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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10446 Posts
    
United States
 | | 03/22/2006 10:10 AM |
| What do you think? Depending upon what you play, and where the fight takes place, your followers will have the choice of either taking one step and doing a Whirlwind, or taking two steps and still getting their full attacks.
I see potential here. The problem, of course, is that the Brass Samurai might not last long enough in epic play to make it work. The DTH, especially the epic one, can probably find a way to last.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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RRedlund
Sneak
54 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 10:29 AM |
| | Toss in some Aspect of Kords with Speed 10 and you can set up some good whirlwinds, sounds like a fun idea. | |
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frogrodeo
Sergeant
706 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 12:19 PM |
| RRedlund -By using the DTH though you would want creatures that have more than one attack, otherwise you would be wasting the DTH CFX. Creatures like Regular Kord/Rikka would not be a good fit. I could see using it with Epic Kord/Rikka, although my play style with manueverable pieces like that often means that I am not within 6 squares of my commanders.... limiting the usefullness of the CFX.
Dave - I'm trying to think of other good creatures to use this with in Epic matches, did you have any particluar units in mind?
I would think the following would be possibilities:
Epic Kord
Epic Rikka
FB
Wemic Barbarian
Warforged Barbarian
Gold Champion
other Dragons?
The one problem I see is the usually low attack value for the second attack, when the opportunity does come for the up to two step full attack. Against some of the ultra high Epic ACs, the low to hit on attacks after the first is really a detriment. In those cases it would be much better to have a crow shaman/couatl for snakes swiftness.... thats my 2 coppers.
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Champion of Remorhaz, and the Mighty Goblin Frog Riders | |
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EldritchSoul
Warrior
324 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 12:59 PM |
| | rask would be a good choice for whirlwinding bands, better, i think, than the FB | |
Champion of Dracotaur- Vindicated!
T32 | |
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frogrodeo
Sergeant
706 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 1:19 PM |
| | Good point on Rask, Eldritch (how did I miss that one!), with Melee Reach 2 and high to-hits on both attacks, Rask would fit into this role well. | |
Champion of Remorhaz, and the Mighty Goblin Frog Riders | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10446 Posts
United States
| | 03/22/2006 1:19 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by frogrodeo
Dave - I'm trying to think of other good creatures to use this with in Epic matches, did you have any particluar units in mind?
I would think the following would be possibilities:
Epic Kord
Epic Rikka
FB
Wemic Barbarian
Warforged Barbarian
Gold Champion
other Dragons?
The one problem I see is the usually low attack value for the second attack, when the opportunity does come for the up to two step full attack. Against some of the ultra high Epic ACs, the low to hit on attacks after the first is really a detriment. In those cases it would be much better to have a crow shaman/couatl for snakes swiftness.... thats my 2 coppers.
Yep, I'm thinking that the field is rather limited. Even so, the DTH's ability to take two steps before attacking isn't entirely useless if you have even a couple critters that can take two swings. The FB isn't as powerful in epic as it is in 200-point play, but, in epic it's a fairly cheap figure and so might be a nice piece for this.
Dave | |
Knowledge Arcana editor issues 5-9, Phoenix Lore Magazine editor, assistant editor for Rite Publishing;
My Trade Thread and My Reference Thread; Winner of WBC IV, IX and XIII; Rule #0: bshugg is always right! | |
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RRedlund
Sneak
54 Posts
| | 03/22/2006 9:52 PM |
| | I see what you mean, I was mostly just thinking of the whirlwind, but I see how the other commander effect wouldn't benefit them. | |
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Deoxy
Warrior
225 Posts
| | 03/23/2006 12:45 PM |
| | Unlss there has been errata, the wording of the Brass Sam makes it so that the "whirlwind" ability it gives doesn't work with melee reach. | |
No longer active on MaxMinis | |
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jedijon
Sergeant
474 Posts
| | 03/23/2006 12:49 PM |
| Doh! Oh, to not have the new rulebook in front of me.
I've come across multiple posts, and read in the new rulebook (which I can't download at work) that Whirlwind attacks work with the melee reach PRINTED ON your stat card.
Thus Rask is whirlwinding @ 2, BUT not the FB with a dark traveller. | |
*WoTC Delegate (Chicago)* :=: My Trade Thread :=:
DISPUTED TRADE WITH TREE DRUID!!!!!!!! | |
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lantern314
Sergeant
684 Posts
| | 03/23/2006 1:06 PM |
| It seems like you are putting in a lot of points for contingencies. You've got the Samurai in case you end up in a situation where whirlwind would help, and the DTH in case you end up in a situation where multiple attacks would help. I think that unless you are committed to a figure with only one attack the DTH is going to be a better choice in 500 pt where you know that your big hitters will have multiples attacks. This is for several reasons,
1. In epic things will be pretty crowded. There will be large or huge based creatures filling up the hallways so the chances that you end up based by three or more figures aren't really high. You can also make it lower with how you deploy your forces.
