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Subject: We need a Dreamblade "toolkit"

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Faragdar the Wise
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10/27/2006 12:06 PM  
Edit: updated toolkit is now a sticky: http://www.maxminis.com/Forums/tabid/104/forumid/72/postid/680192/view/topic/Default.aspx

I thought I'd start a discussion thread where folks can make a pitch for particular Dreamblade figures.  Which figures from each aspect are practically indispensible.  Which ones are very useful with the right synergy, etc.  As with DDM, we can compile all that data into 4 toolkits, one for each aspect.

Some obvious ones, some of which I can maybe write a blurb about (from my perspective) this weekend are: Scarab Warcharm, Hawk-eyed Instigator, Pearlthorn Castle, Lunar Handmaiden, Inspired Samurai, Fleshless Reaper, Horrid Poltergeist, Voodoo Manipulator, Dreadmorph Ogre, Cannibal Pariah, Knight of Autumn Gate, Carrion Spiker, Bloodheart Temple, Bloodthirsty Redcap, Axemorph Demon, Spellbound Scissors, Dearkheart Cottage and Pick-pick.

I hope others will feel free to chime in, especially regarding all the new stuff, based on your experience with the game (or better yet, after having actually tried everything out).

Edit: Is there any confusion with the symbols/abbreviations I've used?  In the figure title, C/U/R is rarity and BS or BW refers to which set the piece is in.  @ indicates blade ability (@@ double blade, @@@ multiblade).  (Y) is a scoring cell ability.  (*) is an ability that triggers upon coming into play.  (#) is a spawn phase ability.

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10/28/2006 1:03 AM  
I'm missing the Thunder Sultan, Alluring Succubus, Runetagged Brawler on your list. And the Knight of Strife and Joy for the advanced part of the list.

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10/28/2006 7:06 AM  
I disagree with the knight of the autumn gate.
Also you are missing HBT and DHC.

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Faragdar the Wise
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10/28/2006 8:33 AM  

Valor toolkit:

Core Toolkit

Clawclan Scout (U, BW): 3V 2/4/5, @ skirmish – outclasses the Runetagged Brawler as fodder of choice. Skirmish is far better than an extra point of defense, and it’s Bloodcut, which allows you to take advantage of some lineage-based abilities (Steelborn Lion, Kitsune).  It's hard to overstate the power of skirmish, which can help you win early turns by maneuvering pieces into high-value scoring cells and late turns by moving your power pieces around for multiple strikes.

 

Pearlthorn Castle (U, BS): 3VV – being a location, it spawns wherever you have troops, and with a zero cost spawn ability, it can move one of your pieces the instant it spawns. Did you overextend to win an early turn? Spawn the castle and immediately pull your guy back into friendly territory. Ideal spots for the castle are the center cell and the cell in the center column between the key cell and your spawn row, where it can help move your pieces into action faster and allow you to dominate the vital center of the dreamscape.

 

Inspired Samurai (C, BS): 4V 1/5/8, bodyguard – about as survivable as it gets for this spawn cost, the samurai is key for making your other, high-value troops more survivable. His low power can be a tough sell, but he’s almost indispensable in a passion/valor band, where you’ll have other high power creatures who seriously need his protection.  And if your metagame likes the new Ooktolok, you'll be glad to have this guy around to shut down that crazy stray warpstrike 7.

 

Scarab Warcharm (R, BS): 4V 2/6/7, @ skirmish, @@@ advance – widely viewed as the best piece in the game, the warcharm is cheap to spawn and fills an important slot in the spawn curve. With skirmish and advance, it gives ultimate flexibility for maneuvering your own pieces. Though its power isn’t high, its survivability is excellent for its cost. Team it up with some power and quickly maneuver your troops into position. The downside is that the dollar cost of this figure on the secondary market precludes most players from having one (or 3).

Twilight Scout (C, BS): 5V 3/5/7, @ advance – while not as impressive as the cheaper Clawclan Scout, it does have pretty good stats for its cost, and the advance ability can sometimes be more important, especially in the early game, where you're trying to help your power pieces catch up, or your pieces with "defender" to get into a cell where they can strike. With power 3, you have a pretty decent chance for a blade when it strikes, too. The Bloodcut lineage is also worth noting.


Knight of Strife and Joy (U, BS): 5V 4/6/7, @ skirmish 2, defender – the ability to skirmish two pieces with one blade is enormously powerful, especially in a relatively cheap piece that has power 4. The defender ability makes him a tough sell, but with other movement abilities to get him into place (Pearlthorn Castle, Lunar Handmaiden, Scarab Warcharm, etc.) he can be very much worth including in a band.

 

Lunar Handmaiden (U, BS): 6VV 3/7/9, (1,Y) advance – the advance ability during spawn phase is usually well worth the spawn cost, especially with so many good pieces, now, that have spawn phase abilities that require them to be in a scoring cell.  On her own, or combined with a Pearlthorn Castle, she can give you tremendous capability to shape the battlefield at the beginning of a turn. Most opponents will go to significant lengths to neutralize this threat, and with good stats for her cost, she’s not so easy to neutralize.

