay in if I was 2/1 and there was a decent population of hill giants, chraals, and other decent matchups but at 1/2 I was out of it. So I dropped in favor of the other tournament.
Having lost to blood ghost beserkers with my justice archons and then followed up by a decisive loss to helmed horrors, I wan't feeling too good about my warband choice. But what to play? I decided that if thinking, analyizing, and debating endlessly left me 1/2, I should just go with something whacky and that way I could always blame a bad showing on inadequate preparation rather than inadequate skill. I'd just gotten a sword archon and 3x iron golem+cleric of Yondalla still seemed like a bad idea so I borrowed three sacred watchers and made the band. I had ten points left and though a standardbearer might have still been a better choice, I chose Mialee | |
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scottsch
Skirmisher
4 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 11:11 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
The Arcane Ballista success is interesting. I'd be interested in seeing a list of the matches he won, and the matches where he got to use his map.
My band was Arcane Ballista, Couatl, Aspect of Kord, Cleric of Order, Warforged Scout, Protectar, Human Commoner, and Man-At-Arms. My map was the Broken Demongate. Unfortunately, I didn't keep notes and don't remember all the matches, so I'll ramble a bit about my band and then see what examples I can remember.
Having the ballista and also a big hitter as two targets for Snake's Swiftness worked really well. The trouble with the ballista is that it's hard to get into place and keep it from getting based. Kord would be good for clearing away guys that base the ballista (though this never happened). Mainly, the two are great because you have two different ways to get another 30+ damage per round, and one is very likely to be doable.
Kord was a bit better than a Marut because the extra points let me take the Cleric of Order (Commander 5) instead of the Cleric of Yondalla (3). The extra initiative bonus helped a ton, and the extra damage and movement was awesome. Also, the Cleric of Order's Shield of Faith and Major Resistance brought Kord closer to the toughness of a Marut.
I lost to Sven (my second game) and Rob (in the final four), mainly because they are better players. They were both on my map and I was on the angel side (my preferred side). Sven had two Hill Giant Barbarians, a Cursed Spirit, etc. He wandered around the other side, giving me a few shots at those giants. I did 120 damage to one, but it wasn't enough. That was my first low-scoring game ever, so I was a bit surprised when time ran out without the big pieces engaging each other. He won even without the 10 tile points his Cursed Spirit grabbed.
I played Rob twice in a row (at the end of the first part and in the final four). I won the first game, even though I hadn't figured out low-scoring games, because he gave my ballista a shot at a Chraal that Kord had wounded. 30+55 finished it off, and my routing cleric (who stopped 1 square short of the exit) managed to rally. The second game was even more hide-and-seek, and I still hadn't figured it out. He killed my Human Commoner and that was it, 3-0. In the last round, I rushed in and had a few 5% chances at victory, but Rob arranged it so that I just couldn't do enough damage to kill a Chraal or get at anything else.
By the way, we were running really close on time in the second last round, and Rob hurried to finish his turn even though otherwise, he would have won right then. (If he had taken his time, it wouldn't have been stalling, because the situation was pretty complex.) That was really gentlemanly. I'm glad we have such fun groups of players in California.
I won a few games just because people didn't realize that the ballista can get in a shot on the first round. One was on the map with the resistance blessings. He brought his Kord out into the middle right away, so I blasted him for 45. He made his morale save, but next round I hit him with my Kord and a lesser sonic orb before he got to attack. I nearly lost my Kord finishing off the remaining Brass Samurai and two Half-Ogre Barbarians, but it still wouldn't have been close.
The other quick one was against two Hill Giant Barbarians, on my map when I was on the demon side. He brought his Tiefling Commander into the middle on the first move, and I blew him up. His giants rushed me and one did manage to base my ballista, but with Kord doing 70 damage/round, those giants went away quickly. (One or both failed morale checks.)
The rest were on my map. I played a band with two Death Knights and a Cleric of Nerull. He didn't quite figure LoS right, so 2/4 hits in the first two rounds brought him down to 5hp. That one tried an ineffective blast and then died when it rushed in. The other wasn't enough to face Kord (backed up by the Couatl) on his own.
