The Dreamblade tournements at my FLGS had more of a turn out in the first few weeks than DDm ever had. Im pretty sure the games gonna last, its fast and fun, and ive spent more on it than AAM and heroclix and mage knight, and more than i have on magic in the past two years.

I say Dreamblade will live on! Lest Wotc ruin it but, theyve had a lot of practice, so i trust thier judgement.

[QUOTE]illiniskippy wrote
I think it is going to have some serious legs.  I am a store owner and I could not give hecatomb away.  Almost everyone I have demoed the game to has ended up buying a starter and at least one booster.

Most of the people were very against Collectible games.  They tried it because I said it had good game play and after one game they were hooked. 


[/QUOTE]

Same experience here. We've gone through two shipments of boosters and starters since it came out, while we never even sold a whole box of Hecatomb. There are people playing this game in our store all the time every day, and the most interesting thing to me is how it crosses over the usual gamer lines-- Magic players, 40K players, RPGA, boardgamers- everyone is playing this game- including some non-gamers spouses and boy/girl friends. Wizards developers really did their homework regarding what works for a game. 

[QUOTE]Kunimatyu wrote
HAH! I was talking to one of the Lost Goblin guys a few months ago re: Horrorclix vs. Dreamblade, and he was dissing DB and saying the store was going to push HC. I can't help but wonder if things have changed. :)[/QUOTE]

I hope there's another store out there called Lost Goblin (well not really), because  at mine we don't "diss" any game. For the record, #1 the two games aren't in competition, we always planned to carry both,  #2 we didn't know jack squat about Dreamblade until we got our demo kit a month or so ago, so "a few months ago" all we knew was it was a minis game from WOTC; maybe you all have known more about it earlier but we didn't, and  #3 nothing has changed- we still think Horrorclix is going to be a good game and revitalize the Clix play in this area (which has been a little lean for some time now). Dreamblade simply has broader appeal and therefore sells better.

Being a store owner myself (recently), I suspect its more an understanding of the local market.

Outside of the internet many stores have a local market and a smaller extended market. Selling product to gamers is not difficult if the game works, but they have only so much cash available. In a practical sense HC or DB matters not a huge amount as far as competing for which is the best goes. What does matter is that the locals will spend the same money on whichever they choose, so if the locals go for DB it would be foolish to understock it and try to sell them HC. Net result of that approach is them buying DB somewhere else and you having HC on your shelves.

Having said all of that I think the two are different markets.

HC is your Yu-Gi-OH / Pokemon crowd for the most part.

DB is the slightly older MTG / DDM crowd, for the most part. I expect DB to be around for a good few years, just wait for someone to design a Hologramatic Projection Unit for it and then you really will be getting Virtual Boosters

HC is your Yu-Gi-OH / Pokemon crowd for the most part.[/QUOTE]

Huh!! That explains a lot about our low Clix sales- we don't even carry YuGiOh or Pokemon because there is absolutely no call for it. Much older crowd. We have a small base of Clix players who are very loyal to the game, and we steer the little kids to it who come in with their dads looking for something they can do together, but other than that it's kind of the red-headed stepchild of the store. Dreamblade has so far found players among RPG, 40K, wargame minis, Magic, and boardgame players- in other words everyone else (so maybe it is a competition, albeit a really unbalanced one).

Ok just made an account up to point out a few observations.

Yes, there will be people who play just for the money. In the long run this will die out - how long can they throw money at people to get them to play?

There is next to NO international interest in DB - simply becasue there is next to no support for international players. While Australia might be a smaller gaming community I would like to point out that a) only ONE store in my state even stock DB (and they were told by WotC to do so). b) In the time it has been on sale they have sold ONE starter and no boosters. While this may take off in the US it will flop like a dying whale everywhere else in the world.

I think they made a few fundamental flaws:

• It is not associated to any existing fan base. (Such as existing novels, TV, movies, etc.)
• It relies HEAVILY on luck of the dice, even more so than DDM in my opinion. Thus you might as well play craps for all the skill required.

Why didn't they simply use the Magic artwork and figures - I know I'd have bought the stuff just to get an Inkeyes or some of the Angels in magic.

Oh well just my opinion, thought I'd point out that while it *might* do well in the US it *will* flop overseas unless they change their current stance on tournaments.

Well, not one starter or booster has sold at my local store in Toronto, Canada.

They sell all ranges of mini games and trading card games...

I might buy some if I get a "deal" on the game but at the moment I am staying away from "another" collectible mini game...

ArrOOoo, Reddog

Well, not one starter or booster has sold at my local store in Toronto, Canada.

They sell all ranges of mini games and trading card games...

I might buy some if I get a "deal" on the game but at the moment I am staying away from "another" collectible mini game...

ArrOOoo, Reddog

[/QUOTE]

Are they doing any demos? Is the game out for an easy "Let me show you this new game real quick" or did they just put it up on the shelf and wait to see what would happen? This game does not sell itself- it has to be sold-  but nearly everyone in our store who has seen it played has picked up a starter at least.

