Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
    
 | | 04/27/2005 5:39 PM |
| | recovered topic 2954 | |
Bite me. | |
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 5:39 PM |
| | Yeah, play in a real world... | |
Bite me. | |
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kyrin
Commander
3168 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 6:00 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Iksander
Yeah, play in a real world...
Ladeez and Gennlemin, a NEW record! For his next trick, Iksander will be typing in the insult to Eberron WHILE SOMEONE IS COMPOSING A POST ABOUT IT! The latest in Precognitive Flaming Technology, coming soon to a message board near you...
JIM
aka kyrin | |
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 6:02 PM |
| | Apparently, I have to be more specific. Any constructive advice is greatly appreciated. On a side note, Iksander as D&D by nature is a fantasy game, "play in a real world" is not only useless advice, but a ridiculous recommendation at it's core. If you refer to any of the D&D worlds you game in as "real" seek help. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 6:06 PM |
| | uh oh......here we go. I want a good clean match. No name calling or mother slapping. When the bell rings come out flaming. *DING* | |
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 6:39 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wynd of the North
Apparently, I have to be more specific. Any constructive advice is greatly appreciated. On a side note, Iksander as D&D by nature is a fantasy game, "play in a real world" is not only useless advice, but a ridiculous recommendation at it's core. If you refer to any of the D&D worlds you game in as "real" seek help.
I am the Chaos God! | |
Bite me. | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| |
Thoth, Gatherer of Knowledge
MerricB
Underboss
2353 Posts
Australia
| | 04/27/2005 7:18 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wynd of the North
I am working on my first ever Ebberon character. I want to run a Shifter (Wildhunt) Ranger big on Tracking.
For feats I want to stick to primarily the shifter feats, because I want to play him as pretty much a shifter purest. The
Tracking feat is a must, so I don't know what that leaves me with. The stats I have planned, after all racial mods are: STR:14 DEX:16 CON:14 INT:9 WIS:12 CHA:6 . Any recommendations on stats feats or skills would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. Wyl
First of all, it's Eberron, not Ebberon.
Second, Rangers get Track as a bonus feat at 1st level, so you won't need to buy that one.
A second level Shifter Ranger will have one feat available, and two bonus feats (Track and either Two-Weapon Fighting or Rapid Shot).
Yes, getting a Shifter feat would be the best option. Are you playing the Mark of Heroes game? If you are, there are restrictions on feat choice.
Do you have access to Races of Eberron?
Cheers! | |
Merric Blackman
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 8:13 PM |
| | Ah, didn't realize that I would get Track as a bonus feat. I am new to 3rd edition let alone 3.5. OK so I would probably go with Rapid Shot as the other bonus feat. I have access to Races of Eberron, but only limitedly so. Wild Hunt Elite would probably be one of my first picks and then another Shaper feat so that I can take the Additional Shaper Trait feat as well. I am trying to go for a very "I am the Hunter" feel. Thanks for the help Merric. I should have realized the Track thing Rangers have always gotten that for free. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Avatar of the Irrelevant
Diomedes
Commander
3173 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 8:42 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wynd of the North
Ah, didn't realize that I would get Track as a bonus feat. I am new to 3rd edition let alone 3.5. OK so I would probably go with Rapid Shot as the other bonus feat. I have access to Races of Eberron, but only limitedly so. Wild Hunt Elite would probably be one of my first picks and then another Shaper feat so that I can take the Additional Shaper Trait feat as well. I am trying to go for a very "I am the Hunter" feel. Thanks for the help Merric. I should have realized the Track thing Rangers have always gotten that for free.
If you are planning on using ranged attacks, I would like to /strongly/ recommend point blank shot followed by precise shot. Point blank shot is so so, you get extra damage if you're within 30' of your opponent (which you almost always are). However it's the prerequisite for precise shot (which is a must). You will frequently want to shoot at someone in melee combat which gives you a -4 penalty to hit. Precise shot negates that penalty.
I know that these aren't shifter feats, but they're really a must have if you're trying to use ranged attacks IMO.
Also, I think Eberron is a great setting, there's a lot of room for role playing and diplomacy. Of course every DM runs a game differently, but try to put some thought into your region and such as they can have some very real impacts on your game.
