Aravis
Underboss
1155 Posts
    
 | | 08/05/2005 5:40 PM |
| | recovered topic 6995 | |
Welcome to Eternal Crack...
"Corn is no place for a mighty warrior!"
Champion of the Frost Salamander | |
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Aravis
Underboss
1155 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 5:40 PM |
| | Well we did get the Archmage....but I agree the Elf Swash REALLY should have done a base of 10 dmg ATLEAST..oh well. | |
Welcome to Eternal Crack...
"Corn is no place for a mighty warrior!"
Champion of the Frost Salamander | |
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slayer1
Sergeant
597 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 5:50 PM |
| | My personal opinion is that CG got some good stuff in AN. The archmage, xeph warrior, and wild elf raider are all good skirmish pieces. The djinni is better than it first appears to be. Talenta halflings are really ugly, but useful in some bands. | |
Har 25/80 De 35/60 Ar 43/60 GoL 61/72 Ab 42/60 Dk 43/60 Af 51/60 Ud 49/60 WD 50/60 | |
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IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 5:59 PM |
| The swashbuckler won me a game in sealed all by himself, I think he's a great piece in that format. He's great for hunting down and killing your opponent's tile grabbers without much danger to himself or need to keep him in command.
Without the speed 2 rule he's a lot less interesting even in sealed though. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 6:28 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by slayer1
My personal opinion is that CG got some good stuff in AN. The archmage, xeph warrior, and wild elf raider are all good skirmish pieces. The djinni is better than it first appears to be. Talenta halflings are really ugly, but useful in some bands.
Definitely, the Xeph is a wonderful peice. A 3 point guy with speed 8 who can possibly do 10 damage. He's no Orc Warrior but he blows that little gnome out of the water and since fodder is so important in a warband, it makes the addition of him huge. Think about a CE without orc warriors where you were forced to use Gnolls as fodder. That would totally blow. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
11730 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 08/05/2005 7:06 PM |
| Sharn,
I think part of the problem is chaotic good was helped very much by the Aberrations set. The Crow Shaman, the HEBI, and of course the Frenzied Berserker are all very good for skirmish. Don't count out the Goliath Barbarian when used with the Inspiring Marshal, that reroll of his almost ensures that you'll get your money's worth. So, yes I agree that CG didn't get as much help this time around, but they already had a top-tier warband - and the Xeph Warrior is certainly better than the Gnome Recruit. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
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NightMoor
Sergeant
448 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 7:14 PM |
| Whoa, you gotta be kidding, Sharn.
Chaotic Good has gotten the lion's share of good stuff ever since Aberrations came out, so by "just" getting three or four top-level pieces in Angelfire they're doing plenty well enough.
Aberrations saw the rise of CG to the top level of play, able to compete with CE hitter armies - something that no faction had been able to even attempt until then except for the trusty LSD army.
Deathknell saw CG gain one of the most efficient hitters in the game, the Goliath Barbarian, an outstanding commander (Greenfang Druid), a tech-worthy beatstick and buddy for Drizzt (Rask), and some very impressive and useful tech units (Centaur, Dark Traveller, Renegade Warlock).
It's about time CG took a bit of a back seat in a set, in fact. I'm very happy that the Lawful factions finally got the biggest boost in a set. | |
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Zardnaar
Sergeant
522 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 7:26 PM |
| CG is perhaps the best faction now. Since aberrations they've got alot of nice minis.
Cleric of Corelion Larethian
Greycloak Rangers
Inspiring Marshall
Elf Pyromancer
Ryld Argith
Frenzied Berzerker
Half Elf Bow Initiate
crow Shaman
Goliath Barbarian
Green Fang Druid
Rask Half Orc Chainfighter
Dire Bear w/GFD
Renegdae Warlock
Xeph Warrior
Wild Elf Raider
Archmage
And perhapds not as useful as the others but still playable
Longstrider Ranger
Wand Expert
Renegade Warlock
Drizzt Drow Ranger.
Damn I hate CG. Such a crap faction.