2. You probably won't be based by multiple things that require the high base attack of your first swing to hit. There will likely be something that can be hit with your lower second swing.
3. The DTH allows you to concentrate you multiple swings on a single serious threat if you need to. I think that you will find this handy.
4. You get an extra space of movement for some flexibility. This can let you stage outside of your enemies reach, take two steps in and still swing for lots.
I don't think that the Brass Samurai adds to this much. You could choose to include it for fodder killing and its breath weapon, which is fine, or you could upgrade a second hitter.
I think a better question is regular Dragon Totem Hero or Epic Dragon Totem Hero in your warband. | |
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Gunthar
Commander
2938 Posts
| | 03/23/2006 1:44 PM |
| | The best use for both may be with the Huge Red. He gets swarmed, you whirlwind, otherwise, you step and swing with all three. | |
Champion of Prit(Wemic vindication is here)
Minneapolis/St. Paul area
Completed trades: Aspect of Cheese (Love that moniker), Tickparasite, Elderthing, Lalato, Sodj, Grimoire, SmilinIrish, Zeb, RWarehall,Link, wikkawikkawa, Auramancer, Rommers, HK, Ivid5,Qillan_dvra, Puggins, Arcabius, Ironfist Boulderbender, Robby, Corim Danex, monster_slayer, DNDJUNKIE, Kelemvor, Krush, ckissee, Massawyrm, hockey fan, Wish, Uninspiring Lieutenant, vtloon x2, Vrecknidj, Darthpoke, WakeXX, AnarionZell, lycusmike, papabear5 and umpteen local trades with board members
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Prince o the Raven Banner
Sergeant
606 Posts
| | 03/24/2006 12:16 AM |
| I've tried it, it's OK, not great but OK.
Brass Sam..............56 (56)
Dragon Totem Hero......58 (114)
Epic Rikka.............143 (257)
Aspect of Kord.........65 (322)
Centaur Hero...........78 (400)
Frenzied Berserker.....52 (452)
Xen'Drik Champion x 2..46 (498)
What I got out of It;
The FB gets alot of milage out of both commanders but wants reach, if I had a Rask I would've used him instead.
Epic Rikka benefits the most even w/o reach. Whirlwind is nice but the DTH CFX is brilliant when she is jumping enemies. I ran into a snarl with Whirlwind/Cleave combo (I'll ask in diff Thread).
(non-Epic) Kord LOVES Whirlwind. DTH CFX is wasted though. Aggresion is also wasted as I only won 2 inititives. Next go I'll use Epic Kord he should work better.
Centaur Hero likes DTH better than BSam the Combat Rush is excellent here but the Whirlwind is big when this guy gets swarmed ( which happens alot with a big base ). He Needs Reach.
Xen'Driks are just great fodder in Epic. They do more damage than they cost though in a Combat Rush. Though the 2nd attack is iffy.
The problem is that the 2 CFX exploit 2 different types of attacks. One single hard hitting attack with a good Hit Rate. The other a dual attack which usually means more moderate damage or hit rate. These 2 commanders were meant for 2 different types of troops. I'm not done testing though (I need a Rask).
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Two trades completed!! (Krush,Hides From Hurricanes)
Champion of the Aaracokra
Herald Of Snig Goblin King | |
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Tooninki
Warrior
272 Posts
Finland
| | 03/24/2006 3:54 AM |
| What about Storm giant + DTH/BS?
You have reach 3 and dmg 40. might work... | |
Life is...
Vindicated AtG shot: Shadow Giant (Death Titan)
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Low Key
Underboss
1231 Posts
| | 03/24/2006 4:48 AM |
| I'm tempted to try something like this:
Epic Aspect of Kord, 208p
Epic Rikka, Angelic Avenger, 143p
Dragon Totem Hero, 58p
Ryld Argith, 55p
Satyr, 15p
plus 21 points of various fodder. (Devis, Timber Wolf, Xeph, Wild Elfs, etc)
The Dual epics with those commanders will pack a nasty punch, especially if you win iniative. | |
Champion of the Sarrukh | |
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/24/2006 4:57 AM |
| quote:
I'm tempted to try something like this:
Epic Aspect of Kord, 208p
Epic Rikka, Angelic Avenger, 143p
Dragon Totem Hero, 58p
Ryld Argith, 55p
Satyr, 15p
plus 21 points of various fodder. (Devis, Timber Wolf, Xeph, Wild Elfs, etc)
The Dual epics with those commanders will pack a nasty punch, especially if you win iniative.
I don't know but isn't it better to use the GM and upgrade your fodder instead of the Dragon Totem Hero?
You get Full move and Full attack at the cost of 2x activations (one turn)instead of one activation with the Kord under command.
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My Haves and wants:
http://www.maxminis.com/hw_list.asp?user=Janos_M.
Champion of Elan Psions
Proud Owner of the "Aura of cursed dice" | |
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