| | You are not authorized to post a reply. |
| | Author | Messages | |
dagonet
Sergeant
442 Posts
    
 | | 07/12/2006 11:49 PM |
|
Now, halfings have been around pretty much since the beginning of D&D, since you can't have a fantasy roleplayng experience without at least the possibility of a few hobbits running around. It occurred to me a few weeks ago, though, that I don't think there's been a PC race which the designers (TSR/Wizards) have tried harder to make enticing to the players. Is there any other race which has gotten such wildly varying treatment in different campaign settings?
In Dark Sun, halflings are the prototypical race, creators of a utopia whose dissolution gave rise to everything (and everyone) else.
In Birthright, they're like quasi-fey, able to slip in and out of a scary half-world which no one would dare follow them into (if they even could).
In 3E, we have simple bribery: +1 luck bonus to all saving throws.
And in Eberron, halflings have the totally Hobbit-ish Dragonmark of Hospitality *AND* get to ride dinosaurs. "Come into my comfy home for some tea," says Bilbo, right before Frodo's velociraptor rips your head off. =)
For all of you grognards out there, has D&D gone through any other contortions to make halflings appealing? I halfway expect for someone to tell me that the Dark Powers from Ravenloft are actually halfling vampires. . .
For all of you players, do *you* find halflings appealing? Have you played one? Did you like it?
Cheers,
Dagonet
| |
"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people."
Champion of Kyuss and his Servants of Squishy Doom | |
|
Wayne
Underboss
1371 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 12:57 AM |
| Speaking personally, I don't find halflings appealing. I wasn't fond of "hobbitish" halflings -- one or two adventuresome hobbits makes a story, but 23,000 blows the racial profile out of the water -- and I don't think 3.5 halflings, even with Races of Destiny, have enough of a "hook" to start from.
I do like Eberron's half-civilized dinosaur riders, though, I must admit.That's a hook. | |
Jeff "Wayne Laredo" Wilder | Email | Have/Want List | Trade Policies | Are You an Ethical Trader?
| |
|
gss_000
Commander
3204 Posts
Baltimore, MD
| | 07/13/2006 1:01 AM |
| I actually never have. Part of this is personnaly I have a hard time not being a human in D&D. Ther benefits are geneally too good for me to give up. But for non-humans, they are very low on my list since a) they are small and b) I just don't like them. Their flavor just isn't appealing to me when I try to build characters. I feel their schticks pale when compared to dwarves and elves, not to mention some of the newer races. But that's just me and I know people who love to play them.
| |
Completed trades: blackthorne, Drakkengi,Thorgrin, Ironfist Boulderbender x2, ckissee, nasamonkey, Username, Star, Ace13 x3, emontedodger x2, Drconveyor, church, Joeyb, Sir Bozak The Damned, Xeromod, the other guy x2, Qucalion of Celene, Dagaron x2, berus316, qillan_dvra, AshloreDarkShadow
For further info go to My Reference Thread and Trade Interface
Champion of Radiant Sevant | |
|
mordulin
Skirmisher
37 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 8:53 AM |
| | I have played a halfing on a few occasions, as it stands my two favorites were my halfling cleric of Brandibaris in a Forgotten Realms game of my friends named Lyle Highhill, he was a blast because everyone was so worried that I would steal any treasure we came upon I could speed the down time between rooms in a dungeon crawl thus keeping it fast paced and exciting. (Mind you I had no intention of stealing anything its just I mentioned looting a dwarven tomb we were exploring in an earlier adventure and the two dwarves in the party took offense, thus their distrust. Personally I was bored and they took to long agonizing over the smallest details of the rooms we were in so I decided I'd "scout" ahead.) My second favorite halfling, was a paladin in Eberron. Something about having a dinosaur as your mount just made him so cool and fun to play. | |
| |
|
orcmonk220
Underboss
1608 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 9:36 AM |
| | I think that, if you're not interested in Rogues, there is no reason to play a Halfling. | |
My Trading Thread | |
|
MechaKingGhidra
Sergeant
632 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 1:42 PM |