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Trades: dj-chuckles (complete)
Sales: Kestral.ca
Bad Trade: Chaotic Good | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 7:35 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Zardnaar
CG is perhaps the best faction now. Since aberrations they've got alot of nice minis.
Cleric of Corelion Larethian
Greycloak Rangers
Inspiring Marshall
Elf Pyromancer
Ryld Argith
Frenzied Berzerker
Half Elf Bow Initiate
crow Shaman
Goliath Barbarian
Green Fang Druid
Rask Half Orc Chainfighter
Dire Bear w/GFD
Renegdae Warlock
Xeph Warrior
Wild Elf Raider
Archmage
And perhapds not as useful as the others but still playable
Longstrider Ranger
Wand Expert
Renegade Warlock
Drizzt Drow Ranger.
Damn I hate CG. Such a crap faction.
Don't forget Elf Warriors, they are a steal for 4 points. Especially, when paired with a commander who gives them a ranged to hit bonus. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 7:53 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Sharn Inquisitor
Wand Expert. 25 hit points. Two blurs, two magic weapons, nice utility overall...but one good breath weapon, or area of effect and you're out 33 wussy points.
He is a wizard! do you expect him to have 40+ hp? | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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nycfarmkid
Underboss
1210 Posts
Wadsworth, OH
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Frost-Bitten
Sergeant
677 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 9:46 PM |
| WOOt down with CG...ive dispised CG ever since i paid 20 bucks for 3 greycloaks and now im selling them back on ebay so i dont have to look at them (and to help pay for the Large silver army i got :P), Well i guess i dislike greycloaks more then CG itself
DOWN WITH GREYCLOAKS... (insert evil laughter) | |
PS. This is what the alphabet would look like if Q and R were removed
hardinjmm:
Frost-Bitten, there's more to life (and DDM) than LG!
Frost-Bitten:
More to life than LG... that is like saying there is more to Lucky Charms than the marshmallows!!!!!!!! | |
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Dr.Cornelius
Warrior
338 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 10:38 PM |
| Actually, the worst thing to happen to CG in Angelfire is...
Justice Archon
JA just wrecks Berserkers & Goliaths. | |
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slayer1
Sergeant
597 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 10:52 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Dr.Cornelius
Actually, the worst thing to happen to CG in Angelfire is...
Justice Archon
JA just wrecks Berserkers & Goliaths.
I tend to think that the justice archon and frenzied berserker are on equal footing, though this is still bad for CG since two berserkers cost as much as three justice archons and two men at arms. Jeeze, I wonder who would win that fight?[)] | |
Har 25/80 De 35/60 Ar 43/60 GoL 61/72 Ab 42/60 Dk 43/60 Af 51/60 Ud 49/60 WD 50/60 | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 11:44 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by slayer1
quote:
Originally posted by Dr.Cornelius
Actually, the worst thing to happen to CG in Angelfire is...
Justice Archon
JA just wrecks Berserkers & Goliaths.
I tend to think that the justice archon and frenzied berserker are on equal footing, though this is still bad for CG since two berserkers cost as much as three justice archons and two men at arms. Jeeze, I wonder who would win that fight?[)]
The Beserkers can easily take out the justic archons with a well placed grant move. But it does suck for the FB that they could miss the Justice. He won't be missing them very often. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 11:45 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Frost-Bitten
WOOt down with CG...ive dispised CG ever since i paid 20 bucks for 3 greycloaks and now im selling them back on ebay so i dont have to look at them (and to help pay for the Large silver army i got :P), Well i guess i dislike greycloaks more then CG itself
DOWN WITH GREYCLOAKS... (insert evil laughter)
GrayCloaks are still one of the best figures in the game.
DOWN WITH DR =0) | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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Frost-Bitten
Sergeant
677 Posts
| | 08/05/2005 11:55 PM |
| 4 elf warriors will replace a graycloak anyday...muwahahah...no wait...ill top you one...
LONG LIVE THE WILD ELF BARBARIAN (the pwnzer of the Greycloack) | |
PS. This is what the alphabet would look like if Q and R were removed
hardinjmm:
Frost-Bitten, there's more to life (and DDM) than LG!
