griffrat
Commander
3506 Posts
    
 | | 10/26/2005 9:20 AM |
| | recovered topic 10391 | |
Ambassador of FUN!!! | |
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griffrat
Commander
3506 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 9:20 AM |
| | This really depends on the game. I changed my deck of many things to contain equal amounts of good and bad thing. Such as gaining an instant level or losing a level. But the trick is that there is only one deck in my entire world. The thing that makes the “deck” cool and a sought after thing is that you can draw from it as much as you like, so the possibility of getting really good things is a tempting thing. But it is tempered with the thought of really bad things also...bad things. Very bad things..[}:)] | |
Ambassador of FUN!!! | |
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Sammael
Underboss
1881 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 10:12 AM |
| | Some of the effects (both good and bad) in the Deck are game-breaking. I've seen several campaigns end because of the damned thing (including one of my own), and several campaigns that got really unbalanced (and ended soon after). So, I wouldn't recommend putting it into a long-term campaign, because it is too variable and unpredictable. I suppose it's OK for one-time adventures or as a final campaign reward. | |
Hypethetical Blood War Set List | Champion of the Gelugon | Vindicated Prophet of Blood War
Ha 69/80 | De 60/60 | Ar 57/60 | GoL 72/72 | Ab 60/60 | DK 60/60 | AF 60/60 | UD 59/60 | WD 57/60 | WDQ 3/60| BW
Total DDM Count: 1037 | No chance of finishing the set | Will finish the set | Set | |
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griffrat
Commander
3506 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 10:29 AM |
| I agree that the deck can be a crusher, this is one of the reason that I changed a lot of the things in the deck to make the "greatest" thing a gain of level. The worst thing is a death card. With creatures and folks always trying to kill you off not a big deal.. But with level drain creatures out there, again not a big deal IMHO.
Many vetran players avoid even drawing once!! But the greed (in this case something for nothing) over takes others. In saying this the Holder of the deck of many things is typically not found on everyother street corner but off plane and very rare even then. | |
Ambassador of FUN!!! | |
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reezel
Sergeant
555 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 2:16 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by griffratMany vetran players avoid even drawing once!!
Count me in on this group of people. I always get so nervous with the deck of many things. Of course, there are plenty out there willing to spend huge amounts to get one draw off of it. It can really help make you some serious cash without actually drawing from it. | |
Champion of the Beholder and Beholderkin
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. | |
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*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 3:26 PM |
| | much like the Wand of Wonder...it should be avoided [)] | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
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CarrionCrawler
Underboss
1760 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 5:55 PM |
| If you didn't get a chance to review your game that week or had loads of exams, then throwing in either Wand of Wonder or Deck of Many things can be ok. Just make it so that they can only use it for that particular session....
off topic. What's with those "Champion of the..." stuff in everyone's sig? | |
Vindicated Night Below Champion of the Digestor!!! Knight of the OozesIcons called shot: Angry MobThe stink of rotten meat surrounds this multilegged creature with a segmented, 10-foot long body. Eight writhing tentacles protrude from its head, growing directly from below its clacking mandibles and tooth-filled maw. | |
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Lab Monkey
Commander
4136 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 6:46 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by CarrionCrawler
off topic. What's with those "Champion of the..." stuff in everyone's sig?
Check this out:
http://www.maxminis.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10332
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Have: Cat; Want: Storm Giant
Champion of Anything Dragonlance
Before trading, please check the Disputed Trades Thread | |
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maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 10/26/2005 7:49 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by glumag
much like the Wand of Wonder...it should be avoided [)]
I don't agree if done right a wand of wonder can be a lot of fun. I like to included a home brew wand of wonder in almost every campaign just to add a little randomness to the game. The veteran players try not to use it but just can't help themselfs when they need a miracle, the newbies think they can win the lottery. Some of my favorite moments dming are when as a last ditch kind of thing they point the wand at some charging bad guys and a stream of butterflys come out. I had one player who could figure out how to do something useful for almost every effect. | | | |
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Can of the Cave Beer
Commander
2838 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 1:04 AM |
| Ahh, the Deck of Many Things.
I remember stumbling across that little stinker of a creation when I was a but a lad perusing the DMG (AD&D-stylin').
Well, my mom had a bunch of cardboard inserts from something that were about the size of playing cards, so I drew out a bunch of crude renderings of what the images on the cards would represent.
Just toying with that thing taught me all I needed to know about the Deck--Don't screw with it. If you do screw with it and manage to NOT attract the attention of a major demon/devil or get your soul yanked out of your body and thrown into a magic jar on some distant plane, don't screw with it again.