Kitsune (U, BW): 7V 4/7/9, (0) pull bloodcut – Kitsune takes over the 7-spawn slot from the Hawk-eyed Instigator primarily because of the Brighthammer Avenger.  The piece is about as efficient stat-wise, and it allows you another way to throw those avengers around during the spawn phase.  Suddenly both end up in the core toolkit.

Brighthammer Avenger (R, BS): 8V 0/8/10, charge 6 – This guy was already worth considering, but because of the Kitsune, it now belongs in core.  He's probably best used in multiples, since a single power 6 attack isn’t enough to take out much except fodder pieces, and, since its attack comes when it moves, you generally can’t power blade abilities with his attack or pile on damage from other sources.  Also, you'll want some pieces with skirmish to keep him moving during your action phases, but that's really not a problem with the efficiency of the Clawclan Scout, among others.

Pearlthorn Gargoyle (R, BW): 10V 5/9/11, (Y) flux ward – while the straight-up stats aren’t that great (compare to Inscribed Axebeast at the same spawn cost), this guy becomes a beast once you move him into a scoring cell. The potential for having him be a 14/16 brute to squat in your 5-cell makes him almost an indispensable piece at the high end of the spawn curve.

 


Extended Toolkit

 

Arch of Triumph (U, BW): 4VV – pretty impressive ability – create a spawn location anywhere on the battlefield you like. The drawback that it shuts down with local enemies means you need to be able to control your opponents’ positioning (ideally during spawn phase), which means the arch probably works best with a Voodoo Manipulator and/or Thunder Sultan.Tough to say, yet, how well it’ll play.

 

Steelborn Lion (U, BS): 4VV 3/4/5 – While its stats aren’t that impressive, they aren’t horrible, either. It’s the ability to reinforce your Clawclan and Twilight Scouts that makes him worth playing. If you start by spawning two scouts (or a scout and a warcharm) and then reinforce with this guy once they get into a fight, you’ll be rolling enough dice to not only thwack enemy fodder but also likely get some blades to move around the rest of your troops and take control of the dreamscape.

 

Virtuous Maiden (R, BW): 4VV 2/5/6, (1) enrage – you won’t include this piece for her stats, but for her spawn phase ability.One weakness of valor is the relatively low power of its pieces.The maiden fills that gap, which can be especially important not just for damage, but for powering blade abilities.Because she needs to stick around to boost your pieces’ power, considering teaming her with a bodyguard (who, incidentally, has his most glaring weakness improved by her presence).Also, don’t forget that you’re often going to need to save a spawn point to power her ability, so take that into account when considering your spawn curve.

Knight of Tomorrow (C, BS): 5V 2/7/8, @ skirmish – very survivable for his cost, he gives you an economical way to include skirmish in your warband, but I’d say he’s now overshadowed by the Clawclan Scout, and of course the Scarab Warcharm.Still, he’s a viable alternative to the Twilight Scout in the 5-spawn slot.

 

Hawk-eyed Instigator (U, BS): 7VV 4/8/8, @@@ advance – more survivable than the warcharm, this guy also has enough power to take an accounting of himself and often power his own blade ability. Multi-blade advance is a very powerful ability for maneuvering your troops into position.

Whirlwind Dervish (R, BS): 8VV 4/8/9, (2) teleport self – if you have 10 spawn points, this figure can spawn and then move anywhere on the board during the spawn phase. That may amount to nothing more than a reinforce ability, but it can also be used for a surprise strike in an enemy-occupied cell or to disrupt your opponent’s move paths or score by moving into an otherwise unreachable empty cell. That flexibility, and the fact that the ability can be used every turn, makes it worth the cost.Just keep in mind that you probably want it to fill the 10-spawn spot in the spawn curve, because you’re almost always going to want to use the spawn ability on the same turn you spawn it, if you want to get the most out of this piece.(This might be a core piece, but I think it competes against the Pearlthorn Gargoyle.)


Loyal Scragglemaw (U, BS): 9V 4/11/12 – nothing special, but pretty decent stats for its cost if you need to fill its spot on the spawn curve.

 

Inscribed Axebeast (U, BS): 10V 6/11/13, vengeance 3 – nothing special, just excellent stats for its cost. The drawback means you can’t spawn him right away, and unlucky rolls might mean never spawning him. He also becomes a hard sell when the Pearlthorn Gargoyle occupies the same spot on the spawn curve.

 

Angel of Sunrise (R, BW): 11VVV 5/11/12, (*) haste gambit 2 – I’m not ready to call this piece core without trying it out.The cost is quite high for the stats she brings to the table, so the haste gambit has to have big payoff for her to be worth playing.Reshaping the battlefield, as she can do, can be huge in the late game, but the risk because of the granted victory point is also very high.