Also, divine magic is much more rare in Eberron, and as a ranger you will eventually get some divine magic. Make sure you play it up as it's a rarity and hence you should command a little more respect and carry more influence wherever you go.
Enjoy Eberron, I love it ;)
-Diomedes
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 9:30 PM |
| | Are Favored Souls available in Eberron? Because if I dual class I woud want to do like Ranger/Favored Soul of The Traveller | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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B
Underboss
1189 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 9:58 PM |
| Precise shot is something that I wish the other players in my group took more often. Our DM gives someone without the feat the option of taking the -4 penalty to prevent any chance of hitting an ally in melee, or not taking it and hoping that they hit. If they miss they have to make the attack again at the ally who is in melee. Usually me.
Player: I shoot at the guy that B is fighting
B: NO! Don't! I'm doing ok!
Player: I shoot anyway!
Dm: Are you going to take -4 to protect your ally?
Player: No! I'll miss if I do that!
Dm: ok.....roll the attack
Player:......I missed....
Dm: roll vs. B's AC
Player:.....um,...critical hit?
*WHACK*
(sound of one of B's D20's impacting other player's head)
I don't need enemies with the friends I have.
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Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.--Dylan Thomas
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 04/27/2005 10:24 PM |
| If you're going the shooty type, then Precise Shot is a must-have. Wildhunt is a lethal stream for a Shifter Ranger, and works well.
Pick up Extra Shifter Trait as soon as possible, and grab either Cliffwalk, Longstride or Beasthide. If you have access to Races of Eberron, then Dreamsight might not be a bad choice either.
More thoughts later, off to look it up. | |
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Thoth, Gatherer of Knowledge
MerricB
Underboss
2353 Posts
Australia
| | 04/28/2005 12:24 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wynd of the North
Are Favored Souls available in Eberron? Because if I dual class I woud want to do like Ranger/Favored Soul of The Traveller
Again I must ask: are you playing in a regular campaign or in the Mark of Heroes (RPGA) campaign?
If it's a homebrew campaign, then you need to ask your DM.
If it's the Mark of Heroes campaign run by the RPGA, there are restrictions.
Cheers!
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Merric Blackman
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Captain Harlock
Sergeant
450 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 12:33 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by kyrin
quote:
Originally posted by Iksander
Yeah, play in a real world...
Ladeez and Gennlemin, a NEW record! For his next trick, Iksander will be typing in the insult to Eberron WHILE SOMEONE IS COMPOSING A POST ABOUT IT! The latest in Precognitive Flaming Technology, coming soon to a message board near you...
JIM
aka kyrin
Come on, it took him a whole eleven minutes. Wait until he types the insult in in under 5 minutes before you think he is psycho....I mean psychic. :D
Dan Cooper | |
Dan Cooper
For there is surely nothing so beautiful than the sight of a lone man facing single-handedly half a ton of angry pot roast.
You will all go directly to your respective vahallas, Go directly, do not pass go do not collect two hundred dollars
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Hero of the Force
Siddartha of Suburbia
Underboss
2277 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 2:37 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by B
Precise shot is something that I wish the other players in my group took more often. Our DM gives someone without the feat the option of taking the -4 penalty to prevent any chance of hitting an ally in melee, or not taking it and hoping that they hit. If they miss they have to make the attack again at the ally who is in melee. Usually me.
Player: I shoot at the guy that B is fighting
B: NO! Don't! I'm doing ok!
Player: I shoot anyway!
Dm: Are you going to take -4 to protect your ally?
Player: No! I'll miss if I do that!
Dm: ok.....roll the attack
Player:......I missed....
Dm: roll vs. B's AC
Player:.....um,...critical hit?
*WHACK*
(sound of one of B's D20's impacting other player's head)
I don't need enemies with the friends I have.
In my own defense I've only done that once in recent memory, unlike some others....of course that once it was a ball of acid.[:D] | |
"We can't stop here...This Is Bat country!"
