Vrecknidj
Warlord
10445 Posts
    
United States
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10445 Posts
United States
| | 11/09/2005 6:44 PM |
| Wow, I wish I had the time to play on all the maps. I think I've played on two so far. I can't say anything about my own favorites, or which I think will be best with the kinds of bands I hope to play. I can say that I like maps, but find them far less easy to transport than tiles were.
I'd like to see people rank not only their favorite maps, btu which maps they prefer with which kinds of bands.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 11/09/2005 6:53 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Vrecknidj
...I can say that I like maps, but find them far less easy to transport than tiles were.
I'd like to see people rank not only their favorite maps, btu which maps they prefer with which kinds of bands.
I find it easier to transport maps, actually. One poster (2' long, 2" wide) from staples holds all 5 battle maps pages and my tiles battle mat. It is less cumbersome than the padded cardboard box that has to hold the various sized tiles securely to prevent them from getting beaten up in transit.
As for posting which warbands work with each maps ... feel free, but I would ask that disagreements about how useful a particular band is on a given map be taken to another thread ... I'm hoping this thread can tell us which maps are going to be popular in use. | |
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Chairman7w
Sergeant
484 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 6:59 PM |
| Haven't been fortunate to have played on all of them yet, but I can say after playing Magma Keep and Drow Enclave, that I LOVE playing on maps as opposed to tiles!
I am so happy to not deal with the tiles. It wasn't a huge deal in itself, but compared to using a map, it seems way tedious.
I can't wait to see what future maps they come out with. Outdoor stuff, with walls, shrubs, wagons, etc. Can't wait! | |
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XenoZephyr
Underboss
1083 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 8:09 PM |
| Fane of Lolth: ** I've played on it a couple of times but I think it's just not for me. I've generally made a major goof up each time I've played on that map. With all of the little rooms and walls it seems not that very open...but when my Beholder got turned into a statue on Round one from my opponents Beholder I realized it was a lot more open than I thought!
Mithral Mines: ****** I love this map! I think a lot of the maps will be more suited to the Players rather than the warbands. I've used this map with a couple of different warbands and I really like it.
Drow Outpost: ***** I love this map as well. I like the fight for the middle. I like that there are only 3 victory areas. And the pits are cool too.
Haven't played on the others enough (once or never) to rate them. | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 8:18 PM |
| | Mines, Outpost are both *****, and I think the Mushroom Caves is at least a **** as its got some great spots for traffic control and has a lot of potential for flyers/JA bands etc. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Kithmaker
Commander
3926 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 10:24 PM |
| | I think that I would like to SEE any of the maps. Then, I think owning some or all of them would be nice. But, since I can't get a hold of any, I think it sucks. | |
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Aesnath
Underboss
1358 Posts
Augusta, GA
| | 11/09/2005 11:44 PM |
| | I think the Drow Outpost is my favorite thus far. It really makes you think twice about those two ogre ravagers. | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 12:31 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Aesnath
I think the Drow Outpost is my favorite thus far. It really makes you think twice about those two ogre ravagers.
Well in certain spots they can reach over the pits, that is pretty nice at times. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Knight of the
Round Table
Thenameless
Warlord
11730 Posts
The Fortress of Solitude
| | 11/10/2005 1:02 AM |
| | Of the four maps in Fantastic Locations, only Mithral Mines provides ample starting cover against a fireball, and only on one side. The rest have way too much line of sight. It has changed the local metagame. | |
Over 270 successful online DDM trades. | |
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Krush
Commander
3851 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 1:15 AM |
| I would have to agree with thenameless. the Mithril Mines is an excellent choice for cover against the dreaded fireball if only on 1 side. I say that luck with the d20 would be helpful. [:P]
I do disagree that the other maps have too much LoS.
The Magma map is one example and great for figs with flight, then on the other hand I feel the Tomb of Queen Peregrine, even though suited for epic it would be difficult to guard against figs with ranged attack.
Just my 2 sense. [:D]
Opps almost forgot my fave map at the moment is....
The Drow Outpost *****
All others 3 1/2*** | |
Gehenna | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 1:18 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Thenameless
Of the four maps in Fantastic Locations, only Mithral Mines provides ample starting cover against a fireball, and only on one side. The rest have way too much line of sight. It has changed the local metagame.