 

Noble Dragon (R, BS): 12V 6/11/12, @ payback – while his raw stats aren’t as good as valor’s biggest brute, the Inscribed Axebeast, the payback ability makes this guy tremendously powerful against your opponent’s high-value pieces, which probably makes the extra spawn cost worth it.The high spawn cost, though, means you probably should spawn him as soon as you can rather than waiting for the opportune time.That disadvantage makes me hesitant to call him a core piece.

 


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froffenhoffer
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10/28/2006 11:45 AM  
Valor missing noble dragon for finisher?(I thought)
Also does the new angel with Haste Gambit make it in aswell?

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Faragdar the Wise
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10/28/2006 1:35 PM  
Good point. I need to add the Noble Dragon. The Angel of Sunrise I still have to think about before writing a sensible blurb.

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10/29/2006 3:31 AM  
Top 14 from base set; Playing against any of these I always feel as if I have a problem. Against a (base set) warband with none of them, I expect a easy win. Or as easy as it gets in dreamblade, where the dice rule the board.
Scarab Warcharm
Lunar handmaiden
Pearlthorn Castle
Knight of Strife & Joy
Brighthammer Avenger
Whirlwind Dervish, note; this was probably only extended before Baxar's but the claw clan scout makes it a lot more efficient to play this on the 2nd spawn.
Hawkeyed Instigator
Inspired Samurai
Dark Heart Cottage
Voodoo manipulator
Fleshless Reaper
Thunder Sultan
Dreadmorph Ogre
Eater of Hope

extended;
Skull hill
All the warpstrikers
all three of the spawn-2 creatures {Barbstrider, Spellbound scissors, Cannibal Pariah}
Heartsblood Temple
Bloodthirsty Redcap
Jack-in-a-Box
Blood Wolf
Faceless Stalker
pick-pick, zombie enforcer & knight of pain & sorrow. (as spawncurve filler)

Baxar's; This is mainly guesstimates. I havn't played a single constructed game with these yet.
Baxar
Chaos puppeteer
Buzzclaw
Claw clan scout
Rageing vanguard
Hammerhead
Heart Thief
Unsated ragedrake
Silhouete
Glaive scorpion
Virtuous Maiden
There are about a dozen more that I'm less certain of.

Faragdar the Wise
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10/29/2006 4:08 AM  
Xaos, what about the Clawclan Scout makes the Whirlwind Dervish more efficient?

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10/30/2006 2:10 AM  
To play Whirlwind early, you really want 2 valor units already in play (to keep the cost of spawn+teleport below 12)
So if you plan on teleporting with this turn-2 or turn-3, You need to spawn 2 Runtaged Brawlers turn-1. And the Brawler is a noticable inefficient unit. I.e. It's played, because it fits a good spot on the spawn curve, not because it's worth it's 3 spawn points. The Clawclan scout conversly is an actively good unit for spawn-3. i.e. You hardly saw a teleport in game openings with the base set. Because it would leave the warband with a couple of in-efficient runtagged brawlers in play. But it's a much more viable tactic with a couple of Clawclan scouts.

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Dallas

10/30/2006 4:46 AM  
Virtuous Maiden is proving to be a pretty important piece at least in the games I have been seeing on Vassal.  And mono-Valor Bloodcut bands featuring Kitsune are pretty popular and effective right now too - her ability and stats make her a bargain.

They may be best off in Extended though - for now.

Faragdar the Wise
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10/31/2006 6:30 AM  
I hadn't looked at their stats, but I went ahead and added them after looking over the pieces. I think the Virtuous Maiden looks very impressive. I'd say she looks like a core tool. I notice, though, that my core list for Valor is heavy at 4-spawn and light in other ranges. Has anyone been watching the Arch of Triumph in Vassal--is it working out? Should the Steelborn Lion really be bumped to extended, even with the new Clawclan Scout?

What about the Zungar Blademaster?  It's the only valor choice at 2-spawn, and 2/5/5 is impressive for cheap fodder, but is defender way too big a drawback for fodder?  Also, the Temple Lion seems pretty impressive.  Is it worth its cost?

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Dallas

10/31/2006 7:09 AM  
I could see putting the Arch in Extended because it is probably going to be high variance.

Zungar Blademaster I haven't seen much of.  For me, fodder is meant to tie/win early turns and if you have Blademasters, even just one, reduces your ability to do that.  Maybe I'm not seeing it potential - time will tell.

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10/31/2006 7:40 AM  
I wouldn't play the Zungar Blademaster (ever) in constructed. Defender is a bad liability. While I have seen some interesting tactics spawning a "defender" on turn-1. Those rely on the defender being stronger than every unit (combined) that your opponent has in play that early in the game.

Yes, I'd make the Steelborn Lion extended. As a general rule. I'd make everything that relies on it's Liniage to be effective "Extended". Note theres a difference between the clawclan scout, which would still be a strong piece even if it wasn't liniage bloodcut. And the steelborn Lion which is certainly not usefull without multiple other bloodcut creatures in the warband.

