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Lord_rock
Underboss
1786 Posts
    
Portland OR
 | | 07/08/2008 12:57 PM |
| | I finally got my amazon order and am thinking of sending it back. I can't break the shrink wrap and send it back as I bought the box set. Anyone hear if they fixed the smudgy pages yet? I'm very tempted to send it back and buy a new PH that I can test for smudging as the DMG is worthless and we have a MM already. | |
Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
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zenthrus
Commander
4803 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/08/2008 7:59 PM |
| Finding small smudges in my PHB (only have 2 between our group so far so it gets passed around). So far, the smudgy pages are my biggest beef with 4E.
Has WotC stated that they're correcting the problem? I would be very happy to hear an official "we're changing our print runs" or something along those lines.
Page smudges will ensure that my 4E purchases remain minimal despite loving the system  | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
Have/Want List
Trade References | |
| Master of the
Awesome Sauce
Teflon Jeff
Warlord
7146 Posts
Idaho. Yes, we have Gamers in Idaho.
| | 07/09/2008 9:56 AM |
| Don't recall any, but I'll double check.
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Official Delegate, Wizards of the Coast
Against The Giants Called Shot: Huge Green Dragon
Icons Called Shot: Gargantuan Prismatic Dragon
"Rejoice, for bad things are about to happen." | |
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Username
Warlord
5615 Posts
| | 07/09/2008 1:03 PM |
| I haven't found any...yet.
(fingers crossed!) | |
Originally posted by Schooly_D
Username - he deals in minis
Champion of Lhesh Haruuc Shaarat'kor | |
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Rath
Skirmisher
36 Posts
| | 07/19/2008 11:27 AM |
| Posted By zenthrus on 07/08/2008 7:59 PM
Finding small smudges in my PHB (only have 2 between our group so far so it gets passed around). So far, the smudgy pages are my biggest beef with 4E.
Has WotC stated that they're correcting the problem? I would be very happy to hear an official "we're changing our print runs" or something along those lines.
Â
WotC can't officially acknowledge the problem without taking financial losses. People would begin returning thousands of smudged book for new copies... none of the bigwigs at WotC want to go down that road.
The official reason being given for the smudging is something along the lines of people having dirty, unwashed hands or chemicals in their sweat that interacts badly with the ink in the books... it's a load of crap to be sure but that's as close to the truth that they can come without losing money on the 4E books.
What will probably happen is that WotC will quietly fix the problem in the next print run without making any sort of announcement about it. If I were interested in 4E (which I'm not) I would wait for the 2nd printing to come out before buying anything.
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Fun Guy from Yuggoth
Cthulhufnord
Warlord
10782 Posts
Umass Amherst Baby!
| | 07/19/2008 8:04 PM |
| Interesting, when Mongoose flubs up printing or binding of their books they typically send you a new one.
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Pathetic Earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void - without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe - anything at all - you would have hidden from it in terror. | |
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Rakhamon
Warrior
306 Posts
| | 07/20/2008 5:24 AM |
| It's probably been mentioned, but the smudging is most likely due to a low-grade paper or substandard printing process. Having spilled a single drop of (clean) water on my PhB I was very dismayed to note that the print ran -immediately- when I tried to dry it off. This, to me, indicates that Wizards have skimped on the product quality in order to make more of a profit on the books. It's also a pretty nasty thing to do, since your core rulebooks are the ones liable to endure the most wear and tear, and if they wear out quickly you'd have to replace them.
All in all not a pretty situation. | |
My trading references: http://www.maxminis.com/Forums/tabid/104/forumid/53/postid/680508/view/topic/Default.aspx
KD Embassador to Sweden, Entertainment Liaison to the Founder | |
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Rath
Skirmisher
36 Posts
| | 07/20/2008 7:39 AM |
| Posted By Rakhamon on 07/20/2008 5:24 AM
It's probably been mentioned, but the smudging is most likely due to a low-grade paper or substandard printing process. Having spilled a single drop of (clean) water on my PhB I was very dismayed to note that the print ran -immediately- when I tried to dry it off. This, to me, indicates that Wizards have skimped on the product quality in order to make more of a profit on the books. It's also a pretty nasty thing to do, since your core rulebooks are the ones liable to endure the most wear and tear, and if they wear out quickly you'd have to replace them.