Well the new Magma Keep from the second Fantastic Location blocks alot of first round fireball. As does the new epic with smoke that blocks LoS. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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robbdaman
Underboss
2380 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 2:12 AM |
| * Fane of Lolth (Championship Map) Basically few warbands use this map effectively and I hate it because of that fact.
** Tomb of Queen Peregrine (1st Epic Map, very blocky) Way too open, unless I want that I wouldn't use it.
**** Mithral Mines (Lots of walled areas) Probably my favorite just because it's open enough for a variety of warbands.
*** Drow Enclave (Summoning Circle) Great for flanking needs and easy to avoid the opponent through part of the map.
****** Drow Outpost (Dragon Magazine, battle at the bridge) Makes you fight in the middle and lessens VP likelyhood to ruin the fun. Very King of the Hill.
? Mushroom Cavern (Risky Terrain, Difficult Terrain) Haven't seen it up close yet.
***** Magma Keep (Keep with Lava Pits surrounding it) Really forces the game into one area. Again less likelyhood of VP to spoil a real game from happening.
? Hellspike (2nd epic map, Smoke) Can't comment until I play on it and we get smoke rulings.
R~ | |
Champion of the Titan
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 2:31 AM |
| quote:
? Hellspike (2nd epic map, Smoke) Can't comment until I play on it and we get smoke rulings.
R~
What rulings do we need on smoke? It states in the book that it blocks line of sight and creatures are treated as invisibile for everyone but non adjacent. Pretty self explanitory. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Pauper
Sergeant
508 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 3:19 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by AesophDarkfable
What rulings do we need on smoke?
Specifically, the interaction between Blindsight and smoke - can you use Blindsight to see through the smoke, or just into the smoke? (It's already obvious from the existing rules that a creature that gains Invisible from being in smoke isn't considered Invisible to a creature with Blindsight, since Blindsight ignores Invisible.)
I guess I'm the only person in this thread so far who doesn't like the Drow Outpost map - though I haven't seen many skirmishes on it yet, it seems clear that a warband with ranged+commander (Valenar/HEBI) or spellcasting+commander (Dark Naga/Gauth) options does far better to start on the Outpost side, which pretty much decides the game right there.
That, and I haven't yet found the urge to ask about the interaction between push-pull-slide and pits for non-flying creatures; the rules for pits state that only flying creatures can legally enter pit squares, so my gut feeling would be that it's not possible to slide a non-flyer into a pit, as that would be forcing that creature to make an illegal move (just as sliding it through a wall would be illegal).
--
Pauper | |
Champion of the War Wizard of Cormyr | |
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The Defenestrator
AesophDarkfable
Warlord
5628 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 3:46 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Pauper
quote:
Originally posted by AesophDarkfable
What rulings do we need on smoke?
Specifically, the interaction between Blindsight and smoke - can you use Blindsight to see through the smoke, or just into the smoke? (It's already obvious from the existing rules that a creature that gains Invisible from being in smoke isn't considered Invisible to a creature with Blindsight, since Blindsight ignores Invisible.)
I guess I'm the only person in this thread so far who doesn't like the Drow Outpost map - though I haven't seen many skirmishes on it yet, it seems clear that a warband with ranged+commander (Valenar/HEBI) or spellcasting+commander (Dark Naga/Gauth) options does far better to start on the Outpost side, which pretty much decides the game right there.
That, and I haven't yet found the urge to ask about the interaction between push-pull-slide and pits for non-flying creatures; the rules for pits state that only flying creatures can legally enter pit squares, so my gut feeling would be that it's not possible to slide a non-flyer into a pit, as that would be forcing that creature to make an illegal move (just as sliding it through a wall would be illegal).
--
Pauper
Thats what I thought at first as well, but it was pointed out to me that it blocks line of sight, blind sight doesnt do anything for blocked LOS. So Im guessing blindsight does nothing to the smoke. | |
Im out- find me on Hordelings if you want to chat. | |
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Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 7:36 AM |
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So far I managed some games on only 3 maps, so here my thought[:p]
**Tomb of Queen Peregrine; if Im playing range or sight spells, this is the one that I would use.
****Mithral Mines; quite a useful map, but not when Im playing slow LG/LE that had a large base creature, the tight corridor plus diffcult terrian gonna kill them if they are without flight.
