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Subject: WoTDQ revealed - Somewhat

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SneakyJoeKDB
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Utah

06/13/2006 5:11 PM  
Now those are the dragons we have been waiting for. Tiamet gets a duel activation.....Oh have mercy!

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Netherlands

06/13/2006 5:14 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by CrAlloy

Some Huge stats are available.

http://www.levalet.com/forum/index.php?topic=4345.0

http://www.blackguard.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5735&sid=7a1dec43ecfc98b80efed722de1dba0c




great stuff, nice to have the blackguard on nightmare confirmed as epic as well!

D.

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06/13/2006 5:14 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Gloom_

Tiamat has speed f4.. haha

Large Black + Sorcerer looks neat.



Reason for speed 4 is because of dual activation.

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06/13/2006 5:18 PM  
Lil let down by the Goliath Cleric...

Both Aspects look pretty sweet for Epic.

Epic Nightmare is blah, hoping the regular is better.

Eldritch Giant is very blah with that no Commander on MC.

Hobgoblin Talon has potential with the Spawns actually.

Epic packlord is pretty swanky. Need a new Displacer Beast to go with it now :)

Sorceror on Black rocks pretty hard. Potential 90 dam in a rd with spells and all attacks.

Huge Fiendish Spider is really pretty swanky 30 dam is fat with a nice wall walker too.

Huge Fire Elemental is pretty swanky too.

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06/13/2006 5:20 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Gloom_

Tiamat has speed f4.. haha




And dual activation. With 5 breath weapons.

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06/13/2006 5:38 PM  
Wooo! Loving the Aspects!

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06/13/2006 5:40 PM  
Heh Epic Blackguard Cmnd 4... just what i tought when I saw tyrannical morale +6. LE is getting screwed at Commander Ratings. Good 'ole Blackguard and Urthok are still hard to beat.

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Finland

06/13/2006 5:44 PM  
DOH! Now Eldrich giant needs either new or old Black guard to go with him, its allways better to kill your own giant for failing a morale save than letting your advesary have the pleasure seeing him run off the map... [:p]

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06/13/2006 5:47 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by ShivanWurm

quote:
Originally posted by Gloom_

Tiamat has speed f4.. haha




And dual activation. With 5 breath weapons.

Well, yes. I know. I just think it's funny that the queen of evil dragons is so fat she can only fly as fast as a dwarf.. haha

Stats are pretty good, although I'm liking Bahamut more!


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06/13/2006 5:55 PM  
Strange that we have the Epic stats for the Human Blackguard on Nightmare without the non-Epic first...it is confirmed that the Human Blackguard will have non-Epic stats right?


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06/13/2006 5:55 PM  
I really shouldnt read the forums at 1am. I looked at the Aspect of Tiamat stats, and though "Oh my god, that is so broken its unbelievable."

After about 5 minutes I remembered its huge for Epic play, not for 200p. I should sleep. [B)]

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06/13/2006 5:55 PM  
So far the Aspects look pretty good, but honestly we wont know until we start playing with them and skirmishing. Some of the epics look pretty nice, but I'll reserve judgement.

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06/13/2006 5:58 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by XenoZephyr

Strange that we have the Epic stats for the Human Blackguard on Nightmare without the non-Epic first...it is confirmed that the Human Blackguard will have non-Epic stats right?

In the preview IIRC


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Utah

06/13/2006 5:58 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Tooninki

DOH! Now Eldrich giant needs either new or old Black guard to go with him, its allways better to kill your own giant for failing a morale save than letting your advesary have the pleasure seeing him run off the map... [:p]



If you want room for 2 Giants, there is always the Skull Crusher with Tyranical morale 4 as well. The new Nightmare+Guard grants tyranical moral 6 so that should be efficient enough to run the Giant. I hope the Nightmare Guard is sturdy in regular

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USA

06/13/2006 6:12 PM  
EPICS - WOW WOW WOW! [:0][^][:D]

Keep em coming if you can.


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06/13/2006 6:22 PM  
They look great so far... I'm morbidly curious to see the stats of the Bluespawn... he looks like he could be a beast in Epic based on his preview... here's hoping, anyway...

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06/13/2006 6:27 PM  
I hate to be a major wet blanket but does every CG piece we've seen look like a total piece of crap or is it just me?

R~

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06/13/2006 6:36 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by AesophDarkfable

Lil let down by the Goliath Cleric...

Both Aspects look pretty sweet for Epic.

