The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
12441 Posts
    
The G Spot
 | | 11/08/2005 11:03 AM |
| | recovered topic 11142 | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM | |
|
The Great
Choco Monster
Ghendar
Warlord
12441 Posts
The G Spot
| | 11/08/2005 11:03 AM |
| They're out of their minds. $120?????? Good luck to them. They're going to need it.
$120. [eyes]
 | |
WotC - making me wish more and more every day for a return to the TSR days. :(
I fought the snark and the snark won. I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
Some of my favorite Maxminis quotes
I actually love to be swallowed. - Posted By gss_000 on 09/04/2007 2:32 PM
Could somebody explain Snatch to me? I understand the basics, but not how to enter/use it. - Posted by orcmonk220
G's the man. - Posted By greyhaze on 11/11/2008 8:58 AM | |
|
*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 11:12 AM |
| not me, nope, not at that price; no rpg book is worth that much unless it comes with a holographic projector [eyes]
Are you crazy? Maybe. | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
|
forkedmoon
Underboss
1305 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 11:24 AM |
| | If people are willing to spend this [:0] maybe I need to get back into creating personalized designer dungeons again. | |
Champion of Cyclops
| |
|
maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 11:27 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by glumag
not me, nope, not at that price; no rpg book is worth that much unless it comes with a holographic projector [eyes]
Are you crazy? Maybe.
You'd be surprised, I thought the same thing about the 100 dollars for the worlds largest dungeon but people are buying them.
I really can't understand it either, 100 bucks you can buy a case of minis for that.[)] | | | |
|
Oni
Underboss
1131 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 11:33 AM |
| I may be interested. People bulked at WLD for 100, and wound up lovin it so why not this?
120.00 gets you an adventure that takes characters from lvl 1 to 20. How many Dungeon mag.s would it take to get there, and their value?
I would get it, but my players never follow threw with anything so they would never finish it. | |
"...don’t try to outweird me, I get stranger things than you free with my breakfast cereal."
- Zaphod Beeblebrox
Champion of the Nymph!
| |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 12:08 PM |
| To be clear for those who didn't check the link, here is what you get:
a 672 page book
The Books has a reinforced binding, with 3 built in cloth book marks
50 pages of maps
350 illustrations
Double sided full color poster map
16 B/W and 8 Full color PC handouts
CD ROM containing the following:
a PDF of the Banewarrens
a PDF of Chaositech
a PDF of the Ptolus adventure (all new) Night of Dissolution
PDF of the Players guide to Ptolus
If you pre order you get 5 print copies of the 32 page Players guide, and a print copy of the 96 page Night of Dissolution adventure.
SO, as it's the equivalent of 2.5 Players handbooks in size, plus 3 significant adventures, and a bunch of other bonus material, is $120 so outragous? Damn... I'm talking myself into it...
Pat E
| |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
Vash
Underboss
1995 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 12:20 PM |
| Put it this way...if I had $120 to frivously spend and people to play it with, yes I would buy it. But then Im also a sucker for big and fancy.
If you meet those criteria Pat, then yes go for it. | |
Champion of the Alhoon and my called shot for Unhallowed
Blood War Called Shot: Phoenix
Trade withe me! | |
|
Sammael
Underboss
1881 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 12:33 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Oni
How many Dungeon mag.s would it take to get there, and their value?
An annual subscription to Dungeon (around $40 in the U.S., I think) should be sufficient. That's 36 diverse adventures, as opposed to one immensely boring dungeon crawl. | |
Hypethetical Blood War Set List | Champion of the Gelugon | Vindicated Prophet of Blood War
Ha 69/80 | De 60/60 | Ar 57/60 | GoL 72/72 | Ab 60/60 | DK 60/60 | AF 60/60 | UD 59/60 | WD 57/60 | WDQ 3/60| BW
Total DDM Count: 1037 | No chance of finishing the set | Will finish the set | Set | |
|
*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 12:59 PM |
| | It is a lot of material and if you have the money to spare then by all means. I just personally don't think that any campaign set should cost that much, including WLD. | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 5:24 PM |
| quote:
An annual subscription to Dungeon (around $40 in the U.S., I think) should be sufficient. That's 36 diverse adventures, as opposed to one immensely boring dungeon crawl.