| I've played a Halfling Sorcerer before and it was pretty darn fun. The party level was 8 before, unfortunately, the DM ran out of steam to make his ideas interesting(what he thought of as interesting, anyway, because pretty much all of us did not become indifferent, let alone bored with the campaign) and let someone else be DM and started a whole new game. But before that happened, I had a penchant for being incredibly lucky as my companions always literally threw me out into the open to see if there was any danger(no one was a rogue and I always lost grapple checks against the dwarf barbarian in our group) and not once did I get hurt by traps or "sniper" ranged attacks. Fortunately, I maxed out on save-increasing material(feats, spells, ability scores) and AC boosters to let myself have a fair 24 to hit(mage armor and shield are my two favourite defensive spells). I basically was the lucky tank that made enemies waste resources and give away their positions. The only times I was ever seriously injured was when I was forced to cross an underground bridge that went over an underground river and the typical running to get to the other side dealie happened and I wasn't fast enough and was a Kraken's plaything. But I'm sure what happened next was serious sympathy on the DMs part as I had a fully charged wand of magic missile and the Kraken grabbed it out of my hand with one of its many tentacles while it was crushing me and broke it and all of the charges emerged and hit the Kraken, my group and the stalactites(spelling?) of the cave of which we were in and they came down in great numbers and killed the Kraken. Never abuse a halfling. This is what you get: a very ticked off player(who's the only spellcaster in the group and won't be so willing to let players make use of his invisibility spells the next time a flock of Elder Arrowhawks passes overhead), the entire party but the halfling nearly dead, and the most fearful thing of all: a DM who has more than enough leverage to justify making sure a player isn't picked on because he is essentially helpless due to the fact he won't retaliate and sticks by his morals and ethics. All in all, a happy ending(for me, anyway).[:D]
But just to be on the safe side in the future, I've been playing Human Sorcerers/Fighters(start out with 2 levels of Fighter to make sure I don't die so easily and then add nothing but Sorcerer levels from there on in) now. I would be a Dwarf but the Charisma penalty is more than enough to make me look the other way. | |
Champion of the Prismatic Golem
MechaKingGhidra: Infamous for his absolute despisement of Red Dragons and devout worshipper of all Black Dragons. | |
|
scruffydude7
Underboss
1196 Posts
Rock Hill, SC
| | 07/13/2006 2:51 PM |
| I have played Halflings before, and I like them as a race...I just don't like the 3.5 edition version of them(at least in the default campaign setting). My group pretty much uses the oldschool plump, curly haired, barefooted halfling as the model for their society, culture and appearance. We pretty much leave the racial bonuses alone though.
As a DM, I use plenty of them as NPCs, and I don't think the game would be the same without them.
I wouldn't hesitate to play a halfling PC again, but I have a lot of character ideas I would rather play first. It's been a while since I have played D&D as a PC.
If you ask me, the only thing that makes Halflings less appealing is that WotC tries so hard to make them interesting that they destroyed the classic Halfling. I don't mind different takes on Halflings in different campaign settings, but I like the classic, Tolkien-esque ones best. | |
Champion of the Revenant
Knight of the Elf Duskblade
Complete Trades: Oni, Kidkach, Melrune, callidusx3 | |
|
orcdoubleax
Sergeant
694 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 3:22 PM |
| this is going to sound silly , but it is true.
A lot of guys don't play halflings because sub-conciously they don't want to be 3 ft high and weak. Most people have some insecurities within themselves somewhere and playing a halfling is a little emascalating. (sp?)
I told you it would sound silly.
I stand behind it being true. | |
Yes I am Gelatinous.
www.gelatinousdudes.com
| |
|
kyrin
Commander
3168 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 3:51 PM |
| In a game that rewards moving fast and hitting hard, halflings do neither. Now if you could add your DEX modifier to damage with a light weapon or something, of if high dex actually made you faster and more maneuverable, halfling swashbucklers might be more common. As it is, meh.
JIM
aka kyrin | |
My Have/Want List <-|-|->My Trades and References 1 <-|-|->My Trades and References 2
Pronounce "Drow" like "crow"! Viva la Revolution! We Shall Overcome!
Vindicated Champion of the Stirge! Vindicated Champion of the Githyanki Knight on Red Dragon!!
Vindicated Champion of the Androsphinx! | |
|
Rising Dragon
Sneak
91 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 4:23 PM |
| | My Halfling wizards to this day is one the most funniest character I ever played, also was the character I ended up playing the longest. My friend and just as much fun playing a Halfling rogue. He had flaw that required him to make a will save not to steal stuff that he thought was valuable, but wasn’t really that much of flaw when voluntarily failed it all the time. [:D] | |
My webcomic: http://www.sentimentalhorde.com Bringing world peace by conquering on nation at time! | |
|
mordulin
Skirmisher
37 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 4:24 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by kyrin
In a game that rewards moving fast and hitting hard, halflings do neither. Now if you could add your DEX modifier to damage with a light weapon or something, of if high dex actually made you faster and more maneuverable, halfling swashbucklers might be more common. As it is, meh.