Frost-Bitten:
More to life than LG... that is like saying there is more to Lucky Charms than the marshmallows!!!!!!!! | |
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 12:42 AM |
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Wild Elf Raider can be quite amazing and he cost only 6pts.True that CG did not get any really good stuff from Anglefire in the rare slot but they got some pretty cold commons and uncommons like wand expert and thorn.
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"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
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johnny.quest
Underboss
1364 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 1:08 AM |
| | JAs are vulnerable to commander assassination as well. | | | |
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Fun Guy from Yuggoth
Cthulhufnord
Warlord
10994 Posts
Umass Amherst Baby!
| | 08/06/2005 1:14 AM |
| | Just picked up the Copper Dragon today. His skirmish stats don't seem too impresive realy. Although I am amused they gave him a special ability from the SWM game. | |
Pathetic Earthlings. Hurling your bodies out into the void - without the slightest inkling of who or what is out here. If you had known anything about the true nature of the universe - anything at all - you would have hidden from it in terror. | |
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Thrace
Sneak
51 Posts
West Chester, Ohio
| | 08/06/2005 2:57 AM |
| | I dunno dude, loosing a bite save to a Thri-kreen barbarian who just gma'd straight to your colon, would definately suck. | |
Let's make a thread about it. | |
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DDM Australian Champion 2005
psistef
Underboss
1572 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 5:25 AM |
| CG got good stuff.
Jesus. One set where lawful factions get a decent share, and people aren't happy.
Play CG v LE post Angelfire - CG still got a damn good chance. | |
Champion of the Prestige Class where mages focus on telekenesis and start throwing people into the ceiling and uber stuff like that.
Desirer of a Commander Effect in CG that grants Sidestep to followers with a ranged attack. | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 7:20 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by psistef
CG got good stuff.
Jesus. One set where lawful factions get a decent share, and people aren't happy.
Play CG v LE post Angelfire - CG still got a damn good chance.
I totally agree, I am so tired of people whining that CE also got screwed this set. Which I think was way past due. Every set has been good to CE all the way back to Harbinger. CG has also got a pretty good deal over the sets. People need to understand that different allignments will be highlighted in different sets. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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orcmonk220
Underboss
1608 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 7:29 AM |
| I think the best pieces for CG will always be found in Aberrations - I mean Frienzied Berserker, Crow Shaman, Valenar Commander and Bariaur Ranger (terrible underrated).
Angelfire was OK, but I agree with TheCloakedRanger - The Elf Swashbuckler should have done 10 base damage... He's a PIRATE, for ****'s sake, the most feared enemy on the Seven Seas. I pulled him out, thinking I'd get something good, and apart from acrobatic charge and independent, I'm deeply unimpressed.
By the way, has anyone noticed the amount of 21 points units in Angelfire?
And another thing......... | |
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 8:10 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Liquidburn
I totally agree, I am so tired of people whining that CE also got screwed this set. Which I think was way past due. Every set has been good to CE all the way back to Harbinger. CG has also got a pretty good deal over the sets. People need to understand that different allignments will be highlighted in different sets.
I second that, this set CE got Hezrou..... and he is quite a BEAST.
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"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10445 Posts
United States
| | 08/06/2005 10:04 AM |
| Sooner or later, one of the genius DDM players is going to figure out how to rampage all over other bands with the Longstrider Ranger, I just know it. Speed 12, plenty of hit points, excellent attack bonuses, are you kidding me?
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 10:25 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Vrecknidj
Sooner or later, one of the genius DDM players is going to figure out how to rampage all over other bands with the Longstrider Ranger, I just know it. Speed 12, plenty of hit points, excellent attack bonuses, are you kidding me?
Yeah, I've been trying to come up with a killer high-speed band with the Longstrider(s).