Ah! Glad to see you went to the link and checked things out... [)]
Pat E | |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 5:57 PM |
| Monte is a great designer. $120 isn't unreasonable for what you are getting. Compare it to:
$40.00 Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
$32.95 Player's Guide to Faerun
$29.95 City of the Spider Queen
$21.95 Monsters of Faerun
===================
$125.00 USD
I would say that Ptolus offers more material, but even Malhavoc Press isn't as high end as WotC. If you are going to make a one time buy in to a setting I think it's pretty reasonable.
The issue with it is "am I willing to buy that amount of material without playing it first?" When you buy a single WotC book you can always trade it if you don't like it. I doubt anyone's going to give you $120 worth of minis for Ptolus. Not because it sucks, but because it doesn't have the plug and play value of something like Lords of Madness. | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
|
Wraith
Warrior
312 Posts
| | 11/08/2005 6:47 PM |
| | RPG book insanity! | |
| |
|
Pale Rider
Underboss
1023 Posts
London, Ontario, Canada
| | 11/09/2005 2:40 AM |
| | From what I understand isn't Ptolus just one city? Not a campaign world but the major city in it? I would need a 'world in a box' if I were to put down that kind of money. Even then I probably wouldn't unless I found the material to be absolutely brilliant. That said they can charge whatever they like. I remember some people on ENWorld going ballistic at the very idea of a $120 RPG book regardless of what it came with. | |
Completed Trades: Crescent Hawk, Vimes, demagogue, vidman, Eric is God, Strachan Fireblade, FungiMuncher, Dudeeehm, Shasack, gausse, kyrin, nyjastul69
Champion of the Remorhaz | |
|
Thoth, Gatherer of Knowledge
MerricB
Underboss
2353 Posts
Australia
| | 11/09/2005 3:22 AM |
| Too much for me, but it's likely to be Very Cool Indeed. [:)]
Cheers! | |
Merric Blackman
| |
|
Gristlemane
Sergeant
623 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 5:24 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Pale Rider
I remember some people on ENWorld going ballistic at the very idea of a $120 RPG book regardless of what it came with.
It's kind of silly though, when you're not talking about a single book but like six books. I shudder to think of the money I have dropped on the counter for Forgotten Realms books. It didn't seem like so much because I bought my library piece by piece. If I compared the total amount I'd spent on the Forgotten Realms and compared that to a one time purchase for Ptolus, I'm sure Monte would come way out ahead of Wizards of the Coast. That's the nature of buying in bulk.
Settings seem to be a hard sell now. Ghostwalk was a really neat book, but I regretfully haven't used the setting. I can't justify buying into another setting before I try GW at least. | |
It's deja vu all over again. | |
|
Sammael
Underboss
1881 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 6:04 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by PatEllis15
quote:
An annual subscription to Dungeon (around $40 in the U.S., I think) should be sufficient. That's 36 diverse adventures, as opposed to one immensely boring dungeon crawl.
Ah! Glad to see you went to the link and checked things out... [)]
Pat E
I was talking about World's Largest Dungeon, not Ptolus.
I am well aware of Ptolus, and have no intention of purchasing it. If it ever comes out as a PDF at a reasonable price ($30?), I might consider it, but I'm quite sick of Monte's HypeMachine(TM). | |
Hypethetical Blood War Set List | Champion of the Gelugon | Vindicated Prophet of Blood War
Ha 69/80 | De 60/60 | Ar 57/60 | GoL 72/72 | Ab 60/60 | DK 60/60 | AF 60/60 | UD 59/60 | WD 57/60 | WDQ 3/60| BW
Total DDM Count: 1037 | No chance of finishing the set | Will finish the set | Set | |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 11/09/2005 7:12 AM |
| quote:
but I'm quite sick of Monte's HypeMachine(TM).
Heh....
He does say it will be released as a PDF, but that it is so big as to make downloading it as one PDF impracticle, so he will sell it as several PDF's....
Pat E | |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 11/09/2005 7:23 AM |
| Holy.......whoa.
Your right..its a city...not a campaign world...but one big fleshed out city.
