Hero of Skirmish
doubtofbuddha
Commander
3371 Posts
    
 | | 05/27/2005 10:02 AM |
| | recovered topic 4095 | |
I am not gone. | |
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Hero of Skirmish
doubtofbuddha
Commander
3371 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 10:02 AM |
| Why do you hate 12 activations?
Why? | |
I am not gone. | |
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Okay McKay
Underboss
1068 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 10:04 AM |
| | Lareth is a bit too chaotic for my tastes... but have at it, my friend! Your ideas are good. | |
"It's an automatic robot, based on science." | |
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Damien the Bloodfeaster
Sergeant
885 Posts
Portland, OR
| | 05/27/2005 10:09 AM |
| | I don't think I'd use Lareth unless at least some of my hitters were immune to criticals. I'd also be sure to use him with the Tiefling Captain, to maximize the ability to crit. | | | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 10:16 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by doubtofbuddha
Why do you hate 12 activations?
Why?
Because 12 is one less than 13... and I have triskaidekaphobia... so the farther away I am from 13, the better. [)]
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 10:18 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Okay McKay
Lareth is a bit too chaotic for my tastes... but have at it, my friend! Your ideas are good.
I'm going to play one of these builds tomorrow. I've never really used Lareth, but I feel there is potential there.
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 10:32 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Damien the Bloodfeaster
I don't think I'd use Lareth unless at least some of my hitters were immune to criticals. I'd also be sure to use him with the Tiefling Captain, to maximize the ability to crit.
I don't know. That just seems like too many points spent on Commanders. Here's a build that uses the Tiefling...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Clay Golem
Ogre Ravager
Abyssal Maw x5
Orc Warrior x2
11 activations, 200 points
Another one with a Boneclaw and 12 activations for Jesse...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Ogre Ravager
Boneclaw
Abyssal Maw x7
Troglodyte
However, with this build... you have to hope for a very Chaotic-rich environment. Personally, I'm not a fan of the Boneclaw, but this one could be fun to play.
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 11:06 AM |
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All the bands seem solid except the last one, seriously lacking the capabilities to dish out damage.
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"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 11:14 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Goldmoon
All the bands seem solid except the last one, seriously lacking the capabilities to dish out damage.
I agree. The only other undead hitter is the Boneclaw and he is pretty weak. I suppose you could field an army of Minotaur Skeletons. I can just imagine the look on your opponent's face when he sees this...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Minotaur Skeleton x7
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x2
12 activations, 200 points
LOL
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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2005 D&D Miniatures Champion
Fenris
Sergeant
974 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 11:19 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by lalato I can just imagine the look on your opponent's face when he sees this...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Minotaur Skeleton x7
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x2
12 activations, 200 points
LOL
--sam
Heheh, does that even fit on an assembly tile? [:D] | |
Read my championship tournament report.
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 11:28 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by lalato
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Minotaur Skeleton x7
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x2
Wow! 7 minotaur skellies!
Hmm but a nice idea for my RP..... but need to go ebay to shop [:p]
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"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
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Gunthar
Commander
2938 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 11:39 AM |
| | Lareth is the CE piece I'm most likely to use. I like the way you think Sam, per usual. If you're going chaotic, go all the way! | |
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Avatar of the Tank
Newtoncain
Commander
2985 Posts
Land of 10,000 taxes
| | 05/27/2005 11:44 AM |
| I love Lareth, but at Speed 4 in a CE band just does not work unless you have a 2ndary commander (IMHO).
My son one day used the confusion spell on me out of the shoot. needless to say he won the battle right there as my Bladesinger cut down some of my own fodder on my starting tile.
Learned 2 lessons that day. Better tile placement and Lareth is deadly. | |
They just don't know what's good in life...Conan, tell them what is good in life.
To rip the boosters. To count the minis spilled out before you, and to hear the indifference of the women... | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 12:26 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Newtoncain
I love Lareth, but at Speed 4 in a CE band just does not work unless you have a 2ndary commander (IMHO).