I was thinking something like this (I've never been much for ultra-high activations; adjust to taste):
Moon Elf Fighter
Thri-Kreen Barbarian
Longstrider Ranger
Goliath Barbarian
Axe Sister
Wild Elf Barbarian
Xeph Warrior
Of course, the Inspiring Marshal is an interesting option, to get your forces right up in there NOW. | |
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Battlemage
Warrior
214 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 4:49 PM |
| Two things I would like to add. CG didn't lose anything in the metagame. It can still do what it's always done with quick beaters. CE took a hit because it didn't really get much to aid it so it's strongest band is still quad orcs and people are now having an easier time beating them. Of course they are still powerful but when every other faction improves and they are left behind it almost levels the playing field.
I would not underrate the Wand Expert as you have. Constant free damage with a range of sight is nothing to overlook. We all learned that with Gauth. Though it's not as good as Gauth it's CG's closest counterpart.
I would also like to say that with the Xeph warrior you're no longer wasting points like you were with the gnome recruits. You can now get in there and get off ten damage.
Tournaments are coming soon, it will be interesting to see what happens.
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http://www.theminiaturepage.net
"If at first you don't succeed, sky diving probably isn't for you." | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 6:30 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Vrecknidj
Sooner or later, one of the genius DDM players is going to figure out how to rampage all over other bands with the Longstrider Ranger, I just know it. Speed 12, plenty of hit points, excellent attack bonuses, are you kidding me?
Dave
Not sure if that will actually come to pass, but the guy certainly is frickin' fast. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10445 Posts
United States
| | 08/06/2005 6:52 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kithmaker
Yeah, I've been trying to come up with a killer high-speed band with the Longstrider(s).
I was thinking something like this (I've never been much for ultra-high activations; adjust to taste):
Moon Elf Fighter
Thri-Kreen Barbarian
Longstrider Ranger
Goliath Barbarian
Axe Sister
Wild Elf Barbarian
Xeph Warrior
Of course, the Inspiring Marshal is an interesting option, to get your forces right up in there NOW.
The MEF is tough enough, costly, but tough enough. I've seen the Thri-Kreen in action too (at least in Limited). Sure, he's not a FB, but that's okay. Just because Inspired Frenzy has done well doesn't mean other CG bands won't be able to compete--it's just a matter of time before someone puts together another one.
And, honestly, I'm thinking we're going to see more and more "spoiler" bands being viable, and over time, the Rock-Paper-Scissors aspect of the game will continue to heat up, making good players more important than good bands (not that good bands won't be important). But, I get the feeling that as we get more and more pieces and sets, there will be more and more ways to win.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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Korhal_IV
Sergeant
852 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 9:05 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Battlemage
I would not underrate the Wand Expert as you have. Constant free damage with a range of sight is nothing to overlook. We all learned that with Gauth. Though it's not as good as Gauth it's CG's closest counterpart.
The Gauth wasn't exactly boosting LE into Tier 1 either, though. And unlike the Gauth, the Wand Expert only does 10 and doesn't have the secondary ray until you're so close it's probably game over.
Finally, the Gauth didn't have to compete with Greycloak Rangers. GCRs give you the possibility of double damage, and bring four activations to the table. | |
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 08/06/2005 10:01 PM |
|
quote:
Originally posted by Korhal_IV
The Gauth wasn't exactly boosting LE into Tier 1 either, though. And unlike the Gauth, the Wand Expert only does 10 and doesn't have the secondary ray until you're so close it's probably game over.
Sad but true that gauth had not reaqlly boost any LE bands into tier 1 but every competivie LE bands will at least contain 1 gauth to make them better. | |
"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
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delguidance
Sergeant
394 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 2:33 AM |
| | I'm going to say that the most intelligent and strategic players I know enjoy CG. They can really finesse all those magic users and lines of sight, but they get hurt by 1 hour time limits. | |
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Korhal_IV
Sergeant
852 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 3:48 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Goldmoon
Sad but true that gauth had not reaqlly boost any LE bands into tier 1 but every competivie LE bands will at least contain 1 gauth to make them better.
