nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
    
Rhode Island
 | | 07/04/2005 7:23 PM |
| | recovered topic 5519 | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/04/2005 7:23 PM |
| | I'm not 100% sure what this is refering to. Is this a 3.x reference source? | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Dark Lord
Skirmisher
38 Posts
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/04/2005 7:52 PM |
| This isn't a Wizards of the Coast product is it? It sound like a third party supplement. Are you sure that the title you listed is the exact title?
Edit: As a knee jerk reaction, casting 9th level spells at 9th level sounds quite broken. But I'd be willing to read it all the way through before making a decision.
Edit II: Ok, I just googled it. Netbook produced by Fast Foward Entertainment. First off I own 2 products by FFE, I don't think either are very good. Maybe it's because I was expecting stellar material from James Ward. I bought the books on the weight of his name. I thought it great that some old school designers were able to play ball again. The grognards on the board will know what I mean, as will anyone whose done a cursory study of the history of the game. I don't buy netbooks because I don't own a computer. I can't comment anymore than to say this companies track record and my experience with their products tells me this is prolly waaaay broken. Who knows, not all their stuff is. Apologies to all FFE fans out there, you know what they say about opinions. | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
DDM Australian Champion 2005
psistef
Underboss
1572 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 12:16 AM |
| | I can't imagine what the downside of the class could be to possible warrant 9th level spells and 9th level. | |
Champion of the Prestige Class where mages focus on telekenesis and start throwing people into the ceiling and uber stuff like that.
Desirer of a Commander Effect in CG that grants Sidestep to followers with a ranged attack. | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 2:02 AM |
| | I think I read about this class... it has 1d4 - 10 HP per level and gets 0 skill points per level, but it gets 9th level spells at 9th level. It all balances out. Some of the prestige classes in the WoTC books are pretty broken already, but some of the other books are just plain crazy. | |
"Are you not entertained?" 
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Oni
Underboss
1131 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 2:47 AM |
| wow 1d4 -10 [:0]!!! You would have to multy with a Barbar just to keep you're head above the water!
If Malin Lug is right (never heard of Life Mage) I would say it is not worth it.
Multy classing for any HP would make that cast lvl 9 spell at lvl 9 just as hard to get as normal. Also if you get 0 skill there is not much you can do. Now just knowing those bads plus the lvl 9 spell trick I would say I would never play it. | |
"...don’t try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal."
- Zaphod Beeblebrox
Champion of the Nymph!
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/05/2005 7:23 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Malin Lug:
I think I read about this class... it has 1d4 - 10 HP per level and gets 0 skill points per level, but it gets 9th level spells at 9th level
That's just silly.
quote:
Originally posted by Oni:
wow 1d4 -10 !!! You would have to multy with a Barbar just to keep you're head above the water!
Pretty much a guaranteed 1hp per level, the minimum. I wonder what the rest of the spell progression is? | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 10:46 AM |
| | Ummm... I was joking. I have no idea what the offset of the class is. | |
"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Dark Lord
Skirmisher
38 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 12:28 PM |
| This might answer some of your questions:
The Life Mage
skill points: 2+Int mod [(2+Int mod)x4 at first level]
Hit Die: 1d4
Magic Points: 2+Con mod [(2+Con mod)x3 at first level]
Life Mage Spells Known
Level 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
1st 2 2 - - - - - - - -
2nd 2 2 1 - - - - - - -
3rd 3 2 1 1 - - - - - -
4th 3 2 1 1 1 - - - - -
5th 4 3 1 1 1 1 - - - -
6th 4 3 2 1 1 1 1 - - -
7th 5 3 2 1 1 1 1 1 - -
8th 5 3 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 -
9th 6 4 2 2 1 1 1 1 1 1
10th 6 4 3 2 2 1 1 1 1 1
11th 7 4 3 2 2 1 1 1 1 1
12th 7 4 3 2 2 2 1 1 1 1
13th 8 5 3 3 2 2 1 1 1 1
14th 8 5 4 3 2 2 2 1 1 1
15th 9 5 4 3 2 2 2 1 1 1
16th 9 5 4 3 3 2 2 2 1 1
17th 10 6 4 3 3 2 2 2 1 1
18th 10 6 5 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
19th 11 6 5 4 3 3 2 2 2 1
20th 11 6 5 4 3 3 2 2 2 2
As you gain levels with this class you gain abilities called:
Wanderlust at 1st level
Wanderlust: If the life mage stays in one locale to long he loses 1 point of Consititution for every week he stays in that locale. Once he gets 5 miles away from the locale he regains 1 point of constitution per day.
Blood Magic at 4th level
Blood Magic: A life mage can trade Hit Points for Magic Points on a
1-for-1 basis as long as you have 1 Hit Point left.
Body Focus at 8th level
Body Focus: Alife mage can use himself as focus for a spell. The life mage can not cast spells that require a focus component before they gain this feat at 8th level.
Inner Self at 12th level
Inner Self: A life mage can trade Magic Points for Hit Points on a
1-for-1 basis.
Lend Life at 20th level
Lend Life: a life mage can trade magic points to heal wounds on a one for one basis.
Over Powered? | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/05/2005 12:39 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Dark Lord:
This might answer some of your questions:
The Life Mage...
This certainly helps. What is a Magic Point? This class must have a unique spell list, correct? 'Cuz if it doesn't, and it uses the standard Sor/Wiz list, it's very, very broken. | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Dark Lord
Skirmisher
38 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 12:49 PM |
| A Magic Point is used to cast spells. It works like this:
If you cast a 5th level spell it costs 5 magic points.
If you cast a 9th level spell it costs 9 magic points.
If you cast a 0 level spell it costs 1/2 a magic point.
It does use the Sor/Wiz list. | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/05/2005 1:10 PM |
| quote:
Over Powered?