***Drow Enclave; pretty open, much easy to move slow troops around.
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ickthegreat
Warrior
291 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 9:34 AM |
| Drow Outpost (Dragon Magazine, battle at the bridge)
This the only map I have used. But that is Fine by me, Cause I play mostly CG and always have some type of ranged attacker in my group | |
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everything is perfectly going out of control
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Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 11/10/2005 9:37 AM |
| They have already posted a clarification on sliding and pits-
You can slide a creature onto a pit. The victim must make a saving throw (I think it was DC 17) or fall in and be eliminated. If he saves then they move onto the nearest safe space. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
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Chad the DragonLordofAiur
Underboss
1085 Posts
Southeast PA
| | 11/10/2005 9:42 AM |
| I am very interested in a smoke ruling too.
Suppose a creature ends its move in a smoke square. Can it attack anyone within its melee reach? What about a large creature who is partially in smoke and partially out of smoke - does he have cover?
I want most to try out and play on the Drow Outpost, Hellspike, and the Mushroom Cavern maps. | |
Member of Team Amish
3rd Place in 2007 Constructed World Championship
My combined DDM Skirmish record of all games ever played in all formats.
486 - 188 - 4 | |
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Red Ranger
Sergeant
708 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 9:50 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Chad the DragonLordofAiur
They have already posted a clarification on sliding and pits-
You can slide a creature onto a pit. The victim must make a saving throw (I think it was DC 17) or fall in and be eliminated. If he saves then they move onto the nearest safe space.
Pretty sure that's DC 15 on the pit save. | |
Champion of the Yeti
(large uncommon please!)
Assistant to the Regional Manager | |
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Hero of Skirmish
doubtofbuddha
Commander
3371 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 10:00 AM |
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My rankings:
Fane of Lolth **
Tomb of Queen Peregrine ***
Mithral Mines *****
Drow Enclave ****
Drow Outpost *****
Mushroom Cavern *****
Magma Keep ****
Hellspike ****
At this point I have gotten most of my play in on the Fane of Lolth, Mithral Mines, Drow Enclave, Mushroom Cavern and Drow Outpost maps. I see a few maps that are useful for a particular type of warband, and I think map selection will come down to personal preference a lot of the time. | |
I am not gone. | |
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sienar
Sergeant
640 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 12:06 PM |
| I have played on these two so far:
***Fane of Lolth (Championship Map)
****Drow Enclave (Summoning Circle)
I think the big thing keeping people away from Fane is that we burned out on it. I still think it is a viable map. People are just tired of it. The Drow Enclave was a great one, and may be closer to a *****... Fast warbands can really hide and lash out. You also have the ability to hole up and protect a Beholder/Gauth/archer back line if you want to.
On Smoke, we know Shoe and Guy are working out a ruling. I expect that Blindsight will allow you to 'see' through the smoke. As it stands, you need to rule that it can't. We have two rules - Block LOS, not LOEffect and Invisibility. As the wording is now, you have to rule that Blindsight can't 'see' through the smoke, just into it. I expect that to change, otherwise we'd probably have seen a 'no' from Guy already. | |
[http://www.hordelings.com/frontend/profiles/profile.php?user_id=22] | |
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ktatroe
Sergeant
572 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 2:16 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by jgsugden
Rate each on the following scale as a skirmish map on a scale of 1 - 6 stars:
Fane of Lolth -- 4*
Tomb of Queen Peregrine -- 3*
Mithral Mines -- 6*
Drow Enclave -- 5*
Drow Outpost -- 3*
Mushroom Cavern -- 4*
Magma Keep -- 3*
Hellspike -- 6*
As others have noted, I've come to the conclusion that the maps are all pretty equal once you discover the right kind of warband for them, and that which maps you like will come down to personal preference -- both in your strategy (the kind of warband you bring to the table) and in your tactics (the way you play that warband on the board).