I actually think of the speed 4 as a good thing. I want to use him more for his spells than his commander effect. I'm pretty good at working the lines of sight so that slow commanders can keep everyone in command. I learned a lot of it from playing LSD with the Cleric of Yondalla as the only commander. [)]
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 12:27 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Fenris
quote:
Originally posted by lalato I can just imagine the look on your opponent's face when he sees this...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Minotaur Skeleton x7
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x2
12 activations, 200 points
LOL
--sam
Heheh, does that even fit on an assembly tile? [:D]
I don't know... but now I want to find out! ΖD]
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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andytum
Sergeant
400 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 1:06 PM |
| | The Lareth + Undead build is nice 'cos undead are immune to criticals... it may have some potential... | |
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2004 D&D Miniatures Champion
Kiddoc
Underboss
1797 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 2:26 PM |
| Lareth has a lot of potential as an anti-CE spoiler piece for 2 reasons:
Searing Light
(and most importantly)
Confusion (Radius 2!!)
CE Warbands have a proclivity for ending up bunched up at some point in the game, either early on while setting up for an alpha strike (i.e., holeing up) or later on when ganging up on an enemy figure. Indeed, many CE bands, will throw eggs at an enemy unit (say 2-3 orc warriors) then move in with 1-2 heavy hitters to finish the job. Radius 2, even if you never hit them with it, can force them to come in a much more spread-out fashion.
In addition, that searing light can be a fantastic "bringer." If you manage to catch an Orc Warrior or a Cursed Spirit (provided you make the conceal) in it, you're up on points, and they have to bring the fight to you. If you can get them off against the ZWD or Lich Necromancer, you can drop an easy 60 points of damage on to them. And it provides a nice way to end or redirect those manuevering standoffs that seem to occur so frequently between CE warbands. If they want to circle around, or wait to position themselves, be sure and dump 30 points of auto damage into their Orc Champ or Ogre Ravager, which means even a single Orc Warrior can force a morale save later.
I generally don't recommend the Tiefling along with Lareth (though the combination is tempting) because of the point investment. I might run a Drow Sarge, but the key here is to keep activations up, get the heavy hitters in there, and if you can, squeeze in a cursed spirit or a trog. Lareth is slow and expensive, but he is also a commander 3, hits for a LOT of damage, is very durable, and has a nice brace of spells at his disposal. If he didn't have those 2 drawbacks, he'd be a premier commander, as it stands now, he's still fairly competitive, but only in very practiced hands. | |
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Master Peon
spikegif
Warlord
5699 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 3:04 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Fenris
quote:
Originally posted by lalato I can just imagine the look on your opponent's face when he sees this...
Lareth
Tiefling Captain
Minotaur Skeleton x7
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x2
12 activations, 200 points
LOL
--sam
Heheh, does that even fit on an assembly tile? [:D]
no need to [)] | |
First peon to make it to "Knight Warlord"
Completed Trades -148- | |
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KuH
Warrior
293 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 3:23 PM |
| Although one other person mentioned it in passing, Lareth seems obvious to partner with a Clay Golem, who has the same speed 4, is immune to criticals (but will do 60 damage himself on a critical), DR 5, fearless, has reach 2 to really protect an adjacent commander, etc. That's 110 points of joy to start with, leaving you 90 points to round out your warband ... one heavy hitter, a cheap second commander and filler.
The only catch I can see with Lareth is that he won't be happy being caught in dragon breath (AC 23 is not much use there, and he only has 60 hp). | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/27/2005 3:35 PM |
| Another Clay Golem Build...
Lareth
Clay Golem
Ogre Ravager
Drow Sergeant
Harpy
Orc Warrior x7
12 activations, 200 points
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 3:44 PM |
| | Another nice thing about the clay golem is he's immune to your confusion spell, so you don't care about catching him in it. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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thecheesemancan
Warrior
243 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 10:57 PM |
| | Gogo Ettins! With 4 attacks a turn, you're gonna hit for 60 sometime... | |
"A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven."
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gordonboom
Sergeant
393 Posts
| | 05/27/2005 11:17 PM |
| I am going to try out this band in casual play tomorrow.