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Avatar of the Irrelevant
Diomedes
Commander
3173 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 2:54 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Siddartha of Suburbia
quote:
Originally posted by B
Precise shot is something that I wish the other players in my group took more often. Our DM gives someone without the feat the option of taking the -4 penalty to prevent any chance of hitting an ally in melee, or not taking it and hoping that they hit. If they miss they have to make the attack again at the ally who is in melee. Usually me.
Player: I shoot at the guy that B is fighting
B: NO! Don't! I'm doing ok!
Player: I shoot anyway!
Dm: Are you going to take -4 to protect your ally?
Player: No! I'll miss if I do that!
Dm: ok.....roll the attack
Player:......I missed....
Dm: roll vs. B's AC
Player:.....um,...critical hit?
*WHACK*
(sound of one of B's D20's impacting other player's head)
I don't need enemies with the friends I have.
In my own defense I've only done that once in recent memory, unlike some others....of course that once it was a ball of acid.[:D]
Which brings me to my next point, Spell Casters should take that feat too! ;)
-Diomedes | |
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 3:55 PM |
| | I have not heard any mention of Mark of Heroes so I don't think that is the campaign. I just thought favored soul would go really well with where I want to take the character. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Iksander
Underboss
1010 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 5:03 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Captain Harlock
Come on, it took him a whole eleven minutes. Wait until he types the insult in in under 5 minutes before you think he is psycho....I mean psychic. :D
I don't allow psionics in my world. But I do have Boots of Escaping! | |
Bite me. | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 8:24 PM |
| Right then, cool.
Favoured Soul may be good from an RP POV, but from a build and power perspective, its a terrible choice. The charisma penalty that Shifters have mean that you'll always be third rate.
That, and multiclassed spellcasters suck. There's no two ways about it. | |
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Kiirnodel
Sergeant
484 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 8:33 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Testament
Right then, cool.
Favoured Soul may be good from an RP POV, but from a build and power perspective, its a terrible choice. The charisma penalty that Shifters have mean that you'll always be third rate.
That, and multiclassed spellcasters suck. There's no two ways about it.
Way to min/max dude. [:(]
Why not do it? you'll be behind but you'll enjoy your character! My current group just makes sub-par (by min/maxers standards) characters and they have the kickassiest time ever, I can't imagine switching groups again, the plots better if you have a character you like over a character that can deal X damage in Y rounds.
I don't see whats TOO wrong with the ranger/favored soul, the MAD is not good, but I think it sounds fun. | |
Official Smiter of Min/Maxers and Powergamers. | |
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Hero of the Force
Siddartha of Suburbia
Underboss
2277 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 8:38 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kiirnodel
quote:
Originally posted by Testament
Right then, cool.
Favoured Soul may be good from an RP POV, but from a build and power perspective, its a terrible choice. The charisma penalty that Shifters have mean that you'll always be third rate.
That, and multiclassed spellcasters suck. There's no two ways about it.
Way to min/max dude. [:(]
Why not do it? you'll be behind but you'll enjoy your character! My current group just makes sub-par (by min/maxers standards) characters and they have the kickassiest time ever, I can't imagine switching groups again, the plots better if you have a character you like over a character that can deal X damage in Y rounds.
I don't see whats TOO wrong with the ranger/favored soul, the MAD is not good, but I think it sounds fun.
For a long time I was the king of lost causes, I played Paladins with charismas of eight, Monks with wisdom scores no better. it was always because it made sense for the characters to multiclass in that direction based on the direction their lives had taken. They were some of the most fun characters i have ever played (along with the 10th level fighter with 30ish hit points). And they were also amongst the longest lived characters in the party. Make what you enjoy, Karma will take care of the rest. | |
"We can't stop here...This Is Bat country!"
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 9:49 PM |
| Hey, I said it was terrible from a power POV. Relative power is the only objective test I can provide, since I don't know what sort of a game he's playing in, or what he's doing with said character in game. And I personally enjoy a game more when my character is useful, I don't know about anyone else.
Plus, I find that some level of powergaming is necessary to even survive when you only have 25 points to burn, and have two stat penalties like a shifter.