A close match was against 4 Duergar Champions and Shuluth. I was on the angel side. I routed one early on with a flaming bolt, and the rest went around the side. Kord stood in the main corridor, using reach to hit a duergar 2 squares away (and, I think, kill or route him). I forgot to cast major resistance on him, and he got stunned, wacked a couple of times (barely!), and failed his morale save while stunned. (That was lucky -- he would have made it off the board!) I think the ballista took out a duergar who came into the main corridor to attack him. When Kord rallied, he killed Shuluth (40 with Aggression + 25 from a previous ballista shot). The Protectar healed him from 15 to 20, so that the last duergar had to make both hits to kill him (which he didn't).
I was really worried about 3-4 Helmed Horror bands. They can base the ballista and attack the Couatl (possibly at the same time). Kord could probably only take out 2 in the first 3 rounds of engagement before the Couatl gets chopped up by melee/opportunity attacks (if I'm lucky). I think I'd have a chance, though not a big one. My strategy of not having to play them worked pretty well, and I recommend it.
In retrospect, I think this was a great warband. I lost, not because of a weakness in the warband, but because other people were better players. Also, I had a ridiculous amount of fun. | |
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johnny.quest
Underboss
1386 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 11:36 PM |
| | Thanks for the report, Scott, and congratulations! | | | |
| DDM Constructed Champion 2006
derry
Warrior
268 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 11:38 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Tried
First, let me say this about slow play.
Some bands take more thought. This is an inherent part of the creature's statistics. Seriously. (For those that have run mulitple Chraal bands, or played with againts drider bands) you know what I mean. I would also now put forward the idea that less activations DOES NOT speed up a chraal band. Quite the contrary. In the old days, you could be certain that you would have enough activations to shield your commander. Now, optimal use of the chraal requires the cycling in and out of protected positions. This has to happen in a certain order, and is dramatically impacted by your opponents moves.
I timed several moves in the finals during rounds 3-5. Michael Derry was averaging 40 seconds per turn, Robert Hatch just over 50.
At one time Robert took 3 minutes to move two figures. However, on the very next Move, Michael also took 3 minutes (just over, in fact).
In Michael's defense, part of this time was taking notes - but - time is time, you use it as you see fit.
. . .
With respect to the final game - only 5 rounds were played, but 200 points were hit at about 59:50, so, its tough to blame slow play in the last match. Indeed, Robert's die was hot, while Michael's was not. And this was really what changed the game.
I totally agree with Dwayne's assessment of the final match between Robert and I. The match was decided decisively slightly before time. The goal is to have engaging, interesting, and decisive games (which can still be very close in points for each side.)
The final match only went 5 rounds, which I expected mainly due to my opponent's warband and play style. Would I have preferred more rounds allowing me the possibility of attacking the commander? Yes, but I knew that would not be an option. I doubted mistakes made against Guy would be repeated against me. I played much slower than usual for me. One reason was to not make mistakes, the other to not give that extra time to my opponent. Were we both poorer for the long time spent? Probably, but I do not really have issue since we got a decisive resolution (over 150 points for the winner when the concession occured.)
When slow play definitions become part of the floor rules for DDM, the match between Robert and I would not be one I expect would have qualified for penalties. With better penalty guidelines in place for Slow Play, slow players will not choose slower warbands. If they do, they will subject to automatic match losses or the threat of such. That threat will provide improve the situation for the entire community. | |
Member of the Low Post Count but High Post Content Society | |
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Shadow_Fox
Underboss
1751 Posts
Litchfield, MN
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Temperance
Sergeant
525 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 12:57 AM |
| | I'm glad to see that the Arcane Ballista band did well; that's very similar to a build I've been considering for taking to qualifiers; now I need to rethink it because the cat's out of the bag... ;) | |
Champion of the common Flying Monkey (Fez optional)
Peter Lee on the WotC board
BAD WOLF
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Tried
Sergeant
501 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 1:32 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by derry
One reason was to not make mistakes, the other to not give that extra time to my opponent..... Were we both poorer for the long time spent? Probably, but I do not really have issue since we got a decisive resolution (over 150 points for the winner when the concession occured.)
Yeah, I was likely off on points, but I thought all 3 horrors were down at that point and there were 4-5 rounds of tile as well.
As you know, I played a band with several chraals as well , and I played much, much faster, than Dagni, with results you are free to share. Commanders are an important thing to chraals, it seems.