Unless you're feeling lucky, that is. | |
Champion of the Werewolf Lord, Knight of Anything Duergar, and Squire of Things Gnollish
List reset with the start of previews for each new set...got Chainmail®? | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 1:22 AM |
| For those that remember that thread, "What if my beginning player with a gold dragon cohort paid a 17th level wizard to cast a wish and wished for mastery of all games of chance ???"
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"Are you not entertained?" 
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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Oni
Underboss
1131 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 3:29 AM |
| I love the wand of wonder, and I hate the Deck of Many Things. I always get stuck with them bad cards. locked up, dead, and all that.
The wand on the other hand I love. Had a CN Warlock who would use it on anything he thought he could not hit (there ac to high or a miss chance). Fun times [:)]. | |
"...don’t try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal."
- Zaphod Beeblebrox
Champion of the Nymph!
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ShadowLord XT
Commander
2637 Posts
Plane of Shadow
| | 10/27/2005 9:04 AM |
| That's why I made the deck lesser, and for fun, enhanced (A whole deck of 52 cards).
Just for fun you guys tell me a card and I'll tell you what happened to you or what you got from my created deck. (I'm just trying to have some fun here) | |
Disipline is the only way to overcome chaos.
Champion of Half-Golems
Knight of Golems
"This world is made for love and peace" - Trigun
"anyway..shadow..you've figured women out. KUDOS." - raye_kino16 | |
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*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 9:20 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by maijstral
quote:
Originally posted by glumag
much like the Wand of Wonder...it should be avoided [)]
I don't agree if done right a wand of wonder can be a lot of fun. I like to included a home brew wand of wonder in almost every campaign just to add a little randomness to the game. The veteran players try not to use it but just can't help themselfs when they need a miracle, the newbies think they can win the lottery. Some of my favorite moments dming are when as a last ditch kind of thing they point the wand at some charging bad guys and a stream of butterflys come out. I had one player who could figure out how to do something useful for almost every effect.
Check my winky face [)] The wand is loads of fun indeed but as aveteran we avoided and it is in the "break glass in case of emergencies" category. The first time we got a hold of one we quickly learned that there was more downside to it than anything. [:D] But it remains a ton of fun. | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 10/27/2005 10:50 AM |
| | The Deck of Many Things is indeed a dangerous item. I would refuse to pull with a 50% chance of something terrible happening. There is no wand of Wonder in the game, it's a Rod now. [:D][:p] | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
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maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 10:51 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by glumag
quote:
Originally posted by maijstral
quote:
Originally posted by glumag
much like the Wand of Wonder...it should be avoided [)]
I don't agree if done right a wand of wonder can be a lot of fun. I like to included a home brew wand of wonder in almost every campaign just to add a little randomness to the game. The veteran players try not to use it but just can't help themselfs when they need a miracle, the newbies think they can win the lottery. Some of my favorite moments dming are when as a last ditch kind of thing they point the wand at some charging bad guys and a stream of butterflys come out. I had one player who could figure out how to do something useful for almost every effect.
Check my winky face [)] The wand is loads of fun indeed but as aveteran we avoided and it is in the "break glass in case of emergencies" category. The first time we got a hold of one we quickly learned that there was more downside to it than anything. [:D] But it remains a ton of fun.
I refuse to acknowlege winky faces[:)]. They are a bane on our exsistance[:D]. I believe everything posted is in utter seriousness[:o)]. To negate your post with a winky face is just wrong[)]. I will never use these evil smileys just to add emotional context to my postsΖD]. | | | |
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Pale Rider
Underboss
1023 Posts
London, Ontario, Canada
| | 10/27/2005 11:37 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ShadowLord XT
That's why I made the deck lesser, and for fun, enhanced (A whole deck of 52 cards).
Just for fun you guys tell me a card and I'll tell you what happened to you or what you got from my created deck. (I'm just trying to have some fun here)
4 of diamonds | |
Completed Trades: Crescent Hawk, Vimes, demagogue, vidman, Eric is God, Strachan Fireblade, FungiMuncher, Dudeeehm, Shasack, gausse, kyrin, nyjastul69
Champion of the Remorhaz | |
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*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 12:53 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Pale Rider
quote:
Originally posted by ShadowLord XT
That's why I made the deck lesser, and for fun, enhanced (A whole deck of 52 cards).