Im reading the FAQs and it sounds amazing. And there is a payment plan.
The notion of a payment plan to get a RPG book just sounds..either rediculus or really sweet...I cant decide wich.
I duuno what to do now...Monte is the king so I know it will rock.
But its so expensive. And with all the books I already have do I really need this one?
It calling me though :)
And the bonus you get for pre-ordering cannot be passed up if I do get it.
When does the Pre-order bunus material offer end? | |
Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
|
LordStorm
Sneak
133 Posts
Columbus Ohio
| | 11/11/2005 8:12 PM |
| $120.00 is too much for a entry point.
To be fair, I've spent that much on the Eberron campaign, however I was able to spend it incrementally and evaluate each product on its own merits.
I don't thinks its wise to make a bundle cost so much. It might work if the products were available individually for $200.00. However I just don't see the value for an "unproven" product, even if its from a "proven" author.
| |
Lord Storm | |
|
*censored*
glumag
Warlord
5968 Posts
| | 11/11/2005 8:31 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by PatEllis15
quote:
but I'm quite sick of Monte's HypeMachine(TM).
He does say it will be released as a PDF, but that it is so big as to make downloading it as one PDF impracticle, so he will sell it as several PDF's....
Ok, so let's say the PDFs will cost about $40 for the entire enchilada; then go to http://www.printfu.org/ and about 23$ for 675 pages, so at half the price you get the same thing [)] maybe not as nice but for some of us, just as good. | |
Trades >> Completed: 49 | Bad: Ø | Pending: 0 | Trade & talk Live on IRC! SERVER: irc.psionics.net CHANNEL: #maxminis | |
|
Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 11/12/2005 12:55 AM |
| | Monte Cook is a genius pure and simple. I usually am cheap when it comes to buying expensive books but this one really has me interested. I will give it a good look over and then will probably end up with it. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
|
CarpBrain
Sergeant
503 Posts
| | 11/12/2005 12:24 PM |
| | I have it preordered. After reading the excerpts on the site and looking at the total material that you recieve when you preorder it, I found it to be a good deal, and something that I think will be interesting. I fully expect to get my money's worth from the purchase. | |
Brian Carpenter - 6th level Human Physicist | |
|
tree druid
Sergeant
414 Posts
| | 11/13/2005 10:53 AM |
| | Wow, I feel guilty but I think I am going to have to preorder this. | |
After all the battles, all the death, life can begin again
Champion of Radiant Dragons | |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 11/13/2005 10:59 AM |
|
quote:
Wow, I feel guilty but I think I am going to have to preorder this.
That's what I've been feeling as well. I haven't pulled the trigger yet though.
Pat E | |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
Son of a Biscuit
Skirmisher
16 Posts
| | 11/13/2005 11:20 AM |
| | It certainly does sound interesting. Monte Cook does nice work, but to drop $120 on it? That's a very tough sell. | |
Hey sweet thing, wanna hold my Rod of Lordly Might? - Belkar Bitterleaf, Order of the Stick | |
|
Jefftyjeffjeff
Warrior
214 Posts
| | 11/17/2005 1:41 AM |
| I can't say for sure whether you're crazy or not, [:)] but I know I'm buying in!
Ptolus is a steep price, but a good value. It's a good bet that however chintzy you are about spending money on RPG books, I'm worse. But this is going to be a soo-perb book, and worth the money.
Ptolus is one city, but in essence it's a campaign setting. It does come with adventures for levels 1-20 (you can buy the excellent Shackled City 1-20 adventure from Paizo for a mere $60) and a pile of pdf extras that you'd have paid maybe a third of the price of this book just to have when they came out. Also it's just going to be a freaking amazing thing to hold in your hands.