All in all not a pretty situation.
I remember the reoganized 2E black cover books that came out in 95 were also lacking in quality. The glue that held the binding together was crap... I remember opening a brand new 2E DMG with a black cover a few times on the same day I bought it only to notice that the binding had separated, I could hardly believe it. Cheap glue I guess.
Still, I'd rather have that problem than smudged pages.
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Wraithborne
Commander
3521 Posts
West Virginia
| | 07/20/2008 9:23 AM |
| Posted By Rakhamon on 07/20/2008 5:24 AM
your core rulebooks are the ones liable to endure the most wear and tear, and if they wear out quickly you'd have to replace them.
I would imagine that's the point. | |
The year: 1994. From out of space comes a runaway planet, hurtling between the Earth and the Moon, unleashing cosmic destruction! Man's civilization is cast in ruin!
Two thousand years later, Earth is reborn...
A strange new world rises from the old: a world of savagery, super science, and sorcery. But one man bursts his bonds to fight for justice! With his companions Ookla the Mok and Princess Ariel, he pits his strength, his courage, and his fabulous Sunsword against the forces of evil.
He is Thundarr, the Barbarian!
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vanrulzz
Underboss
2465 Posts
¯\(°_o)/¯
| | 07/20/2008 10:57 PM |
| | i never had smugy pages, even spilled water on em and everything... | | | |
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AmishBurrito
Skirmisher
14 Posts
| | 07/21/2008 7:47 AM |
| | My players handbook was in perfect condition, but I was reading it one day and went to turn the page and noticed a lot of smeared ink under where my thumb was resting. It has only happened on that one page, so I don't know what to attribute it to. | | | |
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zenthrus
Commander
4803 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/23/2008 1:50 PM |
| I just picked up H2: Thunderspire Labyrinth.
A few notes:
1) The outside booklet covers are basically identical to those in Keep on the Shadowfell. Same artwork/same glossy.
2) The paper is different from KotS. It's somewhere between the KotS paper (flimsy, glossy magazine) and the Treasure of Talon Pass paper (stiff cardstock).
3) I've essentially mauled the covers with fingerprints and no discernible smudging/smearing.
4) The inside pages don't even appear that they could smudge.
So, kudos to WotC for adjusting the problem. Hopefully any future print runs of the core books/KotS will use the better paper (not holding my breath, but it could happen). | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
Have/Want List
Trade References | |
| Master of the
Awesome Sauce
Teflon Jeff
Warlord
7146 Posts
Idaho. Yes, we have Gamers in Idaho.
| | 07/23/2008 3:13 PM |
| Thanks, Zenthrus, good to know.
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Official Delegate, Wizards of the Coast
Against The Giants Called Shot: Huge Green Dragon
Icons Called Shot: Gargantuan Prismatic Dragon
"Rejoice, for bad things are about to happen." | |
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Lord_rock
Underboss
1786 Posts
Portland OR
| | 07/24/2008 1:30 PM |
| | No smudges yet on mine... not under heavy use yet and being careful so far but looks good... Hopefully it will remain so! | |
Rock Bottom Pricing:
Arcane Archer 30, Centaur Hero 67, Human Cleric of Bane 25, Gold Champion 34, Death Knight 52, Goblin Blackblade 9, Silentwolf Goblin 7, Orc Raider 10, Dwarf axefighter 9, Healer 9, Thaskor 65, Aspect of Demogorgon 71, Ogre 9, Fire Giant 79, Human Wanderer 7, Drunken Master 18, Barghest 12, Longstider Barbarian 27, Longtooth Barbarian 22, Frost Giant 76, Ravenous Vampire 42, Large Earth Elemental: priceless | |
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vanrulzz
Underboss
2465 Posts
¯\(°_o)/¯
| | 07/26/2008 1:48 PM |
| Posted By zenthrus on 07/23/2008 1:50 PM
I just picked up H2: Thunderspire Labyrinth.
