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Can of the Cave Beer
Commander
2838 Posts
    
 | | 11/21/2005 12:38 AM |
| | recovered topic 11757 | |
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Can of the Cave Beer
Commander
2838 Posts
| | 11/21/2005 12:38 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Ben Webster
He is 9th level and used some Ki ability to go ethereal to escape the grapple then appeared in the same place to attack with a full round action with whirling death (or some feat that allows an attack on all adjacent enemies).
Well, the first you need to do is read up on the abilities used. It does happen that people mis-read things from time to time, and the abilities might be used incorrectly.
After determining the correct/incorrect usage of those abilities, it's important to note just what the ability does: from what you are saying, the PC goes ethereal (not just noncorporeal, but I'm presuming to the Ether). The way to prevent this ability from being overused is to sometimes stop the character from being able to reach the Ether. That should be able to be accomplished with magic or special magical items--houseruled if there's nothing "official". I can see GREAT value in shackles that prevent a subject from teleporting, going ethereal, etc.
Another way involves noting the limitations on the powers. How often can they be used? If only usable every so often, and the PC is overwhelmed and uses the ability, then the heavies can move in to work on him with only limited fear that the ninja will bamf and return with a whirlwind of destruction.
But I would only resort to those types of actions if this becomes a favored tactic or was otherwise unbalancing the game. | |
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maijstral
Underboss
2105 Posts
| | 11/21/2005 12:39 AM |
| He used the ghost step ability.However you don't get the ethereal step until 10th level.
At 10th level though it looks as if he is within the rules, using ghost step is a swift action that doesn't provoke an AOO and it only lasts one round so he would come back right where he left if he didn't move on the ethereal plane.
At that level though you should have enough spellcasters around to cause him some grief if you think this make him to powerfull. Spells and spell like abilities with the force descriptor affect things on the ethereal plane. Ghost touch weapons might work as well I can'tremember off hand if they only effect incorporeal or both incorporel and ethereal. | | | |
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reezel
Sergeant
555 Posts
| | 11/21/2005 8:15 AM |
| He would have to at least take a 5 foot step before doing anything though. When grappled, you are in the same spot as your opponent. Once let go, you must finish your movement in another square. Also, I wonder on the duration of ghost step. Does it last for the entire round, or can it be dismissed at will? If it does last for a round then he most likely be able to attack that round anyways.
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 11/21/2005 8:22 AM |
| | There is also the possibility that someone popping in and out of the the material plane might attract the attention of a denizen of the plane they're travelling to. [}:)] | |
In the constellation of
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Mrfurious
Warrior
344 Posts
| | 11/21/2005 8:47 AM |
| I don't think you should punish a PC for using his class abilities. I mean if every 2nd or third time he tries to go ethereal there is some dimensional lock effect or some monster waiting for him, he or she is going to get annoyed.
So maybe every once in a long while that would be a nice challenge/change of pace. But I think if you hammer a PC for using a class ability, or take it away a lot, its not good for the game. | |
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nyjastul69
Commander
2712 Posts
Rhode Island
| | 11/21/2005 9:47 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Mrfurious:
I don't think you should punish a PC for using his class abilities. I mean if every 2nd or third time he tries to go ethereal there is some dimensional lock effect or some monster waiting for him, he or she is going to get annoyed.
So maybe every once in a long while that would be a nice challenge/change of pace. But I think if you hammer a PC for using a class ability, or take it away a lot, its not good for the game.
I agree 100%. I didn't make myself entirely clear(I'm good at that). I haven't read the ability and don't know if it's open to abuse or not. I was just trying to bring his attention to a tool he can use if a player tries to abuse, as opposed to use, an ability or rule.
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In the constellation of
Cygnus, there lurks a
mysterious, invisible
force:
Rush | |
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Zenako
Commander
3469 Posts
| | 11/21/2005 10:12 AM |
| A whole variety of attack combat skills can be abused and perhaps unbalance the game (Spring Attack, this PRC ability) . The part that needs to be developed is the DM's awareness of exactly what can and cannot be done with them and what warriors in that realm would know about countermeasures.
It is easy for a player to study up extensively and utilize all the good parts of a skill, and then expect the DM to recall the drawbacks, but we all know that most DM's have a life and have not committed every rule book and addition to memory.
Kind of like the Dimension Door rule that ends up with the caster being disoriented when they arrive and being unable to do anything else once they get there. A little thing, but it can have a HUGE impact on how effective it can be in a battle.
Now dumb critters like ghouls can be used and abused by the PC's with little risk of unbalancing the campaign so that is not the issue here. They are cannon fodder to be chopped down.
As for the this Ninja, if the character did not move from his spot, then I would nerf the ability by having him still involved in some grappling when he popped back. If he moved from his spot and then back into it, that would be more than the 5' movement allowed and he could not full attack normally. If he moved just 5' and popped back, he might be intersecting one of the ghouls and you would have to rule on what happens since two beings cannot occupy the same spot.
I think you also need to look at the intent of the ability. I expect it was designed to facilitate escape, not attack, and I would focus on making sure it was very useful for escaping, and make it hard to use as an attack mode. Also keep in mind that once the character pops to the etherial, that while they can sense, see what is happening, that they cannot hear what is happening.
This particular ability, similar to Etherial Jaunt, came into play in my last OA game where a high level Wu-Jen was Etherial Jaunting about and through the walls of the Obsidian fortress looking for opponents and foes to engage. Most of us did not know where he was (a couple with True Sight were able to spot him occasionlly).
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Ben Webster
Warrior
204 Posts
Brisbane, Australia
| | 11/21/2005 10:32 PM |
| Thanks for the help everyone. I think the player got a little excited using an ability his level did not yet have.
The point about grappling being in the same square as the grappler. Will have to read more on that. You wouldn't be able to appear in someone else's square with the ethereal ability.
Cheers,
Ben. | |
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