Hellspike Grotto and Mithral Mines are definitely far and above my favorites, even if Hellspike's art is less cool than some of the others (sorry, Jason, they can't all be my favorite, art-wise!).
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H/W: http://www.hordelings.com/frontend/profiles/profile.php?user=ktatroe | |
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ktatroe
Sergeant
572 Posts
| | 11/10/2005 2:26 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by sienar
I think the big thing keeping people away from Fane is that we burned out on it.
Actually, I stay away from Fane because all the people around here who are already better than me (hi Memphisto, Felagund, you) know that map like the back of your hand after practicing for and then going to the Championships. No way I can out tactics y'all on it. [:)] | |
H/W: http://www.hordelings.com/frontend/profiles/profile.php?user=ktatroe | |
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jgsugden
Commander
4320 Posts
Walnut Creek, CA
| | 11/22/2005 4:33 PM |
| Anyone change their opinions? Anyone else have an opinion?
My adjusted rankings:
Fane of Lolth 2*s
Tomb of Queen Peregrine 3*s
Mithral Mines 4*s
Drow Enclave 3*s
Drow Outpost 5*s
Mushroom Cavern 4*s
Magma Keep 4*s
Hellspike (reserving judgment until we see the smoke rule) | |
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Orion72
Underboss
1917 Posts
| | 11/22/2005 4:54 PM |
| Lost Temple?
Unfortunately I haven't had the chance to play on any of the maps yet. | | | |
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Zoons
Underboss
1066 Posts
| | 11/22/2005 5:22 PM |
| Haven't competed on the maps yet, only played for fun. It looks like I'd be inclined for battle of the bridge (Drow Outpost) play. I think I'd want to be on the side of the outpost.
I think the Summoning circle will be a great map once the new line of "fixed" druids and summoners come out. I don't think these creatures who get better with a beastmaster are anything but a harbinger (pun intended) of things to come. | |
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BudLeiser
Warrior
218 Posts
| | 11/23/2005 12:07 AM |
| I only have Lost Temple, Fane of Lloth and Magma Keep. I like Fane of Lloth over Magma Keep but everyone seems the reverse.
I wonder where my map (Dwarven Hall) would rank on this. | |
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orcdoubleax
Sergeant
694 Posts
| | 11/23/2005 4:57 AM |
| One thing I would like to say about the maps is that I am now using top loaders. The maps lie flat in them are well protected. It also is very good to write on so I can modify the mays for RPG. Most of the maps are too open for RPG so I can use a dry erase to block passages, add doors, extend pits etc.
My Take The Maps:
Fane of Lolth (Championship Map)**** Can be place directly into a campaign as a temple; Skrimish ** bah
Tomb of Queen Peregrine (1st Epic Map, very blocky)*** doesn't look quite as tempe like as the fane, but open areas are good if the party is fighting huge foe (dragons); Skirmish **** best choice for epic until smoke is understood
Mithral Mines (Lots of walled areas)**** one of the Best looking map for a dungeon crawl. Need a few of the passage blocked, but very good for variety of incounters; Skirmish *** Can punish you opp if he has too many large bases. Fits my stlye of play very well.
Drow Enclave (Summoning Circle)*** Like the tomb map it is ok, but not great; Skirmish ** don't really like it and can't imagine using the summoning circle.
Drow Outpost (Dragon Magazine, battle at the bridge)****** My favorite map. The chock poit can be used for lot of great encounters;
Skirmish ***** Big ass slugfest at the bridge. great if you have a IG band with some sort of range back up. Great map for rakasha or beholder. Also make the coutal undenaiable gravity a much better spell.
Mushroom Cavern (Risky Terrain, Difficult Terrain)**** Use like the mithral caves or with the mithral cave for large exploration area. Skirmish *** Suit very specific bands. Have never went to the bottom half of the map.
Magma Keep (Keep with Lava Pits surrounding it)*** Nice but too specific; Skirmish ** Also kind of specific. only played on it once but everything was just straight up the middle.
Hellspike (2nd epic map, Smoke)**** Like it for demon or dragon encounters can have large bad guys appear from the smoke. Skirmish ?? How does smoke work again?
Lost Temple ** Only good for a big dragon encounter. Don't really like it for that. Skirmish?? Is it legal any more?
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