I wish the collectibility wasn't seen as such a big issue, because unlike some games where you have to find certain cards/pieces just in order to be competitive, you can play with what you get in a starter, and maybe a couple of boosters. If you're just playing for fun, the collectible aspect is fairly easily ignored. If you like the figures and want them all, or want to play for huge money (and even so, you can buy the ones you want as singles- you don't have to buy cases of boosters to find them) you'll probably buy more, but it's a choice, not a requirement.

Are they doing any demos? Is the game out for an easy "Let me show you this new game real quick" or did they just put it up on the shelf and wait to see what would happen? This game does not sell itself- it has to be sold-  but nearly everyone in our store who has seen it played has picked up a starter at least.

Are they doing any demos? Is the game out for an easy "Let me show you this new game real quick" or did they just put it up on the shelf and wait to see what would happen? This game does not sell itself- it has to be sold-  but nearly everyone in our store who has seen it played has picked up a starter at least.

[/QUOTE]

Yep , you are right! They are more about the selling than the playing. The owners are NOT gamers and they don't promote their games (though they do have 2 gaming tables in the store).

They are primarily a comics and cards store though they do sell the latest in game releases. They'd not be against someone else (customer or employee) running games but out of their two employee's only one games and it is primarily magic and rpg's...

ArrOOoo, Reddog

That is the problem.

So far I've had a starter purchased after about 85% of my demos, the owners have had similar numbers. I've never had a success rate like that with DDM or SWM. More importantly, it is easier to demo (and learn) than any of the other WotC mini games. Currently my FLGS is SOLD OUT of Dreamblade, both starters and boosters. Demos will sell the game. A SINGLE demo will sell the game, period. Collectiability is less an issue since (almost) everything is playable (or at least fun). This game is NOT going away and nothing short of Hasbro/WotC bankruptcy would convince me otherwise.

Robin makes a great point, Everyone is playing at my location. Everyone, the Card players, the RPGers, the Wargamers, the skirmishers heck even the boardgamers and a few of the (strait)modelers are playing. This game is like GOLF, it takes 5 minutes to learn and forever to master, it really is plasticrack.

Seriously, if you learn it, demo it, and promote it, you will have plenty of people to play with. It's the best game I've played in YEARS.

And no I don't get reimbursed by anyone to promote it.

I have to say that I love the game.  It is interesting and fun and layered enough that it will take a long time to master it. 

However, I am not entirely sure that you *need* to sink a whole lot of money into it to play.  for something like DDM, you really have to invest a lot of money to get all the minis that you need to compete.  Dreamblade seems like it has some fairly interchangable pieces so far.  You don't have the kind exclusive abilities that DDM has.  For example, if you want Grant Move Action in your warband, you will NEED the ONE (two kindof) mini that they have made over the last 3 years.  GOOD LUCK!  This doesn't seem to be as big of a problem for Dreamblade.

This means that many people will play for a long time, but I doubt that it will sell well in the future.  Certainly not by the case.  People will buy the singles that they need.  They can't ever use more than 3 either.  There will be no "Stirge" figure that people want 10-20 of. 

Great game.  Won't be around for too long.

Neist,

I've not visited any of the OKC-area stores since GenCon.  Over the last few weeks I've made the rounds again to the Stillwater and Tulsa stores, and this week I'm doing the same in Arkansas.  I'll be sure to stop in again at Games HQ as soon as I can.  I'm glad to hear there's some interest there for Dreamblade, because it's dead in the water everywhere else.

If you play D&D Minis, the state's only Blood War pre-release will be held at Distraction Games in Stillwater.  D&D Minis are big there, and the competition is tough.  Just ask Jason Cook, who usually fares pretty well in Stillwater.

www.distractiongames.com

See you there,

Lance

Yes, of course it has very different rules, but alas, it's one more collectable miniatures game on the shelves next to HeroClix, DDM, SWM, and at least half a dozen others.  The fact that the mechanics are different doesn't put it in the same category as Magic as far as "revolutionary" is concerned.

To clarify, all the CCGs that exist today, from DuelMasters to Battlestar Galactica and all points in beween, are present and accounted for because of Magic: The Gathering.  MtG set the stage, and everyone else is but a player upon that stage.

Well, these days collectable minis games are seeing fairly robust sales, and every few months we have a new player entering the field.  One of the most recent is Dreamblade.  Is it unique?  Well, of course.  That's why I like it.  But has it altered the landscape of the market?  Not really.  At present, the most remarkable thing about it is the fantastic financial rewards to be had at its tournaments.  We all wish DDM offered such cash prizes!  Who here does not?

I hope Dreamblade succeeds.  I'm a Delegate, and it's my pleasure and my duty to demo these games and help them flourish.  But so far, the reception it has received has been spotty.  I still stand by my statement that its primary weakness lies in the fact that it is isn't recognizable outside its own parameters.