JIM
aka kyrin
Actually thanks to PHB2 we can at least add half the Dex bonus to the
damage of a crossbow, and my DM houseruled that you add your Dex. to the damage of a sling. | |
| |
| 
zenthrus
Warlord
5081 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/13/2006 4:26 PM |
| Haflings are exceptional from a number-crunching perspective. Unfortunately, it's really hard to beat a free feat plus bonus skill points, which is why I play human 90% of the time. I actually see more gnome PCs than halfling PCs (or any other non-human race).
When DMing, I use halflings in a variety of ways. I try not to pigeonhole their concept, so there will be tough-guy thugs, kender-like kleptos, tolkein-esque fat hobbitses, etc. | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
Have/Want List
Trade References | |
|
kyrin
Commander
3168 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 7:18 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by zenthrus
Haflings are exceptional from a number-crunching perspective. Unfortunately, it's really hard to beat a free feat plus bonus skill points, which is why I play human 90% of the time.
Exactamundo. I think 3.x went a wee bit overboard. We've gone from almost no-one wanting to play humans to almost all-human parties. At least that's the transformation I've seen in our games. Demi-humans have become a kind of novelty act. Kinda overshot the goal, there.
And the poor hobbitses become third-class citizens. [:(]
JIM
aka kyrin | |
My Have/Want List <-|-|->My Trades and References 1 <-|-|->My Trades and References 2
Pronounce "Drow" like "crow"! Viva la Revolution! We Shall Overcome!
Vindicated Champion of the Stirge! Vindicated Champion of the Githyanki Knight on Red Dragon!!
Vindicated Champion of the Androsphinx! | |
|
zenthrus
Warlord
5081 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/13/2006 7:25 PM |
| | Humans are even more insanely good if you allow the racial levels from Unearthed Arcana. Yikes! [:O] | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
Have/Want List
Trade References | |
|
IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 7:35 PM |
| Kyrin is right on the nose. The 2 big problems with halflings are speed 20 and lowered weapon die size.
Dwarves get away with speed 20 because a) the rest of their stats are so freaking great and b) they stay speed 20 in heavy armor and thus basically lose nothing as a cleric or fighter.
Halflings, on the other hand, are built as rogues - but it is pretty annoying to be a rogue who can only tumble 10 feet before making a melee attack. Having a speed of 20 in general makes it much harder to maneuver for sneak attacks, etc - and when you can't make it to a good spot, what happens? An attack with a d4 rapier and you have a -2 strength penalty. Not tasty.
I do play a halfling, but only as a 100% spellcasting/music focused bard - and I still end up wishing I had made a human sometimes, just so I could maybe have a chance at taking out some annoying level 1 warrior with less than 3 swings. [:p] | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
|
IanB
Commander
3112 Posts
| | 07/13/2006 7:37 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by kyrin
quote:
Originally posted by zenthrus
Haflings are exceptional from a number-crunching perspective. Unfortunately, it's really hard to beat a free feat plus bonus skill points, which is why I play human 90% of the time.
Exactamundo. I think 3.x went a wee bit overboard. We've gone from almost no-one wanting to play humans to almost all-human parties. At least that's the transformation I've seen in our games. Demi-humans have become a kind of novelty act. Kinda overshot the goal, there.
And the poor hobbitses become third-class citizens. [:(]
JIM
aka kyrin
Well, in most published settings at least, demihumans as a novelty act is more or less how it should be - there are more humans than everything else combined, usually.
Seems like FR books still suffer from the adventuring zoo problem if you ask me, though. I like to keep the races available to a number somewhere under 50, personally. | |
Anson on WotC boards | |
|
zenthrus
Warlord
5081 Posts
SLC, UT
| | 07/13/2006 8:00 PM |
| Best build I've seen for halflings is Barbarian. Don't laugh too hard until you've tried it. Barbarian's speed increase negates the speed problem and Rage balances out the Strength penalty. Since Barbarians are restricted in their armor selection, the bonus to Dex and size bonus to AC are substantial. Mixing Barbarian and Rogue levels can yield interesting results as well.