And the point about mistakes - and slow play? We'll leave it for another thread. But - I think if a match can have a setup and 80 activations in 60 minutes, you are doing fine - with the option to role init for another 16 prior to time. I'd like to see it go up to 112+, myself, which is the speed I typically play. Lets let this die here for a while, and bring up the thread prior to the quals...
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Let it be. | |
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Dagni
Sergeant
870 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 3:21 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
I am having trouble understanding why the game was so slow. We had two very experienced players. Both were playing on their preselected and prepared map. Both were playing variants on well known warbands. All three of those things point towards a match going faster.
The answer is very simple. You're under the misapprehension that we had both practiced our warbands, our maps, and even this matchup. I don't know about Guy, who - regardless of his practice level - did in fact play at a slow pace. However, I know that in my case I've played 3 games with this band, all last week, 1 or 2 of which were on the Drow Outpost, and I played against Helmed Horrors for perhaps the fourth time in my life, and the first time since War Drums came out, and likewise the first time with a Chraal band, nor had I ever played my band against a flying band on the Drow Outpost, which I think you'll agree changes the map entirely.
To put it simply, I was looking for ways to protect my Human Blackguard on the fly! I had never, ever played or practiced a remotely similar situation.
I've played, I don't know, probably well over 500 games of DDM total. I haven't played all that much recently, but I know the game *extremely* well. I don't need as much practice as I used to, though I'm not likely to improve my skills without more play, but I can maintain. Anyway, the point being that I was able to learn a ton from the game against Guy - where I spent quite a lot of time thinking, but still screwed up the protection of the Blackguard - and played much faster against Derry, allowing that game to reach a full resolution. It only took one practice game, and already the second time was about how you described it, jgsugden.
Also, a typical game will have at least one fairly fast player. Games I'm in don't go as quickly. There are times when I will take too long, as proven by the fact I've gotten a delay of game warning from none other than Guy Fullerton in a tournament last year. However, the point is simply that I'm NOT a fast player, therefore even if I play at a totally reasonable speed, the game won't progress quite as quickly as a typical game played locally. It's no real secret that I tend to consider more options, and look farther ahead, than most opposing players.
- Dagni
Edit: I replied before reading all the comments asking the subject to be dropped. [:)]
As far as that goes, I'm happy to discuss it, I feel it's an important issue to discuss. The SoCal Open does bring up a couple interesting results in regards to slow games, most notably being the 3-0 win (a very slow game, but the main reason the score was what it was was because neither of us wanted to cross midfield). Perhaps it'd be good to have the discussion in another thread, I guess. | |
Proud member of the GRUUMSH fan club! | |
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lynchpt
Sergeant
930 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 10:12 AM |
| First off, congratulations to Dagni for the estimable triumph!
In my testing of HGBs for the NE Open, I didn't get around to testing againts Blackguard/4 Chraals until the day before. I remembered that band being good in Angelfire days (we played 8 acts even then), but I had not realized how well they do on Outpost against Giants until too late for me to change my band. It's well for you that you cottoned on to them earlier!
Since there is not yet any other thread addressing the topic, I'll chime in on speed of play with the Chraals. It's the right time since I just went 4-0 (1st out of 11) at a local tournament running the same band.
In my opinion, 4 or 5 rounds with this warband is quite ordinary and respectable. All 4 of my matches went 4-5 rounds, although one was a concession that might have gone more than 5 had we played. The risk of complete destruction if you make one mistake in commander placement demands a lot of consideration. Against potent flyers like Helmed Horrors, trying to play faster than 4 or 5 rounds would be irresponsible and unfair to yourself.
Also note that the 4 breath weapons add a lot to the thinking time. Since they form most of the offense, the Chraal player has to make sure he gets the most out of them. It can take a noticeable time to process two cone templates, for each of 3 or 4 likely origin points, for any of 3 or 4 reasonable Chraal move end points, And you have to do this for each Chraal until it has used its breath weapon. And fairly enough, the opponents often take some extra time to ensure they are not bunching their pieces unnecessarily.
Even so, I would not say that Blackguard/Chraalx4 is necessarily a point denial band (although it could be played that way). For example, in my 4 matches, I got about 40 tile points in each and engaged the enemy with a view to a kill. I killed /routed the following approximate point totals: 80/80/100/40.