Temple Lion should probably be extended. It works best, only with the madness creatures which have very high life. It's almost useless to passion & fear/valor don't get enough benefit from it. If the ruling about how it combines with bodyguard had been different, then it would be part of the core toolkit. But not as that ruling is.

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10/31/2006 7:44 AM  

Are we allowed to chime in for passion?  It looks like a lot of valor so far.

The Infernal Gothic belongs in the top five passion pieces.  I include 3 in a double HBT band.  They roll 5 dice, are moderately survivable, and have multiblade lure.  They play well with reapers and with the unsated Ragedrake.  I believe that they belong FIRMLY in the core toolkit.


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Faragdar the Wise
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10/31/2006 9:45 AM  
Yes, chime in with any thoughts. I just haven't gotten past valor, yet.

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11/01/2006 11:18 AM  

Edit: I took some suggestions to heart.  Probably still some cutting to do.

Passion:

 

Core toolkit:

 

Hammerhead (R, BW): 3P 3/1/2, (Y,0) double stakes – this guy makes core despite being laughably fragile (he’s even easier to spank than the pathetic Boneclan Hunter) simply because double stakes is such a powerful, game-changing ability.  Passion bands generally have a hard time getting and keeping an early lead because the fragility of their pieces encourages cautious play until massive force can be brought to bear.This guy can help you catch up by capitalizing on one or more turns where you have the advantage.Be sure of your timing, though, because use of the double stakes ability at the wrong time will give away the game.Since keeping him around until you’re ready to use double stakes can be a challenge, consider teaming him with spawn phase movement abilities, like the Pearlthorn Castle and Lunar Handmaiden, so that you don’t have to risk prepositioning him in a scoring cell only to find that the timing isn’t right for double stakes.

 
Heartsblood Temple (R, BS): 3PP – with passion, the reality is that you have to pay a lot of spawn to get an effective force on the table.That’s where the temple comes in, as the most efficient way to generate extra spawn points.I find that the best place for the temple is your opponent’s 4-cell.If he wants to win, your opponent will have to occupy the significant scoring cells and thus activate the temple’s ability, giving you the bonus spawn you need.Another reasonable place is the center cell, and some players advocate having a temple in each location to get up to +4 spawn each turn (I’m not quite convinced that’s the best strategy).If you play the temple, build your band to take advantage of the skewed spawn curve.

 

Buzzclaw (U, BW): 5P 4/3/4, (*) spur – in play, he looks just like the Bloodthirsty Redcap, but the spur ability and lack of bloodthirsty make him a good fit in the 5-spawn slot for passion.If you hold off a little before bringing this guy into play, chances are you’ll be able to drop at least a 6-power attack as soon as he spawns.His ability could be vital to allow you survive a turn where you’ve lost initiative after your opponent closed with one or more of your fragile passion pieces.The threat of this piece also helps to allow you to control the timing of engagements, which passion needs in order to stay in the game.

 

Infernal Gothic (C, BW): 7P 5/5/7, @@@ Lure – more expensive than the Alluring Succubus, he’s also much, much better.Passion needs to fight to win, and to do that, you need to either move to the enemy or move the enemy to you to strike.The Gothic does the latter for you with fairly good stats and multiblade lure.Teamed with fear creatures, you’ll have total flexibility when pushing your opponent’s pieces around.This guy makes an amazing friend (or foe) for a Fleshless Reaper.

 

Unsated Ragedrake (R, BW): 13PP 10/8/11, @ crit 3, @ trample – all I can say is, Holy Moly!Sure, he suffers from the common passion problem of low defense/life for his cost, but power 10 with crit 3 and trample is fearsome in the extreme.Just don’t let a Noble Dragon get a strike in against this guy.

 

Extended toolkit:

 

Bloodthirsty Redcap (U, BS): 3P 4/3/4, bloodthirsty – Bloodthirsty is quite a drawback, but power 4 goes a long way to make up for it.Now that we have the Hammerhead and his game-changing double stakes ability, the redcap drops to extended because of bloodthirsty, which seriously hurts in a metagame with any significant Spellbound Scissors presence.Were there an extremely efficient piece with ferocity the redcap might jump back to core, despite the risk of being neutered by scissors.

 

Rainforest Shaman (C, BS): 4P 2/3/5, (Y) energize 1 - okay, so his stats look more appropriate for a 2P piece.  Still he can give you bonus spawn starting turn 3, which helps to mitigate the pain of a bad spawn roll in this critical point in the game.  He might be the difference allowing you to spawn a Heartsblood Temple early without sacrificing too much in the muscle department.  And your opponent will probably make a special effort to eliminate (or otherwise neutralize) him, which you can play to your advantage.  If you do manage to keep him around to earn 2 or more spawn points, then he's most certainly paid his keep.