I agree, though I'd say a lot let down by the Goliath. Right now, I think he's the worst figure we've seen, stat-wise.

quote:

Epic Nightmare is blah, hoping the regular is better.

I actually like her, and suspect this version will be more playable than the nonepic. While she's a lot of your points, and commander 4 is a bit disappointing, everything else is rock solid. She's ridiculously mobile with F10, Mounted Melee Attack and two blink-outs. She can do up to 45 damage after moving 20 squares. Good attack bonuses, good AC, and decent HP. The breath weapon can be useful, too.

quote:
Eldritch Giant is very blah with that no Commander on MC.
Yeah, the arrogance is rough, and unnecessary IMO. I think he still has potential. He just needs to be played with a Blackguard.

quote:

Hobgoblin Talon has potential with the Spawns actually.
Agreed.

quote:

Epic packlord is pretty swanky. Need a new Displacer Beast to go with it now :)
Until we get a new Displacer XXX to benefit from his CE, I'm not a fan. Attacks are ho-hum. The biggest thing is that these new huges seem to be lacking Blindsight or Blind-fight. So he could be pretty annoying.

quote:

Sorceror on Black rocks pretty hard. Potential 90 dam in a rd with spells and all attacks.
Attacks that don't have a very good chance of hitting many epic figures, and a spell that will most likely have to get through SR. I think it has potential, but it seems like more of a support figure to me. Which is a tough role to fill at 200 pts.

quote:
Huge Fiendish Spider is really pretty swanky 30 dam is fat with a nice wall walker too.

Oh yeah. The Virulent Poison is great, especially with the unlimited smite.

quote:
Huge Fire Elemental is pretty swanky too.
This one is pretty meh for me.

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Finland

06/13/2006 6:45 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by SneakyJoeKDB

quote:
Originally posted by Tooninki

DOH! Now Eldrich giant needs either new or old Black guard to go with him, its allways better to kill your own giant for failing a morale save than letting your advesary have the pleasure seeing him run off the map... [:p]



If you want room for 2 Giants, there is always the Skull Crusher with Tyranical morale 4 as well. The new Nightmare+Guard grants tyranical moral 6 so that should be efficient enough to run the Giant. I hope the Nightmare Guard is sturdy in regular



You mean Mr Skull splitter for Aberrations, right? Hmm, that might do it, now just need SS for LE and thats it... ΖD]

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06/13/2006 6:48 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman

I hate to be a major wet blanket but does every CG piece we've seen look like a total piece of crap or is it just me?
R~



Well, sort of. Most of the pieces aren't all that impressive, I concede. The Spellscale could be good however, and I'm genuinely interested in trying the Clawfoot. The Griffon Cavalry does not amuse me but I'm not totally dismissing it yet.

However, the Goliath Cleric sucks. It could've been a great Whirlwinder for the Brass Samurai if it had more speed and attack bonus, but its current layout is junk.

Then the Bonded Fire Summoner. Activation Control be damned, 43 points for a Commander 2? I have only one response to that: OBJECTION! *Hand-slam on desk*

CG's going to get a few decent pieces this set, but the others look like real stinkers so far.

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06/13/2006 6:50 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Pegasus Knight

quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman

I hate to be a major wet blanket but does every CG piece we've seen look like a total piece of crap or is it just me?
R~



Then the Bonded Fire Summoner. Activation Control be damned, 43 points for a Commander 2? I have only one response to that: OBJECTION! *Hand-slam on desk*



I agree with that!

R~

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Utah

06/13/2006 6:54 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman

I hate to be a major wet blanket but does every CG piece we've seen look like a total piece of crap or is it just me?

R~



Its not just you Rob, CG is getting nerfed hard! As if it wasnt already hurting. The Lawful factions have been on top and they just got better. CG needs something... is there anything left that we havent seen that could be promising for CG? If not, I can only be hopeful when the Epic Archmage card comes out.

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06/13/2006 7:00 PM  
Warden of the Wood, Small Copper Dragon, Tavern Brawler (I'd love to see this be a powerhouse piece, I'd laugh for hours about it), Purple Worm, Huge Fire Elemental. Not sure what else. Maybe they thought there was too much warband building potential to make some great peices just for CG. I dunno.

R~

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06/13/2006 7:01 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Pegasus Knight


However, the Goliath Cleric sucks. It could've been a great Whirlwinder for the Brass Samurai if it had more speed and attack bonus, but its current layout is junk.