Chraal victories may not be as decisive as those of the HGBs (in all 5 rounds of the NE Open, my HGB band won/was defeated with the winner having over 180 points in each match), but they can be aggressive enough to lead to a fun game. And hey, 3-0 is a rousing blowout in soccer [:)].
Pat Lynch | |
Dreamblade Rules Advisor | |
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DinoBen
Sergeant
412 Posts
Based outta Games of Berkeley, CA
| | 04/10/2006 12:27 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
Perhaps there needs to be some consideration to providing a minimum number of rounds in large tournaments (6?), or recommending up to 75 minutes for each round?
Only if you want to drive away those of us who already have a hard time dealing with Tournaments that already last too long! With 60 minute rounds, a fair sized tournament already takes at least 6 hours with set up and a nominal lunch-break. And then beware if you make it into the final 4! It turned out to be a blessing in disguise when I was edged out of the top 4 at the 1st California Open, otherwise my better half would've chopped me in half! [xx(]
The idea of single elimination is something to talk about, but I can't imagine the DCI system moving in that direction. As others who have commented on this, WotC has made effective steps to increasing the number of rounds played in a tournament setting by removing tiles with maps and dropping the warband figure limit to 8. As with all things, we can only hope to learn from our experiences to do better the next time, or in this case play faster! [)] Congratulations to all the participants, wish I coulda been there! | |
Champion of all things Athasian
"Don't sing it - Bring it!" | |
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MarioCleanstuff
Warrior
325 Posts
San Diego, CA
| | 04/10/2006 12:30 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by elder_basilisk
Round 2: vs. a new player
His band: Coatl, Marut, CoDA, royal guard, warforged scout, gold dwarf fighter, etc.
I looked at his band and realized two things. First, fighting the marut was a bad idea. And second, there was no reason that I should ever face it since it couldn't catch incorporeal sacred watchers or a flying sword archon. We played on Broken demongate and I got the good side again. I wasn't able to route his warforged scout until round 2, but I did equal his first turn assault points. Perhaps impatient, he moved his CoDA ahead of the rest of hit band and I pounced. Using a couple sacred watchers to block the Marut, I hit the CoDA with the sword archon and the other watchers killing it. In the next round, the Marut got a couple hits on the sword archon and I attacked once then retreated. By this time, the sacred watchers had killed most of his fodder. He followed with the marut and coatl but was unable to catch the sacred watchers or the sword archon and being behind on points, couldn't just camp on a victory area. In the last round, he left an opening where I could swoop in on the coatl and again block the marut from getting to the sword archon so I did. I don't remember if I killed the coatl before time ended or not.
'Twas I. My first tournament (and in all actuality, real games) ever. I did a lot better than I expected with one win in the second tournament. Got 8th place for it. Had a Warduke in my booster. 3 for 3 as far as epics in War Drums boosters goes.
Incorporeal can get mighty annoying... Would have leveled at least two Watchers with the Marut, but never passed incorporeal during any attacking rolls. Managed to make about half of them lose their Fly with Legion's Undeniable Gravity.
I did manage to get the Sword Archon below half its starting HP, but Fearless didn't help me any.
Anyway, on moving the CODA up, I figured that I could try for a few Deific Vengeances on the Sacred Watchers, and maybe even a Dismissal on the Sword Archon. But we all know how that ended.
I believe, however, that my Couatl was still (barely) alive at the end of the match. | |
Completed trades: Brenigin, desiderata, HockeyFan, MikeyChraal, Raland, GuJiaXian | |
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Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 9:02 PM |
| | I've changed the topic header. I didn't really intend for this thread to end up the de facto tourney results and discussion thread (thus the original name), so I apologize if I inadvertently stole any thunder. I'm still hoping for several more in-depth reports! | |
Jeff "Wayne Laredo" Wilder | Email | Have/Want List | Trade Policies | Are You an Ethical Trader?
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johnny.quest
Underboss
1386 Posts
| | 04/10/2006 9:09 PM |
| | I'm glad you started the thread, and I agree that more reports would be great. | | | |
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Dagni
Sergeant
870 Posts
| | 04/11/2006 12:43 AM |
| I won!