More than a throwback, this could well be the front end of the final wave of D&D supplements before 4th ed (only supposition on my part, but educated supposition). If Ptolus does passingly well, you'll see a lot of this deluxe treatment in the next couple of years, I bet. I doubt anyone else will do it as well though.
| |
Jeff Quick, Philadelphia
22 Successful Trades: benimoto, bonepinhamer, bradu, Changeling, dnd3eplayer, drowdude, Drift, Gausse, Ghendar, Ihawk, ikill4adollar, Khaibit_ema_Neteru, Lance H, marjorie, MeepoTheMighty, mulkhoran, Puggins, Ryngard, vrecknidj, wuzzard, xbrendanx, Zenako (x2)
Pending Trades: | |
|
IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 11/17/2005 3:38 AM |
| I'd certainly consider it. Monte does good work, although I find he's not TOTALLY consistently great; I like a lot of the concepts in AU, for example, there's great class and character design, but the races are weak (oh boy cat people) and the setting just doesn't grab me.
Some of the smaller products he's done are wonderful, though.
I'll probably wait for some reviews, but he's on the short list of designers who I would think about getting something like this from, the others being Carl Sargent (whatever happened to him anyway,) James Wyatt, and Rich Baker. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
|
Monsoon28
Underboss
2313 Posts
Toronto
| | 11/17/2005 9:11 AM |
| Yup your crazy!
Ok sure it really isn't that much money for what your getting, but at least I'm not dropping 120 all at once, and that's the issue. If Monte Cook broke this down into three separate pieces, lets say: City, Uber Dungeon and Uber adventure w/handouts and sold them each for 40 bucks. It would go down alot more smoothly. | |
"I was sittin' here eatin' my muffin, drinkin' my coffee, replayin' the incident in my head, when I had what alcoholics refer to as a moment of clarity." - Jules Winnfield
Sales/Trades Bad (1): Ironfist Boulderbender
Trades/Sales completed (8.): Danthl, Dafrca, Garyaxe, qillan_dvra, realmaster, Vandal_Savage, cavedweller, unearthed arcana.
Champion of Gem Dragons, VINDICATED Squire of Duergar Commander, Knight of the Astral Stalker.
| |
|
Omand
Commander
3120 Posts
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
| | 11/18/2005 12:47 AM |
| Hello,
If this is a poll, I will ahve to vote that I am not buying Ptolus. I am sure it will be a great game resource, but Monte's campaign style does seem to differ from my own. The cost of the product will also likely be worth it, but I really don't tend to spend more than about $35.00 on a gaming book.
Cheers [:)] | |
Successful Trades: 77 * Pending Trades: 0 * Bad Trades: KONG (B.W.)
Trade History * Trading Thread * Sales Thread * Winnipeg Meetingplace | |
|
bshugg
Underboss
1833 Posts
| | 11/18/2005 12:35 PM |
| | I will probably pick it up. I don't know enough about it yet to see how interesting it is, but I LOVE the huge book formats like shackled city and Worlds largest dungeon. I will probably never run any of them, but they make for great reading. I like to support that kind of work with my disposable income. | |
Looking for someone to cosponser a midwest DDM event. let me know if your interested!
Check out my brand new blog:
http://bshugg.blogspot.com | |
|
LordStorm
Sneak
133 Posts
Columbus Ohio
| | 11/25/2005 8:01 PM |
| I've been following this thread and I have yet to see a good post that would convince me to buy it. I'll probably remain on the fence until its sold and then wait for the feedback.
| |
Lord Storm | |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 11/29/2005 1:27 PM |
| quote:
I've been following this thread and I have yet to see a good post that would convince me to buy it. I'll probably remain on the fence until its sold and then wait for the feedback.
Well, I haven't placed an order either, but I'd be curious to know what WOULD make you order now? I think I will be with some Christmas money, purely based on what I've seen and read. Did you go to Monte's site and check things out? What would tip your decision one way or the other?!
Pat E | |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
water_prophet
Skirmisher
5 Posts
| | 11/30/2005 10:55 AM |
| It'll be interesting to see what it looks like. I attended his "unveiling/info session" of it at GenCon Indy, and I was quite impressed with it. Not only is he revolutionizing the format (something that Wizards should take note of when it comes out), but he is also revolutionizing what a city/setting source book can possibly be.
He is also doing something new with having a lot of bonus supplementary material on a cd-rom available. For those of us who have access to printers, that's a great idea.
The price is only a concern for me in that I need to use most of the book to justify it. I often use modular pieces of WotC books that I buy to supplement my own games. Really, there are too many books out there now to NOT do that.