Just for fun you guys tell me a card and I'll tell you what happened to you or what you got from my created deck. (I'm just trying to have some fun here)
4 of diamonds
Can I play the pump my post count game too? [)]
Jack of Clubs [:p][)]
-wait for it- | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
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ShadowLord XT
Commander
2637 Posts
Plane of Shadow
| | 10/27/2005 1:19 PM |
| quote:
Can I play the pump my post count game too? [)]
Screw it!! This post is done.
What do you have agianst me glumag, huh????? | |
Disipline is the only way to overcome chaos.
Champion of Half-Golems
Knight of Golems
"This world is made for love and peace" - Trigun
"anyway..shadow..you've figured women out. KUDOS." - raye_kino16 | |
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*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 1:53 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by ShadowLord XT
quote:
Can I play the pump my post count game too? [)]
Screw it!! This post is done.
What do you have agianst me glumag, huh?????
uh...nothing? winky face = joke
relax, if you didn't read it as a joke I am sorry [eyes] | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
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frogrodeo
Sergeant
706 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 5:55 PM |
| | Ah the Deck of Many Things.... one thing I have learned is if you want the campaign to continue.... get rid of the deck. Both campaigns that featured Decks when I was younger ended horribly. Each time it was the signal for a new campaign to start up fresh. So, not a bad thing if you're bored and want things to end... | |
Champion of Remorhaz, and the Mighty Goblin Frog Riders | |
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winterwolf
Sneak
50 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 8:28 PM |
| As a DM, I LOVE the deck! it simply creates good roleplaying and adventure oppourtunities. donjon, the flames, even the void provide new campaign tangents. the deck was made for DM's, not players...
regarding so-called "veteran" players who refuse to draw from the deck on the basis that they know they might lose a level, or be imprisoned, or whatever, this is the worst kind of out-of-game thinking. in a game context, most pc's dont have the first clue what a Deck is capable of doing,at least not without serious knowledge: arcana or bardic knowledge checks. | |
My number is 667- I'm the neighbor of the beast...
VIVAT ANSTEORRA! VIVAT WIESENFURER!!
CHAMPION OF THE GORGON | |
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reezel
Sergeant
555 Posts
| | 10/27/2005 10:47 PM |
| | So am I the only person who basically stopped all my group members from pulling from it and sell it for a ton of cash? | |
Champion of the Beholder and Beholderkin
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. | |
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IHawk
Underboss
1054 Posts
Lisle, Illinois
| | 10/27/2005 11:18 PM |
| Back in my college days (second ed), I ran a campaign and about 2 years into it I dumped the DoMThings on the party. Most guys took one card and had fun, the rogue proclaimed 5 draws...the worst thing he ended up with was the -2 petrification saves...talk about a horseshoe you know where. But about 10 months later it bit him, he failed a save against the advanced medusa by exactly one point, that was the end of Dax, It turned out he couldn't take on the whole empire.
mark
-btw, I like the deck...modified to fit your campaign is definitely the way to go! | |
mark - Champion of the Goblin Worg Riders | anteblue_at_yahoo_dot_com
IHawk's Have/Want List | IHawk's Trade List | Completed Trades - 214 | Pending Trades - 0
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 10/28/2005 12:40 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by winterwolf:
regarding so-called "veteran" players who refuse to draw from the deck on the basis that they know they might lose a level, or be imprisoned, or whatever, this is the worst kind of out-of-game thinking. in a game context, most pc's dont have the first clue what a Deck is capable of doing,at least not without serious knowledge: arcana or bardic knowledge checks.
That's true, but not anymore so than a player who knows something good might happen and takes a pull. Neither of these situations would arise in my game as I'd have the party have to identify it before being able to pull from it. | |
In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 10/28/2005 1:14 PM |
| It is just a bad bad thing. The goods are pretty good, but the bads are really really bad. There is nothing game breaking in the good cards, but there are plenty of things that can really kill or ruin a character in the bad side. If you have been playing a character for 4-5 years, from first level to 14-15 th or higher, would you really draw from a deck? Never mind this starting a character at 10th level and you've been playing it for a week... if you are really attatched to your PC, would you draw?
Yeah... most peopel would.
[:D] OOOOHHH OOOOHHH OOOOHHH, I really need to justify my existance and increase my post count!!! [)] [)] [)] (It is a joke!)
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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winterwolf
Sneak
50 Posts
| | 10/28/2005 2:50 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by nyjastul69
quote:
Originally posted by winterwolf:
regarding so-called "veteran" players who refuse to draw from the deck on the basis that they know they might lose a level, or be imprisoned, or whatever, this is the worst kind of out-of-game thinking. in a game context, most pc's dont have the first clue what a Deck is capable of doing,at least not without serious knowledge: arcana or bardic knowledge checks.