 

Shard Troll (R, BS): 4PPP 2/3/4, (X) assault X – for what he does, he’s painfully fragile (you can’t afford to leave him engaged with an enemy if you’ve gone first in a turn), but once you pay the aspect cost, he’s also cheap.As with the Buzzclaw, the ability to do massive damage in the spawn phase can be a life saver for passion.It sure can hurt, though, if you move him into position for an assault strike and then you miss a spawn phase.Also, his ability should be used sparingly, because it may leave you at a disadvantage in numbers in the dreamscape.  So, why this guy and not the Flame Harrower, who can fire an assault 5 with fewer spawn?  Simply because assault 5 is generally not going to be enough for a significant effect.  The Shard Troll lets you dump as many spawn as you think you need for a decisive assault--overkill is less wasteful than an assault attack that fizzles because of poor rolls.

 

Boneblade Serpent (C, BS): 5P 3/3/5, @ ferocity – for the cost, this guy’s stats aren’t very good, and he has an uncharacteristically lower power for a passion creature.He’s worth considering, though, until there’s a more efficient creature with ferocity.A Bloodthirsty Redcap benefits significantly by being paired with this guy, especially versus madness.Just watch out for the copious death blows if you went first in the turn.

 

Heart Thief (R, BW): 7P 4/4/6, (Y) energy feed – there are several pieces and a few passion strategies that are severely hamstrung if you miss a spawn phase during the wrong turn.The Heart Thief can fix that problem, possibly turning a “no spawn” turn into a game winner for you.Since she’s otherwise a less powerful Bladehound, though, I’m guessing she'll be too high-variance to be considered core.

 

Bloodhawk Barag (R, BW): 8P 6/5/7, @ crit 2, (Y,0) energy gambit – while the energy gambit might not often be worth using, the rest of his abilities are identical to the more expensive Savage Ogre, and so I think his spawn cost is where it needs to be to be worth playing.The gambit can always be used in a round where it’s vital that you get one of the more expensive brutes into play.

 

Slaughter Boots (U, BS): 8P 6/4/6, @@ demolish – as the only piece in the game capable of removing locations from the dreamscape, it’s worth considering.It’s definitely not a core tool, though, because you won’t always face opponents with locations worth destroying, in which case its nothing more than a less efficient Bladehound.Also, since the Heartsblood Temple will often be used in passion bands, the Pearlthorn Castle will see use in a lot of passion/valor bands, and the demolish ability is not optional and not restricted to enemy locations, you have to watch out when including this and a location of your own in your warband.

 

Warlust Satyr (C, BW): 8P 6/5/6, @@@ battle energize 1 – not the greatest of stats, but about par for passion, and being able to turn blades into spawn points seems like a very useful ability.It’s one I would consider, particularly in a bloodcut band.

 

Forgeblind Punisher (U, BS): 9P 8/4/6 – talk about a glass cannon, this guy is about as squishy as it gets for such an expensive piece, but boy does he pack a punch.The punisher is worth considering for his ability to power the blade abilities of your other creatures.He has to be protected, though, so seriously consider a bodyguard for him.Also, play him with pieces that have the skirmish ability.That way, after he lays down the punishment, you can skirmish him away so that he doesn’t become the target for death blows, and you can potentially use his power to blast another set of enemies.

 

Tlamixec Battlelord (R, BS): 9P 5/6/9, enrage bloodcut 1 – in an all bloodcut band, I can’t imagine not playing this guy.He’s fairly survivable for his cost, for passion, and quite a few bloodcut pieces can really benefit from the enrage ability.

 

Axemorph Demon (R, BS): 12PP 6/8/11, @@ crit 10 – yes, he’s expensive, and yes he’s vulnerable (for a 12-spawn piece), but crit 10 is a beastly ability, even if it is a double blade ability.You’ll want him to attack with at least one friend for a good chance to power that crit.(Attacking alone, he only has about 1-in-4 chance to crit.)


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11/02/2006 1:49 AM  
IMO distinctly overdone on the passion creatures from the base set.
Axemorph Demon should be extended.
Hammerhead should be core. for spawn-3 it's an OK turn-1 passion resource, even if you never get an oppertunity to use it's ability. And hence the Bloodthirsty redcap gets dropped to extended.
Your probably correct that Heart Thief is extended.
The Bloodhawk (indeed all "gambit" creatures) should be extended. The Cyclopean Sprite & Crypt worm come closest to being core. Because they are almost OK even if you don't use the gambit.
I think Ogrol warlord is easier to negate than you have guessed. If it's with an allied creature. You can either destroy it if you roll enough damage, or dump all the damage on the other creature, so that you don't disrupt the Ogrol. It's legal to put 7 damage on a hammerhead, if thats what you roll. If your opponent keeps it on it's own to avoid that tactic. It's effectivly fighting with "loner". Only really good use is to walk into a fleshless reaper to get a mutual disrupt. And the odds of that are only about 45%. Which includes the odds that the Ogrol does not get disrupted & can make a normal attack. Considering it's spawncost is 3 higher than the reaper, thats not good odds. I'd much rather use an Eater-of-hope or Dreadmorph Ogre. This ability would be great on an Iron Thug, but on the Ogrol it's not worth the extra spawn points.