Yes. No way would I let a 9th level character have access to 9th level spells. I would play this guy in a heart beat if a DM were to offer it to me. It's too good to be true. Whenever something is a 'must have' or 'too good to be true' it's one of the first red flags that something might be amiss. I'd like to know what other people think. | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Yo Hon
Sneak
93 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 1:28 PM |
| | I would let one of my players use it. Hey it is only one powerful spell. | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 07/05/2005 2:14 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Yo Hun:
I would let one of my players use it. Hey it is only one powerful spell.
From what's written I think I can tweak more out of it than that.
A 9th level Life Mage will have (assuming avg con) 22 life points and 42 hp's(avg). I swap 20 hp's for 20 Magic Points using the Blood Magic class ability. I now have 42 Magic Points and spend these casting 1 of each spell levels 3 through 9. I'm seeing this as considerable over-powered.
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In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 6:28 PM |
| As a friend of mine says... that is crack. I would play one in the minutest fraction of a heartbeat. But I know that none of the our GM's would ever allow it. I am the expert in our group at Min Maxing (I played an 11th level Red Wizard casting Fire/Evocation spells as 16th level) and I would never allow anything like that. At the same time that a normal wizard is getting permanancy and teleport, this crack class would be getting time stop and wish. No game balance.
Here is an example... Burn 30 HP for magic points and then start casting Vampiric Touch... you get your HP back real quick and still have plenty of MP to spare. I would spend 9 HP to cast time stop.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Yo Hon
Sneak
93 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 7:21 PM |
| | The thing is you only get ONE 9th level spell, and at level 20 you get your second and final 9th level spell. I don't see how much harm ONE 9th level spell could do, although they can cast it a lot...... | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 8:12 PM |
| How much harm can one ninth level spell do???? Let me see, a Ninth level character who can change into a 18HD Gold or Red dragon, for 1 1/2 hours at a shot. If that gets to be a problem, shift into the form of a pit fiend. If that is a problem change into a Cloud Giant. Any of those things would stomp on a 9th level party.
If that doesn't sound broken for a ninth level player to do, then how about Meteor Swarm. A ninth level character who can do destroy a small town with a single spell. (4 40'radius blasts each doing 6d6 damage, that is 800 5X5 squares on a board.)
And don't forgett that that character also can cast an 8th level spell, a 7th level spell, a 6th level spell, a 5th level spell etc... etc...
This is absolute Crack. | |
"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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DDM Australian Champion 2005
psistef
Underboss
1572 Posts
| | 07/05/2005 10:28 PM |
| | This seems ....... insane. | |
Champion of the Prestige Class where mages focus on telekenesis and start throwing people into the ceiling and uber stuff like that.
Desirer of a Commander Effect in CG that grants Sidestep to followers with a ranged attack. | |
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Ironballz
Sneak
68 Posts
| | 07/06/2005 11:41 AM |
| Don't forget though, that with shapechange, you can only turn into creatures with as many HD as you have caster levels, with a max of 25. You would not be eligible to turn into a pitfiend until you reached caster level 18. Which, if memory serves, I think I could accomplish around 15th or 16th level with the right item's, feat's and spells.
The truly list of game breaking spells:
Summon Monster 9 (until you start to get around 15-16th level, that summoned monster would beat almost any encounter you have)
Dominate Monster (very high will save, minimum DC of 23 to control whatever you toss at the party)
Energy Drain (make anything you face at that level quite easy)
Meteor Swarm (enough damage to decimate most everything)
Wail of the Banshee (save is too high, kills too many things)
Some of these of course wouldn't be useable in every situation and only having one spell would be a big limitation, but they would still drastically change the game, both because of their power and how they drastically alter the DC of saving throws needed to be made at that level (they're 4 higher than normal for other spells). | |
Champion of the Minotaur Knight
Herald of the Epic Snig | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/07/2005 1:57 AM |
| You are thinking polymorph... With shapechange you can turn into anything with up to twice your caster level in HD with it topping out at 50HD. You gain all of the supernatural and extraordinary abilities of the form which you take.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Ironballz
Sneak
68 Posts
| | 07/07/2005 11:22 AM |
| From the SRD, first paragraph of the Shapechange spell:
quote:
This spell functions like polymorph, except that it enables you to assume the form of any single nonunique creature (of any type) from Fine to Colossal size. The assumed form cannot have more than your caster level in Hit Dice (to a maximum of 25 HD). Unlike polymorph, this spell allows incorporeal or gaseous forms to be assumed.
It says equal to caster level, not double. Did it change from 3.0 to 3.5? I wouldn't know really, don't have my 3.0 PhB anymore and I never played an arcance caster with those rules either.
Don't worry, I'm not arguing that this class isn't horribly broken, but the Shapechange spell isn't the one I'd be worried about (plus the 1500 gp material component would be really easy to control). Some of the other spells I listed though, don't require material components and could be much more devistating (like the Summon Monster 9)
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Champion of the Minotaur Knight
Herald of the Epic Snig | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 07/07/2005 6:11 PM |
| Yes it does change from 3.0. If I may...
"The assumed form cannot have more than twice your caster level in Hit Dice (with a maximum of 50 HD)."
It is one of the scariest 9th level spells because of the low cost of only having to spend 1500 one time to but the focus and then game on.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Ironballz
Sneak
68 Posts
| | 07/08/2005 10:48 AM |
| | Yeah, that's one of the reasons I was a big supporter of the change from 3.0 to 3.5, spells were more appropriately designed. Allowing a caster to change into just about anything is overpowered (caster level x2), but with it being just equal to each other, it's much more in line. Like I said though, the class is still broken and presents too much of a change to the game dynamics. | |
Champion of the Minotaur Knight
Herald of the Epic Snig | |
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