That's true, but not anymore so than a player who knows something good might happen and takes a pull. Neither of these situations would arise in my game as I'd have the party have to identify it before being able to pull from it.
My point exactly. the identify is the first in-game action towards the character deciding whether or not to draw. If a normally impulsive, chaotic rogue refuses to draw, they need a good explanation. The paladin, who doesn't do anything without careful planning jumping to draw would would likewise need to explain thier actions, lest some alignments start shifting.
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My number is 667- I'm the neighbor of the beast...
VIVAT ANSTEORRA! VIVAT WIESENFURER!!
CHAMPION OF THE GORGON | |
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Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 10/28/2005 3:35 PM |
| Except one thing...
quote:
quote:Originally posted by nyjastul69
quote:Originally posted by winterwolf:
regarding so-called "veteran" players who refuse to draw from the deck on the basis that they know they might lose a level, or be imprisoned, or whatever, this is the worst kind of out-of-game thinking. in a game context, most pc's dont have the first clue what a Deck is capable of doing,at least not without serious knowledge: arcana or bardic knowledge checks.
That's true, but not anymore so than a player who knows something good might happen and takes a pull. Neither of these situations would arise in my game as I'd have the party have to identify it before being able to pull from it.
My point exactly. the identify is the first in-game action towards the character deciding whether or not to draw. If a normally impulsive, chaotic rogue refuses to draw, they need a good explanation. The paladin, who doesn't do anything without careful planning jumping to draw would would likewise need to explain thier actions, lest some alignments start shifting.
Would the Identify spell work?? The Deck of Many Things is now considered an artifact.
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"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 10/28/2005 3:55 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Main Lug:
Except one thing...
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:Originally posted by nyjastul69
quote:Originally posted by winterwolf:
regarding so-called "veteran" players who refuse to draw from the deck on the basis that they know they might lose a level, or be imprisoned, or whatever, this is the worst kind of out-of-game thinking. in a game context, most pc's dont have the first clue what a Deck is capable of doing,at least not without serious knowledge: arcana or bardic knowledge checks.
That's true, but not anymore so than a player who knows something good might happen and takes a pull. Neither of these situations would arise in my game as I'd have the party have to identify it before being able to pull from it.
My point exactly. the identify is the first in-game action towards the character deciding whether or not to draw. If a normally impulsive, chaotic rogue refuses to draw, they need a good explanation. The paladin, who doesn't do anything without careful planning jumping to draw would would likewise need to explain thier actions, lest some alignments start shifting.
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Would the Identify spell work?? The Deck of Many Things is now considered an artifact.
Ummmm...Ummmm...[:I] I forgot that it's now an artifact. So no it wouldn't work. Contact Other Plane, Legend lore, Commune, these should work and they're probably not difficult to access if your playing around with artifacts.
Edit: If I keep this up I'm going to banned from replying to any rules related threads at all.[B)]
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In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
|
Malin Lug
Sergeant
742 Posts
| | 10/28/2005 4:32 PM |
| quote:
Ummmm...Ummmm... I forgot that it's now an artifact. So no it wouldn't work. Contact Other Plane, Legend lore, Commune, these should work and they're probably not difficult to access if your playing around with artifacts.
Edit: If I keep this up I'm going to banned from replying to any rules related threads at all.
No Worries... it happens to all of us. [:D] Hey, sometimes even I am right. | |
"Are you not entertained?"
Champion of the Common Bar Wench
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MrMorden
Sergeant
462 Posts
| | 11/07/2005 4:39 PM |
| This does not need to be THAT bad. I haven't done one since 3.5, but I always make up my own deck based on a Tarot deck. That gives 58 possibilities (116 if you do reverses too), and if you have a book on Tarot you can find out what the cards are supposed to mean and make an effect based on that, so you don't even have to think too much. And when you whip out a Tarot deck to use, it is cooler than just a deck of playing cards. And I usually only allow each player ONE draw from the deck.
This way you can make the deck as mild or game-shattering as you want, scale it to player level and experience, and the players will have NO idea what horrors or wonders lurk within the deck!
Good luck! | |
Check my Have/Want list:
http://www.maxminis.com/hwlist.asp?user=MrMorden
Or make an offer! I'm willing to trade/accept anything for the right deal! I've made successful trades with:
Demagogue, Ilmatus, Gaddszooks, Smetzger, Purple Drag0n, Camp0243, Vidman, Kaya Kenobi, grizpapa, Cha0tic G0od | |
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