Blood Wolf, might now be extended. The Gent makes a reliable "detonator" for it.
Rainforest shaman; might be extended. It's use is strictly on the turn-1 spawn. Which gets it to a scoreing cell at the start of turn-3. Theres a gamble that you don't get a spawn phase that turn. But if you do, it's a noticable acceleration on spawning a heartsblood temple.

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11/03/2006 4:46 PM  
I'm not ready to call Hammerhead core. He's even more fragile than the nearly worthless Boneclan Hunter, so I don't think he's a good buy unless you can make double stakes work.

I hadn't thought about the Gent and Blood Wolf. That's an interesting idea. Gotta think about how workable it is, because for most enemies, you need another source of damage in the spawn phase to capitalize. And I might add the Rainforest Shaman. My experience with it hasn't been positive. It's essentially a 2P creature based on its raw stats, and I haven't had much luck with it. How does it accelerate spawning a temple?

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11/03/2006 11:10 PM  
I think what XAos means is;

The Shaman is up to a scoring cell in turn 2. At the begining of turn 3 he gets you a bonus point (and maybe is in the 2 cell for HBT placement) that staves off a crappy turn 3 spawn. The HBT is not immediately beneficial like SkullHill or Pearlthorne. A low spawn turn 3 will gut you if all you can get out is the HBT and a Redcap or Boneclan. You are left with choosing between not dropping your Wedding Cake for a spawn advantage latter or not putting offense on the field to setup for placement in turn 4.

A bad turn 3 spawn is REALLY bad on mono Passion bands. I seem to ALWAYS loose a match if I get nailed with a 7 or less spawn on turn 3, the above choice is a no win situation. The Shaman alleviates it a little. As well the Shaman is an oddly inviting target, that extra point is something many opponents will attempt to remove quickly. If the Shaman has placed the temple and gotten himself killed in the same turn he has netted me an effective +4 spawn on the next turn and that is signifigant.

At the very least the Shaman has accelerated the time it takes for the HBT to payoff its spawn investment. He can produce a positive spawn benefit in turn 4 as opposed to turn 5. This allows for a more effective top heavy Spawn Curve.


Unfortunately XAos would have said this with half the word count and twice the clarity.

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11/04/2006 5:32 AM  
Posted By Prince o the Raven Banner on 11/03/2006 11:10 PM
I think what XAos means is;



Unfortunately XAos would have said this with half the word count and twice the clarity.

Your too modest, I'm a mathematician, not a linguist. I tend to be precise, but not always concise or understandable.
Posted By Faragdar the Wise on 11/03/2006 4:46 PM
I'm not ready to call Hammerhead core. He's even more fragile than the nearly worthless Boneclan Hunter,
The Hammerhead isn't noticably more vulnerable than the Hunter. They can't be any more dead when they get attacked. And they have the same deathblow & add the strongest special ability in the game. Imagine for a moment that they are commons instead of rares. Would you play 2 of them as the standard turn-1 passion fodder ? I would. Their advantage over the redcap is that they can attack in situations where it's just too unpradicatable to attack with a "bloodthirsty" creature". Or against spelbound scissors (where bloodthirsty is all too predicatable) 

The Knight of strife & Joy should realy, really, really be "Core".
Skirmish-2 is not a slightly more effecient version of Skirmish-1. It's a quantum level more powerfull. It powers the strongest combo in the game. Scarab warcharm, Kt.S&J & a beatstick (e.g. Eater of Hope)
That combo can skirmish itself across the map, attacking 4 or 5 times in a single turn. Creatures with only skirmish-1 cannot achieve that effect, no matter how lucky they get.
True, it requires a moderate amount of luck to consistantly roll 2 blades with 13 dice, but so does any combat in dreamblade. And you only need to get lucky once with this combo to compleatly shatter the entire opposing warband.
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11/04/2006 8:23 AM  
I agree with XaAos on the KoS&J. he is VERY useful, especially now with maiden aidin' him. (wow, that was bad )

And 2 KoS&J is insane with Ragedrake and Succubus. 22 dice, with lure and trample. Yowza...

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11/04/2006 12:04 PM  
I agree with KoSJ being in core.

You'll probably be moving Kitsune to core soon.  She is surfacing (on Vassal at least) as one of the best in the set.

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11/04/2006 9:32 PM  
Posted By Teflon Jeff on 11/04/2006 8:23 AM
I agree with XaAos on the KoS&J. he is VERY useful, especially now with maiden aidin' him. (wow, that was bad )

And 2 KoS&J is insane with Ragedrake and Succubus. 22 dice, with lure and trample. Yowza...

I'll echo the call for KoS&J being core, Skirmish 2 is a huge improvement over the regular version. I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get another version of it for a while.




Jeff, that is a viscious combo, but wouldn't you rather an Infernal Gothic in the place of the Succubus? Multi-Lure could wipe out an opponent.