Since I won a qualifier in NorCal in May 2004, I haven't won a tournament bigger than a local prerelease since. Well, unless you count the 10 person Sealed tourney at GenCon SoCal in Dec 2004 where I won a Beholder repaint.
Here's my complete history in big tournaments:
Made top 4, and won a 2004 qualifier over Derry.
Failed to make top 8 in the Championships (10th). Was very disappointed, because I felt like I cost myself a top 8 berth through key play mistakes in my losses.
Won a 10 person Limited tourney to get a Beholder trophy. Don't think it really counts as a big tourney, in spite of the prize - there just weren't many people playing in that tournament. Undefeated in swiss.
About 30 people the next day, it definitely had a big tournament ambiance to it. Got 5th or 6th, going 3-1. The tournament didn't run the usual number of rounds, which bugged me, because I think I would've had a great chance to make top 4 otherwise.
Get second place in the SoCal 2005 Constructed Qualifer, losing to Kevizoid in the final game.
Make top 8 at the Constructed Championships, lose in semis to winner Jason. First after swiss with crazy good tiebreaks.
In the first CA Open, I go 4-1 but don't make the cut on tiebreaks.
Made top 4 in the Limited Qualifer, then, IIRC, lost to Tried in the first game of the top 4 draft. Last undefeated in swiss.
Make top 8 in the Limited Championship (first in Swiss, undefeated). Lose first game in top 8 to eventual winner Paul Grasshoff.
The big Winter Fantasy War Drums prerelease, go undefeated in swiss, lose in the finals.
Last Saturday, Make top four, last undefeated in swiss . . . and I actually won!! The fourth big tourney in a row where I was the last undefeated in swiss. It was nice to then do well in the single elimination portion for once.
- Dagni | |
Proud member of the GRUUMSH fan club! | |
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Tried
Sergeant
501 Posts
| | 04/11/2006 1:14 AM |
| And they say you can't roll well when you need to!
[:)] | |
Let it be. | |
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doranur
Warrior
180 Posts
| | 04/11/2006 1:28 AM |
| heres my report, and a few things i noted.
going into the tournament, the norcal crew was consumed by the idea of fighting against 4 chraal bands for about the final week before the tourney. derry entered full tutor mode, and we prepared for the tourney fairly well with one exception; we did almost no practicing with our bands (the exception being louis sacha and matt bachman, and probably derry).
anyways, i was going to run shuluth, dc x3, chraal, warrior skeleton x2, but was convinced two days before to change to a dual hill giant band. i went with the drow sgt, hgb x2, wardrummer, ochre wombat x3 version, my map being dragonshrine. while this version suffers considerably in the mirror match, it seems to me to be slightly stronger against chraals and a couple other commonly seen matchups. still i'd only run this band a couple of games, and all that on vassal (i opened my hgb's in the parking lot before the tourney).
arriving at the tourney i was somewhat shocked to see 8 1/2 hgb bands, and only 2 chraal bands (admitedly run by dagni and tried). still i felt confident that i could beat most players in a mirror match, and that i had a good idea of how to deal with almost any band there.
my first match was against a guy named dan(?) i believe. he was running an 8 activation tiefling capt version of 2hgb, with a cursed spirit as his significant fodder. we ended up playing on his map (teleport temple) although i'm not sure which of us chose it as i would rather play on it in the mirror match. i lost side init and set up in side b, my first moves being fairly conservative. both my hgb's set up on the teleporters towards the top of the map, and i moved two orc warriors to block acess to the rear of my band from the solo teleporter on the bottom. "dan" moved in a hgb to the solo teleporter at the bottom, and round 2 commenced.
my 2 orc warriors got hits on his hgb, and then when he moved away he took a crit on an aoo, putting his hgb out of command, with 40 damage, right in front of my start area. i charged another orc warrior, hit again, and then moraled the hgb with one of my own. the wardrummer was playing intimidating beat, and with a mere +4 his hgb routed. i then killed his tiefling with my other hgb to prevent the rally, and was able to morale his 2nd hgb in short order. i got a lot of good luck in this game, but feel that even without the inordinate number of orc warrior hits i was in a good position, since his band was split and out of command, and it would have been very difficult for him to get back in command. as it was with the way i was rolling "dan" had no chance, and i believe he did fairly well in the 2nd tourney.