I'm also concerned about the inclusion of what I will dub "wacky Monte stuff" in the Ptolus setting. I don't use any of the Arcana Unearthed stuff in my games, and I know that he will be including at least some of the races from that (Litorians) in Ptolus. If it is easy to replace these creatures with something else, then it's not so bad.
I also will need to look through the whole thing to see if it "makes sense." Does it actually make sense to have a single location (albeit various levels) have enough monsters in it to get a group of adventurers from 1st to 20th level? I know there will be multiple levels under the city, and I don't know if that makes sense to me either. It seems a little rediculous to me that you would have Drow under a city on one level, aberrations on another level, and something else entirely on another level below the same location. I know it's fantasy, but my realism can stretch only so far.
Overall, however, I'm excited that this kind of project is pushing the boundaries of what the d20 system offers. I appreciate that Monte is willing to do this where WotC is more worried about small innovations to tow the bottom line. I'm not bashing WotC stuff, but as the parent of d20 there are certain expectations that they must abide by. Monte's creativity can go outside of those boundaries, and I am always impressed by that. | |
~magnus | |
|
Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 11/30/2005 10:23 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by bshugg
I will probably pick it up. I don't know enough about it yet to see how interesting it is, but I LOVE the huge book formats like shackled city and Worlds largest dungeon. I will probably never run any of them, but they make for great reading. I like to support that kind of work with my disposable income.
I agree. I find that so many of the books they put out now could use more material. They seem to just pass over stuff with not enough detail. The larger books like this have so much more information which can provide numerous ideas for campaigns, and at a worst case scenario... lots of good reading. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
|
Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 12/01/2005 4:40 PM |
| quote:
I'm also concerned about the inclusion of what I will dub "wacky Monte stuff" in the Ptolus setting. I don't use any of the Arcana Unearthed stuff in my games, and I know that he will be including at least some of the races from that (Litorians) in Ptolus. If it is easy to replace these creatures with something else, then it's not so bad.
Is that speculation or does Ptolus really have Litorians and other Arcana Unearthed junk in it?
If it does then that GREATLY effects my decision. | |
Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
|
reezel
Sergeant
555 Posts
| | 12/01/2005 4:59 PM |
| | I doubt I will buy it. 1st of becuase of price, second because I was disapointed in Arcana Unearthed and it has made me a lot more weary towards Monte's stuff. I still respect him, but his previous work felt incomplete to me and left me a little shy towards his newer stuff. | |
Champion of the Beholder and Beholderkin
The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. | |
|
PatEllis15
Commander
4463 Posts
| | 12/01/2005 9:13 PM |
| quote:
Is that speculation or does Ptolus really have Litorians and other Arcana Unearthed junk in it?
If it does then that GREATLY effects my decision.
no, it's D20, not (just) OGL. Monte does say he will include idea/rules to include items from Arcana Unearthed. Not sure how many pages that will amount to, but it's not "core" to the setting.
pat E | |
"Games evolve. Otherwise we'd still be pushing rocks around the dirt. What do you think the cavemen said when some dude showed up with sticks?" - Chairman7w | |
|
Liquidburn
Sergeant
944 Posts
| | 12/02/2005 12:02 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by PatEllis15
quote:
Is that speculation or does Ptolus really have Litorians and other Arcana Unearthed junk in it?
If it does then that GREATLY effects my decision.
no, it's D20, not (just) OGL. Monte does say he will include idea/rules to include items from Arcana Unearthed. Not sure how many pages that will amount to, but it's not "core" to the setting.
pat E
I'm a big fan of Unearthed Arcana and some of the fun variants in there like the Gestalt classes. I hope he does include some stuff from there in Ptolus. | |
Jason Slingerland
"Why do I have to be Mr. Pink?" | |
|
Count Dooku
Commander
4637 Posts
New York
| | 12/02/2005 7:37 AM |
| No Liquidburn you dont understand. Monte Cook left WotC and created his own product. One of them was "Arcana Unearthed".
Nope...I didnt say it backwards. It was a varient Players Handbook that Monte said could replace the WotC PH.
Later in time WotC made "Unearthed Arcana" wich was the book your thinking of. | |
Champion of the Skulk
Vindicated Champion of the Twig Blight | |
|