I was hoping the Goliath Cleric would be a commander (a decent commander) with a useful commander effect, but instead he's a slow beater with a crap attack bonus (+8?! Come on!). Very dissapointing. [V]

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06/13/2006 7:01 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Tooninki

DOH! Now Eldrich giant needs either new or old Black guard to go with him, its allways better to kill your own giant for failing a morale save than letting your advesary have the pleasure seeing him run off the map... [:p]


It didn't say that the Eldritch Giant couldn't be rallied, only that the commander rating of a commander wasn't added to his save when rolling.

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06/13/2006 7:04 PM  
The Goliath cleric was an a very big letdown. The fact that we got another Goliath, when *no one* was clamouring for another one, hurt as it was. But to not even make it good for skirmish, its just a crap peice now. Seriously I didnt mind the last one because we hadnt even had one and it was pretty useful for skirmish. So I was like, well I can deal with it. But now we got this one, and its sucktastic.

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06/13/2006 7:06 PM  
Yeah for the most part I would have to agree with you whole heartedly. I do think the bonded summoner and the spellscale have potential. However they are definitely not enough to dig chaotic good out of its perpetual hole. I was really hoping this set would boost CG like WD gave a boost to CE. Oh well you know what my favorite faction is and it's doing just fine!! :P Bahamut's stats look awsome!!!

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06/13/2006 7:12 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Corim Danex

quote:
Originally posted by Tooninki

DOH! Now Eldrich giant needs either new or old Black guard to go with him, its allways better to kill your own giant for failing a morale save than letting your advesary have the pleasure seeing him run off the map... [:p]


It didn't say that the Eldritch Giant couldn't be rallied, only that the commander rating of a commander wasn't added to his save when rolling.


I know that, but its the Black guards and Skullsplitter who minimize the RUNNING AWAY!!! part via Tyrannical morale, 1 turn more to hit or spell things, instead rallying... [:p]

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06/13/2006 7:17 PM  
It's nice to see that all the huges are fairly playable. None are as obviously overcosted as the Cloud Giant or anything.

Aspect of Bahamut is pretty wild. Commander 8? With level 15? That means he has to be in an aura of fear, and facing an enemy wardrummer to fail morale on anything but a 1. Plus, unbelievable breath weapons. He costs a lot, but you get a lot. Including cleave!

Goliath Cleric could seriously use some more HP. It's nice to see some clerics that aren't commanders, but this guy underwhelms me.

Huge Fire Elemental is okay. If you're immune fire, then you're in luck. If not, it looks like a tough fight.

It's too bad the Aspect of Tiamat's cost reduces her dragon follower potential to a few tokens. Still, who needs followers, when that's the momma. She looks truely tough to fight.

Blackguard on Nightmare looks like a good commander for epic. It's too bad again, that you're spending so many points on the commander that you might not have room for the right followers. A 195-point commander in 500 is the equivalent of a 78-point commander in 200.

The Pack Lord is kind of weird as a commander 0, but I guess it works. Now we need a Displacer something worth taking into an Epic match. There doesn't seem to be a lot of blindsight in the set, so he'll probably be a major pest in sealed.

IMHO, Eldrich Giant has the goods. You'll want to bring along some Tyranical Morale to safeguard your investment, but it's hard to argue with this guy's HP, damage, and maneuverability. I wish he had cleave, but I wish a lot of things had cleave.

Talon of Tiamat looks like a servicable commander for your all dragon/spawn/goblin band. I wonder what the last few spawn will have for stats.

I suspect we'll be seeing a lot of the Huge Fiendish Spider at the prerelease. I'd play spider + tiamat + 6 points if I drew it.

Sorcerer on Black Dragon is sort of strange. I don't think he can cast while based, so you're not going to get full use out of the mounted spellcasting much. Still, his spells are nice, if not perfect, and he doesn't cost as much as he could have.

And lastly, I see why Shoe, usually so modest, had such praise for the Tundra Scout. Even if trample+attack+strike in the air is "only" 75 damage, it seems like an irrestably fun mechanic. Plus, great HP for his reasonable cost, and one of the highest attack bonuses that CE gets this set.

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06/13/2006 7:37 PM  
Thanks for posting the griffon rider.. though it seems a bit overpriced on reading :|

The aspect dragons look wild ! [:D]

Some great minis... have to digest stats stats stats


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06/13/2006 7:54 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Benimoto

And lastly, I see why Shoe, usually so modest, had such praise for the Tundra Scout. Even if trample+attack+strike in the air is "only" 75 damage, it seems like an irrestably fun mechanic. Plus, great HP for his reasonable cost, and one of the highest attack bonuses that CE gets this set.