i think my second game was against a guy named eric, running a tiefling blademaster, hgb, chimera, orc wardrummer, and some trogs and stuff, this was played on dragonshrine. eric was a inexperienced player although he played fairly well. i basically beat the hell out of his chimera keeping my drow sgt out of line for the acid attack (i had an orc warrior on the acid resist as well) and then walked up and moraled his hgb, which failed and it went running off the board. this was his first tournament, and first games against folks he didn't know, and his sucess here was amazing (i think he went .500 at a major tourney with a warband with difficulties).
after the 2nd game was a brief break, went next door and had lunch with derry, ninjaray, tried and his son darrien, and fenris. if you happen to go to dear mr. fantazy i reccomend the random little resteraunt next door, very good and affordable. i thoroughly psyched myself out during lunch, because i knew my next match would be 1) critical to making the top 4, and 2) hard. my possible opponents included sven, dagni, derry, a guy whose name i never caught but ended up 4th(!) with an arcane ballista band, kevin melnick running AoMoradin/Marut, paul(i think) running 4x helmed horror, guy with his 3x helmed horror | |
-Doranur
join the revolution! down with round/turn fascism! viva la resistance! | |
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DrX
Sergeant
408 Posts
| | 04/11/2006 3:32 AM |
| Well, I might as well write up a little report on how not to play Hill Giants. I'm the above-mentioned Dan that doranur beat down in his first match.
I had made a conscious decision to play my giants aggressively. After testing a bit with Smyrin and Tried, I felt like the giants were doing well when they were in your face, especially on the Teleport Temple map, where it seems like if there's a teleporter open you can always get in and hit something. Moving the giants in quickly also more often than not served to throw off an opponent's strategy. Plus, I was feeling really awful that morning, so the less thinking the better. Just go smash.
In the match with doranur, I was pretty worried about that Wardrummer. If my giants don't make moral saves, they're done for. Similarly, if his giants make moral saves, I'm done for. So, in the first round he chose intimidating drumbeat, and then left a teleporter open, guarded only by two OWs, with his Wardrummer a double move away from basing it. I figured three orcs would get a shot at me (each would have <50% chance to hit), and he would send a giant in. This would free a teleporter so that I could bring my other giant and Tiefling in from the rear to engage his other giant, or to get at the Drummer if possible. Only if *everything* hit would there be a morale check on the forward giant that round, and I would hope to win initiative next round to get at the Wardrummer. So, I took the chance, and *everything* hit, with a crit or two in there to seal the deal. Losing init also left my Tiefling exposed, who got crunched. Bleh. Dumb move.
My second match was against an anti-Chrall band. It was 2xDeath Knights, Cleric of Nerull, and some skeletons. He won his map, which was Tomb of Queen Peregrine. It turns out that this is a nice Hill Giant map. Lots of space to run around, and easy lines of sight to keep things under command. Had a nail-biter when my Tiefling got caught in an Abyssal blast, but she made her save and only took 5 damage with resist fire. After that, the giants just chewed everything up, starting with the Cleric. Melee Reach helped a lot for minimizing my damage taken in the first round of engagement, as the Death Knights weren't going to miss otherwise. This was just a really bad matchup for my opponent, and it was over fast enough that we got time for a few good trades in. I didn't feel great about this one, but a win's a win.
Third round was against the AoKord, 2xHalf Ogre Barbs, Brass Sam band. He got the fire resistant side on the Dragon Shrine map. I don't remember all the details, but we started hitting each other in a dog-pile in the middle during the second round. With equal commander ratings, I gambled on winning initiative and brought everything in. The way things were positioned, if I won I'd activate the giants first to - with almost absolute certainty - get rid of Kord and one HOB. Instead, I lost initiative, got whirlwinded twice, and one giant failed morale and ran off the board. The other giant eventually took down Kord, but I was a little surprised by the damage output from the Brass Samurai who eventually cleaned up.
1-2. That finished me off, ultimately leaving me in 24th place. I dropped to the second tournament where I played Gith Monks, donating my Giant band to Tried, who didn't do much better with it. In all, the giant band is pretty fun to play, but I don't know that the aggressive approach with it is the winning one, unless you're sure your dice are going to consistently roll high.
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HW List: http://www.maxminis.com/hwlist.asp?user=DrX
References: http://www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12409
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