Alternately, try a halfling Monk. Similar to the Barbarian build in a lot of respects. | |
Knight Warlord a.k.a. Commander (#32) in only 6 months. Where's my pie?
Champion of Dwarven Thunderlashers
Knight of the Large Dire Chicken
Have/Want List
Trade References | |
|
kyrin
Commander
3168 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 12:22 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by zenthrus
Best build I've seen for halflings is Barbarian. Don't laugh too hard until you've tried it. Barbarian's speed increase negates the speed problem and Rage balances out the Strength penalty. Since Barbarians are restricted in their armor selection, the bonus to Dex and size bonus to AC are substantial. Mixing Barbarian and Rogue levels can yield interesting results as well.
Alternately, try a halfling Monk. Similar to the Barbarian build in a lot of respects.
But you've still got to deal with smaller weapons. Although I guess there's not that much diff between a d10 Greataxe and a d12 one...
An interesting idea.
JIM
aka kyrin | |
My Have/Want List <-|-|->My Trades and References 1 <-|-|->My Trades and References 2
Pronounce "Drow" like "crow"! Viva la Revolution! We Shall Overcome!
Vindicated Champion of the Stirge! Vindicated Champion of the Githyanki Knight on Red Dragon!!
Vindicated Champion of the Androsphinx! | |
|
delguidance
Sergeant
394 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 12:42 AM |
| Consider your audience. DDM players often come from those who like the number crunching side of D&D.
Most of the criticisms of halflings here are about how weak they are. Though that does ignore the benefit of playing a 1/2ling wizard and being harder.
Most of the praise of halflings is that they are fun and unforgetable to play. They make for good characters as in a good addition to a story.
People game for different reasons. I like a good story. Also halflings rule thou fobbing swag-bellied flax-wenches. Now go away or I will taunt you a second time. | |
| |
|
Goldmoon
Sergeant
986 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 10:43 AM |
| quote:
Originally posted by Wayne
I do like Eberron's half-civilized dinosaur riders, though, I must admit.That's a hook.
Im surprise nobody mention outrider[:0]. Before Eberron, mine PC was an outrider and I named my K9 Dido[:p]
With ride by attack and long spear/lance, he is good at irritating my DM. Sending his creatures into the path of my friend cleaving axe.
| |
"HA! Activate take 10 and you cant hit me."
"Once I start, I will not flater."
"BLOOD make the grass grow!" | |
| Knight of Argenis
Corim Danex
Warlord
6802 Posts
West Valley City, Utah
| | 07/14/2006 1:19 PM |
| I like halflings. I end up avoiding them and gnomes because their damage and speed are so pitiful.
Hobbits weren't particularly slow. I think the speed being slower rule doesn't make a lot of sense (at least with the halfling) because they were fast moving on thier little stubby legs. Their dexterity counteracted their smaller legs.
I don't like the speed for small creatures being 20 in D&D 3.X. I also don't like that weapons do less damage, even though that part makes some sense. | |
"Look to God and live." Alma 37:47
Vindicated Champ of Hippogriff (Arcadian Hippogriff) and Uncommon Horse | |
|
Benimoto
Underboss
1125 Posts
| | 07/14/2006 2:07 PM |
| quote:
Originally posted by zenthrus
Best build I've seen for halflings is Barbarian. Don't laugh too hard until you've tried it. Barbarian's speed increase negates the speed problem and Rage balances out the Strength penalty. Since Barbarians are restricted in their armor selection, the bonus to Dex and size bonus to AC are substantial. Mixing Barbarian and Rogue levels can yield interesting results as well.
Alternately, try a halfling Monk. Similar to the Barbarian build in a lot of respects.
I'm playing a halfling barbarian/rogue in Living Greyhawk, and it's working fine. Crunching the numbers, halflings lose str, but that's partially made up for by the +1 to hit for being small. And the difference between almost any medium-sized weapon and a large one is an average of 1 point. So, my halfling barbarian loses out on 2 damage (sort of 2.5). Big deal. There's enough interesting feats or other things that have to do with size to make up for it. | |
Champion of the Rakshasa. Check out my Mini Terrain Maker, or my new Dungeon Map Maker (under development). | |
|
orcmonk220
Underboss
1608 Posts
| |
| | You are not authorized to post a reply. |
|
| |
ActiveForums 3.7 | You must be signed in to participate in the
games. |