At any rate Kiirnodel, look at the stats he's got! Cha 6 means HE CAN NEVER CAST A SPELL as a Favoured Soul. It's a weak class for starters, a sub-optimal choice for a shifter, and all the RP in the world won't change the fact that they're totally wasted levels for this character. I believe in RPing, but don't expect me to ever use it as a basis to SHOOT MY CHARACTERS IN THE FOOT LIKE THAT! Min/Max nothing, this is just common-bleeding-sense. Why would you enter a spellcasting class when you lack the ability to ever cast?
Back on topic, the low mental stats mean that unless you have an absolutely iron-clad RP based reason to do so, multiclassing into a casting character is a VERY BAD choice. I'll need to have a good look at the PrC in question, but unless it requires you to multiclass, doing so on your way into a PrC is also a suboptimal choice.
And if you want me to powergame you on the way in, just give the word Wynd, I'll be seeing some friends today and tomorrow who are, quite frankly, powergame gods. The best thing is though, that their builds are still fun to play too. | |
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My Have/Want List, (Updated July 6 2004, will be updated soon)
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 10:06 PM |
| | Thanks for the info Testament. I don't want to power game too much but I too want to be useful. Favored soul was just a quirky after thought I will probably stick with straight Ranger anyway. The info on Reachrunner actually says that Ranger is the most direct path. I am probably going to end up bringing the Strength down to 12 enough to have a bonus but not overly muscley (is that a word?). I didn't realise that CHA was what I would be casting on. So here is the idea so far. Shifter (Wildhunt) Str:12 Dex:16 Con:14 Int:9 Wis:14 Cha:6 Feats: Track(Bonus) Rapid Shot(Ranger Fighting Style) Shifter Instincts Skills No definite numbers yet but mostly spent in Hide, Spot, Listen, and Climb | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 10:13 PM |
| Strength is still important to an archer if you want to be dealing the damage out to anything that isn't a favoured enemy.
I'll get back to this in the next couple of days with some potential builds. They won't be powergamed (powergamers don't build rangers!), but they'll be effective.
Building a shifter ranger is frelling hard. Not enough feats to go around! | |
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My Have/Want List, (Updated July 6 2004, will be updated soon)
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 10:17 PM |
| | Gain 50 cool points for the Farscape Reference. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Kiirnodel
Sergeant
484 Posts
| | 04/28/2005 10:24 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Testament
Strength is still important to an archer if you want to be dealing the damage out to anything that isn't a favoured enemy.
I'll get back to this in the next couple of days with some potential builds. They won't be powergamed (powergamers don't build rangers!), but they'll be effective.
Building a shifter ranger is frelling hard. Not enough feats to go around!
Ok ok.
Sorry I got hot headed up there dude, I've had powergaming ruin a campaign of mine and I jsut got reminded of it. Sorry about the harsh words.
Yeah Cha 6? I'd not do Favored Soul at all without at least 13 cha, so I'd suggest against that.
Shifter rangers? YEah, actually its a great idea, just I agree... they need a little more feats, let's see what you come up with! [:)] | |
Official Smiter of Min/Maxers and Powergamers. | |
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glauron
Underboss
1379 Posts
Sydney, Australia
| | 04/29/2005 1:27 AM |
| Eberron is the best campaign setting ever, don't listen to the critics. I prefer frack to frelling - Galactica rules.
I won't say what I think about min-maxing. I've mostly played vanilla characters. I've heard about those prestige classes and feats, but it's way too difficult for me. I just go along to have fun with my buddies, eat pizza and drink beer. A good day is when all our characters survive and there are plenty of laughs.
My advice - don't sweat the details, have fun. Eberron is a place of wierdness, enjoy it. | |
I have always been here. | |
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DDM Australian Champion 2005
psistef
Underboss
1572 Posts
| | 04/29/2005 5:55 AM |
| It's always good to have an effective character, but pick for fun most of all.
Because Sorceror/Barbarians rule! | |
Champion of the Prestige Class where mages focus on telekenesis and start throwing people into the ceiling and uber stuff like that.
Desirer of a Commander Effect in CG that grants Sidestep to followers with a ranged attack. | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 04/30/2005 9:36 PM |
| Right, I'm back and here's two potential builds. Only selected feats are shown, not ones that the class gives you.