A few notes:
1) The outside booklet covers are basically identical to those in Keep on the Shadowfell. Same artwork/same glossy.
2) The paper is different from KotS. It's somewhere between the KotS paper (flimsy, glossy magazine) and the Treasure of Talon Pass paper (stiff cardstock).
3) I've essentially mauled the covers with fingerprints and no discernible smudging/smearing.
4) The inside pages don't even appear that they could smudge.
So, kudos to WotC for adjusting the problem. Hopefully any future print runs of the core books/KotS will use the better paper (not holding my breath, but it could happen).
yay!
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tirwin
Sergeant
454 Posts
North Dakota, USA
| | 07/27/2008 8:23 PM |
| | Sorry to see I am not the only one to notice this problem. Me and five other players in our group all have the same problem with our 4th edition books. On the first night we played the new edition I noticed a smudge where my thumb had rested so I decided to rest my finger on another part of the page and after a few seconds pulled my finger down the page slightly and sure enough another smudge! The others at the table then tested their PHB and noticed they had the same problem. One of the players who apparently knows a bit about printing books noted that it was the type of paper used most likely. This really angers me since I already fork over thousands of dollars to Wizards every year buying atleast several cases of every mini's set not to mention every book and adventure they ever release for all editions. My collection is extensive as well as expensive, and now it appears I own books that will not stand the test of time with heavy use. Don't suppose I should hold my breath for a recall or any other such high moral act of kindness as big business rarely seems to do the right thing, it's all about the money :-( | |
Here is my have want list:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=tirwin
Successful Trades: Irav222 (x2), Darkfather, Kaya Kenobi, conanb1, dudeeehm, Uk, Master Elminster, tmertz, Shasack, Drewskie, et39100 (x2), Gaddszooks (x4), Romers, Weinbergphp, Vaasic, Navaire, lurch_E_bean, dobblegog, cjmax, jthm, Meds x2, hellfire2, w33zrfan, unmaker, sthig, Eldarion, drowdude, DM Lackey, griffat, eryador, tsech (not sure if this is his screen name?), Jordan, entropysoda, MikeWis, HalifaxDM, Targan, Drakul, wraith428, dmindock, mythoscreature, Tenlado,Chaotic Good, Asteroidjawa, Puggins, Bdog, slapdragon, Drakkengi,WarRabbit(2), Mnpatsfan, Greymouse, Snapdragon, Isondaho, Halofurry, Krush, Ekomega, Amator, Minatoman38, + many new trades recorded by maxminis, and never had a bad trade so please help keep the streak alive, thanks!
Harbringer 80/80, Dragoneye 60/60, Archfiends 60/60, Giants of Legend 72/72, Aberrations 60/60, Deathknell 60/60, Angelfire 60/60, Underdark 60/60, War Drums 60/60, War of the Dragon Queen 60/60, Blood War 60/60, Unhallowed 60/60, Night Below 60/60, DoD 60/60, I'm done listing just assume I have them all because I do, thanks. | |
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Rath
Skirmisher
36 Posts
| | 07/28/2008 4:12 PM |
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Who knows, maybe it's really a clever ploy by WotC to make sure everyone keeps constantly buying new rulebooks. :)
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Machinehead
Skirmisher
4 Posts
| | 08/15/2008 5:40 PM |
| Posted By Rath on 07/28/2008 4:12 PM
Who knows, maybe it's really a clever ploy by WotC to make sure everyone keeps constantly buying new rulebooks. :)
That's not clever, it's expected :D
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