Lareth the Beautiful 54
Ettin Skirmisher 40
ZWD 37
Ogre Ravager 38
Minotaur Skeleton 16
Orc Warrior x5 15
10 Activations
200 points | |
Champion of the Phaerimm
Trade References
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I am willing to trade minis for Magic cards. | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/28/2005 8:47 AM |
| Hmmm... I don't know. I guess I'm just not a big fan of the Ettin Skirmisher. He doesn't have nearly enough hit points. He's only level 6. I think I would rather spend my 40 points elsewhere.
If I did use an Ettin, I probably wouldn't use the Zombie White Dragon. As odd as it sounds, I would likely use two or three Cursed Spirits. Honestly, I can't think of a decent warband that puts the Ettin Skirmisher and Lareth together (that doesn't include the now banned Drider Sorceror). Here's something for you all to laugh at for a while...
Lareth
Ettin
Ogre Ravager
Cultist of the Dragon
Cursed Spirit x2
Orc Warrior x4
Abyssal Maw
200 Points, 11 Activations
The cultist is there for summoning Abyssal Maws. You must be able to control the pace of the game with activation control. 11 or 12 just isn't enough. The fodder and the Cursed Spirits can act as shields for the Ettin and Ogre Ravager. Tile placement becomes incredibly important. You cannot afford to be mired in a Mushroom Tangle at the outset of the match.
Perhaps in more capable hands than mine something like this could work, but I know my limitations and this would be beyond my abilities to pilot successfully.
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/29/2005 10:33 PM |
| Well... it's been an interesting experiment. I've played with Lareth a few times now and there is definitely potential there. The main problem seems to be killing stuff. I can make a lot of stuff rout, but it never quite makes it off the board.
One other thing... it's really hard to remember the commander effect. Even whem my opponent rolls a "1". But that just comes with practice.
A great player could pilot this and have decent success vs most chaotic bands. A player of my caliber can expect to win about 45% of the time vs. well-piloted chaotic bands. That seems about par for the course for me.
Confusion is great. Even if you never get a chance to cast it. It forces your opponent to make some interesting movement decisions that you may be able to capitalize on. If you can get the first turn confusion, go for it. Just don't count on that confusion to result in anything beyond slowing your opponent down a little. In my testing, I have rarely gained control of an opposing fig, but I have seen figs do nothing for several rounds.
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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lalato
Underboss
1546 Posts
Urbana, IL
| | 05/29/2005 11:24 PM |
| Here's a bit of an all or nothing build...
Lareth
Ogre Ravager x2
Orc Druid
Cursed Spirit x2
Abyssal Maw x3
Orc Warrior x2
--sam | |
I'm in Urbana, IL | |
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Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
11444 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 05/29/2005 11:48 PM |
| | How about Lareth, Tiefling, 2 Clay Golems, filler. I think the point of Lareth is to increase your chance at critical hits, and use creatures that are immune to them. Maybe Zombie White instead of the second Clay Golem? | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 05/29/2005 11:48 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by lalato
Here's a bit of an all or nothing build...
Lareth
Ogre Ravager x2
Orc Druid
Cursed Spirit x2
Abyssal Maw x3
Orc Warrior x2
--sam
Pretty interesting. It doesn't rely on the speed, so you don't have to worry about Lareth getting to far behind. Two commanders, lots of damage. I'd make sure to use abatthor, blood rock cave, and shrine of slaughter to get max crits. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10425 Posts
United States
| | 05/30/2005 10:05 AM |
| What the heck, I'll chime in.
Lareth 1 (Sorry about the lack of creativity)
Lareth the Beautiful
Red Samurai
Ogre Ravager
Orc Druid
Drow Sergeant
Orc Savage
Orc Warrior x6
This is a 2.5-fecta since the Orc Druid supplements either the Samurai or the Ravager and isn't really the "tri" in a trifecta. The Drow Sarge is for the extra damage for all the Warriors, but I suppose I could pull him out and re-arrange the lower-costed minis for another build.
Lareth's Eye
Lareth the Beautiful
Eye of Gruumsh
Orc Champion x2
Orc Warrior x8
This band has some nice synergies. An Orc Warrior doing 35 damage is a frightening thing!
Regarding the 12-figure versus 11-figure issue: I've found that 12 figures is better. Sure, you have the same number of phases on round 1, but if you lose even a single piece that round, now you only have 5 phases for the 2nd round, and that, coupled with a low initiative roll, can really alter your game.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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