1. Ranger Point Blank Shot
2. Ranger
3. Ranger Wildhunt Elite
4. Fighter Precise Shot
5. Fighter Weapon Focus
6. Fighter Shifter Instincts
7. Fighter Weapon Spec
8. Reachrunner
9. Reachrunner Extra Shifter Trait
The problem with this one is skill points, heaps of cross class buying of Survival. Hence this build
1. Ranger Point Blank Shot
2. Ranger
3. Ranger Wild Hunt Elite
4. Ranger
5. Fighter Precise Shot
6. Fighter Shifter Instincts & Weapon Focus
7. Reachrunner
What do you think? | |
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Satsujin Kingyo
Underboss
1247 Posts
| | 05/01/2005 7:44 AM |
| Well first of all, don't take ranger as your first class. Start with one level of Scout from CV, then take two levels of Ranger, then two of Barbarian, and then nothing but Ranger after that.
So at L20 you'll have-
Ranger 17/Barbarian 2/Scout 1
Which is a pretty good melee build. If you were going for ranged combat, take two fighter instead of two barbarian.
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Drumsticks can also be chicken. -Tardy Turtle | |
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 05/01/2005 3:54 PM |
| | Regardless of benefit I would never take pure Fighter levels with this character. That type of organized martial doesn't fit. I know there are different types of fighters but the only melee class this character would have anything to do with is Barbarian. I do not have access to the info on the Scout Class, and I don't understand what that is supposed to gain me. I think I have made my decision thank you all for the advice I will post later with the full complimant and plan of advancement. P.S. It is roll or point buy player's choice. YAY! Thanks again. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Wynd of the North
Warrior
310 Posts
| | 05/01/2005 10:16 PM |
| Alright here goes. I have decided to take his first 2 or 3
levels in Barbarian then advancing almost the rest of the
way in Ranger. I think the Rage ability fits in well with
this character's personal quest to become one with his feral beast ansestry
I rolled stats and did a little better than the point buy system.
*
Str:16
Dex:16_(14+2)
Con:15
Int:10_(12-2)
Wis:13
Cha:7__(9-2)
*
*
*His first shifter trait will be Razor Claw
*
* The First Feat I haven't decided on yet. I need to look
at the books again.
And the Skill set will be whatever I can apply towards
Reachrunner without incurring cross class penalty.
With this set up however I will probably be going with the
two weapon fighting style rather than archery. | |
Patience is a virtue and ignorance is bliss thus the world is full of stupid people waiting | |
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Testament
Underboss
1397 Posts
| | 05/02/2005 12:43 AM |
| POWER GAMING ALERT! If you don't like optimisation, then stop reading now.
If you're going the 2WF route then take Longtooth as your trait, then you can full attack with 2WF AND bite the enemy. Pick up Longtooth elite as a Shifter feat ASAP for 1 point of con damage each time you bite.
If you do want to be a Razorclaw though, then Great Rend and Razorclaw elite are a must. Charge, attack with both courtesy of Razorclaw elite and rend.
Either way, improved natural weapon is too good not to take, as is Shifter Frenzy (the rage based one in RoE). Getting your bite to near greatsword damage is insane. | |
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AngryIrish
Warrior
313 Posts
| | 05/02/2005 1:36 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Kiirnodel
quote:
Originally posted by Testament
Right then, cool.
Favoured Soul may be good from an RP POV, but from a build and power perspective, its a terrible choice. The charisma penalty that Shifters have mean that you'll always be third rate.
That, and multiclassed spellcasters suck. There's no two ways about it.
Way to min/max dude. [:(]
Why not do it? you'll be behind but you'll enjoy your character! My current group just makes sub-par (by min/maxers standards) characters and they have the kickassiest time ever, I can't imagine switching groups again, the plots better if you have a character you like over a character that can deal X damage in Y rounds.
I don't see whats TOO wrong with the ranger/favored soul, the MAD is not good, but I think it sounds fun.
Just wanted to jump in here and say that kickassiest is the the greatest word ever!!! | |
"I'm feelin pretty good today. I don't think anything could make me angry"
"The English"
"AAAAARRRRGGGGGG" | |
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