Not only that, but you should be able to get double your value from a snake swiftness spell. Get out those orc druids, or at the prerelease hope you get that LG guy with SS.

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06/13/2006 8:39 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Benimoto

It's nice to see that all the huges are fairly playable. None are as obviously overcosted as the Cloud Giant or anything.


Actually I think the Displacer Beast Pack Lord, until it gets followers that it can use, sucks. This is just my initial feelings of course.


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06/13/2006 8:45 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman

Warden of the Wood, Small Copper Dragon, Tavern Brawler (I'd love to see this be a powerhouse piece, I'd laugh for hours about it), Purple Worm, Huge Fire Elemental. Not sure what else.


Wizened Elder Watcher. This elder must have some impressive stats to go from CR2 to Rare.


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06/13/2006 8:47 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by greyhaze

quote:
Originally posted by Benimoto

It's nice to see that all the huges are fairly playable. None are as obviously overcosted as the Cloud Giant or anything.


Actually I think the Displacer Beast Pack Lord, until it gets followers that it can use, sucks. This is just my initial feelings of course.



Hmmmm.... I think it's stats are in line for it to be okay without it being a commander. The fact that it is a commander is just a side effect that allows people to play Displacer Beasts (and Displacer Serpents if people wanted0 with it under command. Still granted if you don't have any of them it's CFX is pretty useless. Kind of like the Death Slaad though Blue Slaads are easier to come by. Still it's got a lot of HP and melee reach 4 ain't bad. I will agree that some of the other epics in the set make it seem a tad weak though.

R~

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06/13/2006 8:49 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by greyhaze

quote:
Originally posted by robbdaman

Warden of the Wood, Small Copper Dragon, Tavern Brawler (I'd love to see this be a powerhouse piece, I'd laugh for hours about it), Purple Worm, Huge Fire Elemental. Not sure what else.


Wizened Elder Watcher. This elder must have some impressive stats to go from CR2 to Rare.



Or it could be just a Rare tree piece of crap ala Dromite Wilder. [B)] I hope something CG in this set is an ass kicker.

R~

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06/13/2006 8:58 PM  
quote:
Actually I think the Displacer Beast Pack Lord, until it gets followers that it can use, sucks. This is just my initial feelings of course.


Yeah I kinda have similar feelings. There is just nothing in epic format that sinergizes well with it. Heres hoping we get an advanced hit dice displacer beast or something in monster manual 4 with displacer in the name that compliments it in epic.

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Utah

06/13/2006 9:03 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by Benimoto


Sorcerer on Black Dragon is sort of strange. I don't think he can cast while based, so you're not going to get full use out of the mounted spellcasting much. Still, his spells are nice, if not perfect, and he doesn't cost as much as he could have.



I looked at this too, the mini has melee reach 2 so essentially you can use all its attacks and cast a swift action spell. Just need to manuever it properly.

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06/13/2006 9:03 PM  
quote:
Warden of the Wood, Small Copper Dragon, Tavern Brawler (I'd love to see this be a powerhouse piece, I'd laugh for hours about it), Purple Worm, Huge Fire Elemental. Not sure what else.


I'd laugh too if it was the tavern brawler, but I'm not sure theres much hope left. [)]

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06/13/2006 9:08 PM  
quote:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Benimoto


Sorcerer on Black Dragon is sort of strange. I don't think he can cast while based, so you're not going to get full use out of the mounted spellcasting much. Still, his spells are nice, if not perfect, and he doesn't cost as much as he could have.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I looked at this too, the mini has melee reach 2 so essentially you can use all its attacks and cast a swift action spell. Just need to manuever it properly.


You could teasm it up with the Dragon Totem hero cast a spell as a swift action and then move 2 squares and still make a full attack.

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06/13/2006 9:10 PM  
quote:
Originally posted by kingnanu

quote:
Warden of the Wood, Small Copper Dragon, Tavern Brawler (I'd love to see this be a powerhouse piece, I'd laugh for hours about it), Purple Worm, Huge Fire Elemental. Not sure what else.


I'd laugh too if it was the tavern brawler, but I'm not sure theres much hope left. [)]



Hey, he could be fearless because he's drunk, have extra damage because he thinks he's strong because he's drunk, be unkillable because he's too drunk to die and a breathe a toxic breath weapon of old drunken nastiness. [:D]

R~

Champion of the Titan
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