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11/04/2006 10:06 PM  
Posted By Prince o the Raven Banner on 11/04/2006 9:32 PM
Posted By Teflon Jeff on 11/04/2006 8:23 AM
I agree with XaAos on the KoS&J. he is VERY useful, especially now with maiden aidin' him. (wow, that was bad )

And 2 KoS&J is insane with Ragedrake and Succubus. 22 dice, with lure and trample. Yowza...

I'll echo the call for KoS&J being core, Skirmish 2 is a huge improvement over the regular version. I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get another version of it for a while.




Jeff, that is a viscious combo, but wouldn't you rather an Infernal Gothic in the place of the Succubus? Multi-Lure could wipe out an opponent.

I don't have the new set in hand, so I'll have to look into it when it arrives. I just know ragedrake has a LOT of dice... But yeah, Gothic does seem to be the wiser choice.

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11/04/2006 11:43 PM  

Made some suggested changes.  Anyone actually played with the Hammerhead, yet, and made it work?  Granted, 1/2 defense/life isn't much worse than 2/3, but it is worse.  Another thing that makes me hesitate is that I don't have a feel for how much finesse is required to make double stakes work for you.

Okay, fear was next on my list.  Seems a bit sparse.  What am I missing?

Fear toolkit:

 

Core toolkit:

 

Cannibal Pariah (C, BS): 2F 2/3/4 – just great stats for a fodder piece.

 

Zombie Enforcer (C, BS): 3F 2/4/6 – good stats for fodder make this guy generally the best fear choice at the 3-spot in the spawn curve.

 

Jack of Blades (C, BS): 5F 3/4/7, @ expel – he lacks the flexibility of the poltergeist, but the fact that he’s cheaper to spawn in the early game makes him a little more valuable and thus a core tool.  There's simply no quicker way to get a creature with expel into play, which can be critical to winning early to mid-game turns (in the late game, you'll be relying instead on bigger pieces like the Dreadmorph Ogre, probably).  Expel is an extremely powerful ability, on par with skirmish, and should not be discounted.
 

Knight of Autumn Gate (C, BS): 6FF 5/7/11, appease – with amazing stats for his cost, this guy is worth playing even if you’re not trying to pump up your graveyard to power a Carrion Spiker or give Baxar “call” targets.Appeasement might look like a drawback, but it actually allows you to get and keep an early lead because you can risk spreading yourself thin to win early turns by getting to the high-scoring cells.If you do that with other bands, your opponent will have the opportunity to win points later by destroying the fodder you’ve hung out on a limb.Appease lets you sacrifice the creature(s) first and remove a scoring opportunity for your opponent, in the process spawning a highly efficient fighter as his replacement.

 

Fleshless Reaper (R, BS): 8F 0/7/10, ambush – power 0 is certainly a drawback, but if you park this guy in the right place, you can control the battlefield by exploiting your opponent’s fear of the ambush ability.Even tough opponents have to weigh the risk that ambush might take them out, and if you can power ambush with a Dearkheart Cottage, the reaper becomes fearsome in the extreme.Friends with lure, scare or expel can feed targets to the reaper and expel can move the enemy survivors away again, where the 0 power would be a real liability.Teaming with valor pieces also allows you to move the reaper back into position if your opponent has the ability to move him out of his favorite ambush spot (generally the key cell in the center of the dreamscape).

 

Thunder Sultan (U, BS): 8FFF 5/6/8, (2) expel – complement to the Voodoo Manipulator, the sultan grants additional flexibility to your ability to disrupt your opponent’s positioning during spawn phase.His ability is important especially if you lose initiative, since you can disrupt potentially devastating strikes against your key pieces, such as a Fleshless Reaper.

 

Voodoo Manipulator (R, BS): 8FFF 4/7/9, (2) scare – scare in the spawn phase is hugely disruptive to opponents and allows you to maintain excellent control of the battlefield.The high aspect cost assures he’s only efficient in a heavily fear band, but he’s well worth it once aspect cost is paid.

 

Baxar the Soulstitcher (R, BW): 10F 5/8/11, (Y,X) Call, @ deathboon – call is an ability that just makes you go “wow”.While he’s in a scoring cell, your graveyard becomes your reserves, with the added bonus that called creatures get to reinforce Baxar.The deathboon ability can actually be a bit of a drawback, since it removes targets for the call ability, but since Baxar probably won’t be able to stay in a scoring cell forever, recharging your reserves isn’t a bad idea.A Baxar band could definitely benefit from extra spawn points, so consider ways to boost your spawn total.

 

Dreadmorph Ogre (R, BS):11FF 6/10/13, @@@ expel – great stats and multiblade expel make this guy one of fear’s most efficient high-end pieces.He teams especially well with a Fleshless Reaper, but multiblade expel is, in generaly, truly awesome.  Don't forget that as long as you don't disrupt a target, damage doesn't clear until the end of the phase.  That allows you to lay on some damage in one cell and then expel that damaged target into another combat during the same phase, where you can finish it off.

