iluvxtina
Underboss
1500 Posts
    
Spain
 | | 03/26/2006 5:04 AM |
| | When I play LE warbands I always add at least one chraal.I think Its one of the most powerful LE creatures.And I dont know why many people replace It with the duergar champion.I dont know what has the duergar that does not the chraal.Why?The large duergar is cheap,but the champion cost almost the same than the chraal.Why? | |
LOVE THIS GIRL | |
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Janos M.
Underboss
1015 Posts
Hamburg / GErmany
| | 03/26/2006 5:10 AM |
| I think most of them choose the DC over the Chraal because with low HP commanders often your opponent hunt the commander and ignores the chraal.
Another explantion is that the DC hit for 15 magic with better attack bonus then the CHraal does.
Sure it lacks the Breath Weapon but that doesn't matter when you hit more often... | |
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Wrackspawn
ChristopherGroves
Warlord
6093 Posts
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johnny.quest
Underboss
1360 Posts
| | 03/26/2006 9:45 AM |
| | If you have a sturdy commander and you're able to protect it, having one Chraal in your warband is pretty nice. The breath weapon and death burst can help you to control the opponent's movement. | | | |
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CTSparky
Sneak
128 Posts
| | 03/26/2006 10:14 AM |
| | For me the difference is minimal but I like the DC better. The DC level is better by 1, I don't have to put in a figure to cast magic weapon, He isn't tied to a commander, and with those 2 attacks I can often set up one cleave or if lucky 2. With a chrall I often have to worry about him routing off the board, many people by me play with couatl reducing the elemental damage, and his pluses to hit are lower. | |
I have yet to be Guyf'd. But I have been f'ed. | |
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djtool
Sergeant
584 Posts
Crystal MN, USA
| | 03/27/2006 11:06 AM |
| | i'd say it pretty much comes down to who your commander is and how much magic damage is already in your band before deciding between the two. | |
Champion of: Brain in a Jar | |
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bshugg
Underboss
1832 Posts
| | 03/27/2006 11:26 AM |
| I'm not a huge fan of the Duergar champ. He provides the least amount for his points of the LE 33-45 hitters. There are specific reasons to use him though. The "tie to commander" is the main reason he gets picked over the Chraal. Secondary is the desire for higher attack values. It comes at the cost of a much less sturdy figure with no cool "techy" abilities. In general I'm going to pick a chraal for the first slot, but Duergars after that. Theres too many good flying things that can get to even a sturdy commander.
I find it interesting that the figure that dominated the championships last year, is now often picked last behind 3 other similar costed hitters. Thats an amazing jump in quality for LE.
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Helzapoppn
Warrior
258 Posts
| | 03/27/2006 11:34 AM |
| I consider Cleave and Conceal 6 to be pretty cool and "techy."
The two points can make a difference when trying to make the most effective LE warband.
Chraals were great for clearing fodder -- but there's less of that than before, and the breath weapon save DC isn't as scary nowadays. | |
Champion of Iconics & the Apparatus of Kwalish (Constructs with Drivers? Brilliant!)
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Draygo
Skirmisher
4 Posts
| | 04/07/2006 11:13 PM |
| | Myself I would go chraal not just for cone effect but also Higher hp and death burst saved my but many a times not to mention hes a elemental with many hook ups | |
That's game.... | |
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True_Blue
Underboss
2386 Posts
| | 04/08/2006 12:23 AM |
| | I actually try to have one of each. Love the BW on the Chraal, but anymore I feel like the DC is better.. because of his to hit, 15 mgc dmg, and Cleave. Those things are really nice. But as I said, I try to have one of each. | |
Champion of a Knight of Takhisis/Knight of Neraka | |
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Wish
Sergeant
399 Posts
| | 04/08/2006 3:01 AM |
| Like some of the previous posters, I try to field both in my LE band. I love the chraal - it's got a large base, nice hp and AC. That makes it a good blocker. It's got a solid set of immunities and deathburst, both nice defensive features. It's fast, does decent damage, and has a great breath weapon. On the downside, it requires commander, has a tough time hitting lawful targets, and the damage is non-magical and part elemental. I also love the duergar champ. It's got a medium base, which can be more manueverable. It has a strong attack bonus and very consistent 15 magic damage. It cleaves. It has immunity to poison and paralysis, conceal 6, and a nice ac. Solid enough defenses for a hitter. On the downside, its speed is only average and with no ranged or area affect attack its threat range is smaller than many other competetive pieces.
If I had to pick just one of them, I would probably pick a DC, because its damage is slightly less matchup dependent, especially in light of some of the high AC and save hitters that have appeared since last championship season. | | | |
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Shadow_Fox
Underboss
1751 Posts
Litchfield, MN
| | 04/08/2006 7:22 AM |
| Chrall should usually be the better figure. There are several factors though that would warrant the inclusion of the DC instead of/in addition too Chralls.
Many of these factors exsist in the current metagame such as increased amounts of DR, elemental resistance, and units that can more easily assassinate commanders.
So in the end examine your local metagame and look for the chralls weaknesses. If they show up in large numbers it may be time to call in the duergar. | |
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XAos
Underboss
2395 Posts
London
| | 04/08/2006 10:40 AM |
| | Duagar champs have very poor matchups against the Tier-1 constructs. Both of which have Blindsight. So conceal:6 becomes a waste of points if you meet Marut/HH's. | |
Don't worry about the current metagame. It doesn't matter if it's ugly, bad, or the best ever. In 2 years time, set rotation will ban everything. | |
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GoblinSmiter619
Sneak
65 Posts
| | 04/08/2006 6:26 PM |
| | Depends on what you need and already have. If you're using a Snig the answer is obvious. With an average commander I usually play Chraal for defense and Duergar for offense. Sometimes one of each! | |
Champion of the Kobold Samurai | |
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CTSparky
Sneak
128 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 8:36 AM |
| Well last night it sealed the deal for me. I vote DC.
I played a band with 1 HH, 1 Dc, and 1 Chrall. I played against a Large Silver Dragon band, with sword of Heroneous, barbarian mercanaries, and men at arms. The chralls lack of a magic weapon and lower attack bonuses for sometimes less damage (read that as elemental damage) overshot the fact that it has a breath weapon, slightly higher ac (that you could negate when taking into effect the conceal roll of the DC) and higher speed.
In the future I will probably go with 2 DC's. The ability to reliably hit fot 15 damage is just too good to pass up. | |
I have yet to be Guyf'd. But I have been f'ed. | |
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Vrecknidj
Warlord
10429 Posts
United States
| | 04/09/2006 10:58 AM |
| Here are two cents I just found on the floor...
If the Duergar Champ fails a morale save, he's much more likely to be in a position where he can be rallied than if a Chraal fails its morale save. This is at least worthy of consideration.
That said, I prefer the Chraal.
That said, I'd prefer one of each to two of either, in the cases where any of those three options were roughly equally likely to be useful.
Dave | |
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elder_basilisk
Sergeant
410 Posts
| | 04/09/2006 10:48 PM |
| | I'd say it depends heavily on the metagame. Against Hill Giant Barbarians, Duergar champs don't perform particularly well. Chraals, on the other hand can go the distance with the giants. On the other hand, Duergar have better odds against coatl supported justice archons, etc. | |
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