Arguable. I'd take an Efreet over a Gauth every time, because the Efreet does something important that the Gauth doesn't - he provides you with a Fire Immune creature of your own. Important, especially on Fane of the Drow where everybody and his mother is packing a Fireball.
Delguidance - having recently switched to CG as my faction de jour, I say thank you. :D | |
I now have a Have/Want list updated with all my rares! Stop by to take a look!
Trade References: www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8560 | |
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Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 12:35 PM |
|
[/quote]
I second that, this set CE got Hezrou..... and he is quite a BEAST.
[/quote]
The Hezrou is perfect to stop anyone from trying to assassinate your comamder too. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
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DDM Australian Champion 2005
psistef
Underboss
1572 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 8:02 PM |
| The Longstrider is intriging. He's so fast, and I know that's powerful, but I don't know what to do with it yet!
Gauth and Efreeti are two DIFFERENT creatures! *ahem* sorry.
I like the Wand Expert. Good auto damage, probably one turn of 25 damage. If he's based and you aren't done with him, you aren't using him properly. | |
Champion of the Prestige Class where mages focus on telekenesis and start throwing people into the ceiling and uber stuff like that.
Desirer of a Commander Effect in CG that grants Sidestep to followers with a ranged attack. | |
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kbales
Warrior
296 Posts
Edmonton, Alberta
| | 08/07/2005 8:07 PM |
| | I wanted the swahbuckler to be my pc in our regular dnd game, but the mini was somehow a let down for me (visually)...oh well, I guess I can paint one myself. | |
- Free DDM and DBM Excel Warband Generator available here
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slayer1
Sergeant
597 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 8:37 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by psistef
The Longstrider is intriging. He's so fast, and I know that's powerful, but I don't know what to do with it yet!
The longstrider is female. | |
Har 25/80 De 35/60 Ar 43/60 GoL 61/72 Ab 42/60 Dk 43/60 Af 51/60 Ud 49/60 WD 50/60 | |
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Dr.Cornelius
Warrior
338 Posts
| | 08/07/2005 8:46 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Vrecknidj
Sooner or later, one of the genius DDM players is going to figure out how to rampage all over other bands with the Longstrider Ranger, I just know it. Speed 12, plenty of hit points, excellent attack bonuses, are you kidding me?
Don't be fooled by the Longstrider Ranger's speed and toughness. For 34 points it just doesn't hit hard enough to be a factor. CG has many, many better choices:
Celestial Pegasus (32 points): F10 speed is effectively faster than 12 on the ground, and has a better chance to base a squishy. Both take a morale check at 40 damage and CP's attack bonus is only 2 less than the Longstrider. But CP is more survivable with DR 5, Spell Resistance and Resist 10 Acid, Cold & Electricity. Most importantly the CP has []Smite Evil +10. The extra 10 damage is far more useful than the Longstrider's Death Strike.
Goliath Barbarian + Xeph (34 points): Goliath is slower than the Longstrider, but no slouch. At speed 8 GMA will get the Goliath where he needs to go. The Goliath's +10/+5 attack is nearly as good as the Longstrider's +13/+13 when you factor in the Reroll, especially on the all-important first attack. But the Goliath's 20 damage puts it over the top. Goliath can dish out 40 damage a round against lightly armored chaotics, but Longstrider maxes out at 20 damage.
Or my favorite:
Wild Elf Raider x6 + Xeph (33 points): The WERs have 90 fearless HP and move speed 9. The attack is only +5 (10) vs the Longstrider's +13 (10m) but you get at least four more swings, with chances for flanking & criticals. Six Wild Elf Raiders are at least as effective at headhunting but are much more versatile at screening, egging and fodder-clearing. | |
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Kypdurron
Underboss
1206 Posts
Broken Hill
| | 08/07/2005 9:28 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Vrecknidj
Sooner or later, one of the genius DDM players is going to figure out how to rampage all over other bands with the Longstrider Ranger, I just know it. Speed 12, plenty of hit points, excellent attack bonuses, are you kidding me?
Dave
I agree i think this guy is a real sleeper of the set and is going to turn up in quite a few tier 1 bands | |
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