 

 

Extended toolkit:

 

Barbstrider (U, BS): 2F 3/2/4, inciter 1 – power 3 in a 2-spawn creature is impressive, but the barbstrider can become a liability if a clever opponent turns the inciter ability against you.If you play this guy, have a plan to get him out of the way before that happens (appease, for example), because your opponent may not always indulge you.

 

Knight of Pain and Sorrow (U, BS): 4FF 2/4/7, nullify valor – if valor blade abilities weren’t so prevalent in winning bands, this gal wouldn’t even make the extended list, since the cheaper Zombie Enforcer is just about as good, otherwise.If you need a 4-spawn piece, though, she’s worth considering as anti-scarab “tech”.

 

Acolyte of Loss (U, BS): 5F 2/6/8, nullify – you’re not going to play him for his stats, but a lot of bands rely on powerful blade abilities to control the game.With this guy, you can shut that down if you play carefully.Just watch out that you don’t nullify your own abilities.

 

Genteel Hust (R, BS): 5FFF 2/5/6, dominate – he’s a bit on the fragile side, with no power to speak of, but he doesn’t have to strike to win a cell.He offers yet another way that fear can control the battlefield.With a bodyguard, especially, he can be a very frustrating opponent.


Butcher (C, BW): 6F 4/7/10, (*) corpsebuilt - corpsebuilt seems like quite a drawback, so why play this guy?  Baxar, that's why.  With stats equivalent to the more expensive Blight Rat, he makes sense with Baxar, since corpsebuilt can actually then be an advantage.  Consider that Baxar doesn't have to pay aspect cost when he calls one of your creatures from the graveyard.  That lets you consider off-aspect combos that would otherwise be too expensive.
 

Horrid Poltergeist (U, BS): 6FF 3/4/7, @ scare, @ expel – it’s easy to draw comparisons from this guy to the Scarab Warcharm.He’s sort of the mirror image, but lots more expensive and easier to disrupt.The extra power is nice, but it’s a shame he’s tapped out at two blades.Still there’s no other figure with scare and expel in one package.


Night Queen (R, BS): 6FFF 3/6/9, @@ purge – she has playable stats, but her purge ability is the reason to include her.The threat of the purge ability may force your opponent to spawn creatures non-optimally, for fear of losing critical creatures before getting them into the dreamscape.Of course, the ability can be more than a threat if you succeed in dumping your opponent’s most dangerous creatures into the graveyard.

 

Carrion Spiker (R, BS): 7F */7/10, thanatomancy – with power equal to the number of creatures in your graveyard, the Carrion Spiker can be a fearsome mid to late game piece.He teams well with appeasement creatures and fodder swarms, not so well with Baxar, who you will probably use to deplete your graveyard.


Glaive Scorpion (R, BW): 8F 4/7/10, @ venom 4, @ expel - sans blades, this piece is just okay (stats like the cheaper Blight Rat), but the blades make it worth considering.  Venom 4 is just enough to be interesting, as it can destroy outright some important pieces (Scarab Warcharm, Jack-in-the-Box) and it can allow you to completely bypass a bodyguard to take those guys out, if you need to.  In addition, the combination of venom and expel can be quite powerful if you can reliably get 2 blades--venom a target and expel it to negate a death blow or to allow another scorpion to pile on another 4 venom points, or bring a target into the cell to hit it with venom.
 

Ekkyon Wayfarer (R, BS): 9F 5/8/11, hell’s fury – worth including in any hellbred band, his stats aren’t bad (same as the more expensive Baxar), but with just hell’s fury as a special ability, he’s only worth it if you have plenty of efficient hellbred with him in the band.

 

Eater of Hope (R, BS): 10FF 7/10/15, appease – this guy’s stats are outrageously good.The only drawback is appease, but that isn’t even always a drawback, as I discussed in the Knight of Autumn Gate entry.His high spawn cost, though, means you don’t have as much flexibility as to when you spawn him (and thus less flexibility about choosing a ripe appeasement target).

 

Crypt Worm (U, BW): 11F 6/10/13, (Y,0) haunt gambit 2 – with raw stats as good as the Dreadmorph Ogre, it’s a matter of deciding whether you want the haunt gambit or multiblade expel.Both have their merits—teamed with a Fleshless Reaper, the Crypt Worm leaves fewer “safe zones” for enemy troops who don’t want to be ambushed—but I think the ogre has the edge.However, since multi-ogre bands have proved quite effective already and this guy is uncommon, players on a limited budget will probably find that the worm makes an effective substitute for the extra ogres they don’t have in their collection.In fact, it may prove better to have one ogre and one worm than to have two ogres.


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11/04/2006 11:59 PM  
Posted By Prince o the Raven Banner on 11/03/2006 11:10 PM
A bad turn 3 spawn is REALLY bad on mono Passion bands.
Do you think they way I'm writing up these toolkit entries, they advocate mono-aspect bands?  I didn't set out to do that.  In some cases, I guess I'm thinking about each aspect in a vaccuum, but I think the toolkit will be most useful if it suggests synergies.  And I think it's fine to chop a piece out of a toolkit because it pales in comparison to a comparable piece from another faction.

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